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Nokta Impact All Metal Modes - Just What Are They Exactly?


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What caught my eye in this Video of Keith's is the special All Metal mode that has somewhat of an audible discrimination ability.. I was not that excited about this detector until I saw this.  Could be a very powerful tool the no other detector has that I know of. 

I think he called it the  General D mode  iron actually low tones in All Metal Mode.

I would like to hear your opinion of it Steve. 

Bryan

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It may be an audio mixed mode. Nautilus, MXT, and V3i have a mixed mode, but they all implement a bit differently. It is a powerful feature and quite rare.

Audio mixed mode is when you have the all metal and disc channels each delivering an audio response at the same time. In some implementations one response overrides/alternates with the other. In other implementations a stereo channel is used, running each channel in a different ear.

Much more common is to run all metal audio with a metered disc response.

http://www.detectorprospector.com/gold-prospecting-guides/steves-guide-metal-detector-mixed-modes.htm

There is however a possibility the Impact "all metal" modes are simply disc modes that have been set up to emulate/sound like an all metal mode. I will have to do some testing to try and determine exactly what is going on there. The key is a true all metal mode will reach deeper than the disc channel so in a true mixed mode the all metal channel will signal beyond the disc channel.

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Steve Keith showed the mixed mode you are talking about but there was another All metal mode that was different.  Non ferrous targets give a nice zip zip like normal but a nail had kind of a duel tone type zip. Kind of reminds me of how a TDI works. 

Bryan

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Mixed mode is not about how it sounds. You can make things sound all sorts of ways. A disc mode has to employ phase shift and processing to get target information, and the fact that you can set the disc level and get tones on different targets indicates phase shift information is being processed. They are calling this an all metal mode when in fact it may be a two tone disc mode simply employing sounds you are not used to. VCO threshold type sounds.

I will do some experimenting tomorrow and report back.

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Thanks Steve. It will be interesting to see how it works at depth.  I have a site this would come in handy if it truly works.  Old coins start at 7" and go deeper from there. I am tapped out at 10" with my detectors. I have had some success hunting in All metal with other detectors but it's frustrating as you know. If you can discriminate out most iron I could dig everything else past 7" since there is no or very little aluminum past the first 7".  I could see where this could be good for larger nugget hunting too if it actually works at depth. 

Bryan

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You won't get something for nothing I am afraid. The Impact has a ton of modes but I do not expect it to accurately identify coins deeper than the best of what is already available. VLF had been tapped out for many years when it comes to max depth. Witness Toms efforts to try and get a clear edge on the F75 with the Impact.

I admit right now I do not know what the Gen and Gen (D) mode are doing exactly. I just did some bench testing. A classic mixed mode like the MXT will give tones to 90% of max depth, then switch to a mono tone for that last little bit as the all metal channel takes over. On most detectors, like an X-Terra for example, switching to disc mode cuts depth compared to the true all metal mode. On detectors with a metered disc while in all metal, you will get a blank screen on the deepest targets. All these reactions are because a true unfiltered all metal mode does deeper than a disc mode.

The Nokta Impact "all metal modes" deliver a tone difference as far as they reach. The catch is they appear to go no deeper than the other disc modes on the machine. At least in a quick air test. I have coin hunted in those modes and they worked great, but I did not do any close comparisons to see if they are any deeper. They may be VCO based disc modes that just sound like the all metal modes we are used to. If they can't get a target any deeper than, for instance, the Deep mode, then it is sort of a moot point.

The only way I may know for sure is to compare the Impact to something else that I know is using a true all metal mode tomorrow.

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The Impact looks to have some great capabilities but really I am only interested in that one All Metal Mode that Keith showcased in his video. If I understand it correctly and it works at depth it would be the only VLF that I know of that has this capability and I would buy it for that reason alone.  I crave depth more than separation... I want to pull dimes past 10 inches which is my current limit in my ground with my FBS detectors. 

Bryan

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Thanks Steve.  I had a feeling that might be the case that the All Metal mode is no deeper than the disc. modes.  The Gold Racer seems to be like that.  

Bryan

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I refuse to get too excited by VLF detectors when all the speculation over max depth gets going. They just are what they are and nothing is going to change as long as the underlying tech remains the same. I however admire any effort at all to experiment with different processing methods. A whole lot of this game is all about what sounds good and clicks for any given individual. Keith for instance rides the edge and hears nuance that others miss. Some people like a simple two tone. Some like full tones. Some like VCO, some do not. I honestly can go find good stuff with most any top end detector. Just give me the hours and I will put the coil over something good. What we have to find is a machine that feels good to us, and sounds good to us. The Impact has something for just about everyone in that regard. But I would not go getting very hopeful it is going to somehow break the VLF depth barrier.

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