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Sting Ray

Noise / Falsing While Hunting In Saltwater

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I have recently been using my Equinox 800 for saltwater hunting.  The obvious settings, Beach 2,  Iron off.  Since I am forced to a slower swing, I drop recovery speed to about 2-3 (4-5 on beach).   

I am forced to drop the sensitivity to 15 or below.   I have noticed the waves will cause signals and dips in the sand too.   This has become frustrating as I use a CTX-3030 and do not get nearly the false signals.   Any suggestions to try?

 

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No reason to dip your recovery speed simply because your swing speed is limited by coil drag, IMO.  The higher recovery speed helps limit ground noise that occurs due to the slower sweep speed.  Some detectors like Deus respond better with higher sweep speeds when using higher recovery/reactivity settings but I have found with Equinox you can get away with a slower sweep speed even with the higher recovery settings without target signal degradation.  Your mileage may vary, but give that a shot to see if you can lower falsing and ground feedback noise.

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Am I correct to believe that lowering the Sensitivity is necessary because of the waves and debris above & below the coil?    I've tried to noise cancel in the water and this slightly helped.

Thank you Chase Goldman

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18 minutes ago, Sting Ray said:

Am I correct to believe that lowering the Sensitivity is necessary because of the waves and debris above & below the coil?    I've tried to noise cancel in the water and this slightly helped.

Thank you Chase Goldman

Since far field electromagnetic signals (i.e., radio waves) that cause EMI are highly attenuated in water, noise cancel which finds the "clearest" channel with minimal RF EMI interference is only really effective if the coil and/or control head (the antennas that receive the RF interference into the detector circuits) remain above the water line.  So if the control head remains above the water line (even with the coil submerged) then noise cancel will be effective against EMI but it has no effect on wave action and debris causing falsing primarily to varying salinity levels - in that case you might want to try tracking ground balance as recommended on page 41 of the user guide:

"Tracking Ground Balance can also be useful when using Beach Mode 2 underwater at the beach (in salt water)."

HTH

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This thought that when the coil is moved slower you have to reduce recovery speed is a fallacy that keeps coming up. That’s backwards. If you reduce recovery speed you should probably slow down, but there is no reason to reduce recovery speed simply because you have slowed down. Do a complete reset, use Beach 2, do a frequency scan, and reduce the sensitivity until the machine is quiet. That’s it. Tracking would be a last resort for me.

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On 6/21/2019 at 12:33 PM, Steve Herschbach said:

This thought that when the coil is moved slower you have to reduce recovery speed is a fallacy that keeps coming up. That’s backwards. If you reduce recovery speed you should probably slow down, but there is no reason to reduce recovery speed simply because you have slowed down...

Steve

I probably should not have even mentioned I reduced the recovery speed.  My reason for lowering the speed in this case was I was searching for a lost ring in the water and was hoping to gain a little more depth to aid in finding the ring.

My main concern was the increased noise going from wet sand beach to underwater detecting.  I was getting more noise with display both in and out of water but always when coil was submerged.

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On 6/20/2019 at 12:56 PM, Sting Ray said:

I have recently been using my Equinox 800 for saltwater hunting.  The obvious settings, Beach 2,  Iron off.  Since I am forced to a slower swing, I drop recovery speed to about 2-3 (4-5 on beach).   

I am forced to drop the sensitivity to 15 or below.   I have noticed the waves will cause signals and dips in the sand too.   This has become frustrating as I use a CTX-3030 and do not get nearly the false signals.   Any suggestions to try?

 

I don't your location but, I've had the same problem. Tried low recovery speeds and didn't work well. I hunt the waterline and if a wave comes in and covers my coil I will have a falsing problem, til the water recedes. 

There's a trade off between recovery speed and depth, the faster recovery the less depth. But there are times when slow recovery speed is bad. Saltwater beach detecting is one of them.

 The default recovery speed in beach 2 is 6. Default sensitivity is 20. Minelab set that number for a reason, that is the optimum setting for the average salt water beach. A higher recovery setting allows the detector the react better to the changing conditions, which in turn allows you to increase sensitivity.

Also do ground balance at waterline. 

From Minelab manual:

"The default Ground Balance setting of 0 is recommended for Park, Field and Beach Modes because these locations typically have less mineralisation than goldfields. However, if the ground is generating many noise signals (and/ or the Sensitivity level is set very low), then using Auto Ground Balance is recommended. If the Auto Ground Balance process does not greatly reduce ground noise (due to highly mineralised ground or high salt levels), then repeat the Auto Ground Balance process by sweeping the coil from side-to-side, rather than the standard up-and-down motion."

Use higher recovery speeds 6,7,8 which will allow you to use higher sensitivity settings , 20-25, which can  offset your loss of depth from higher recovery speed.

 

 

 

 

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On ‎6‎/‎23‎/‎2019 at 12:57 AM, Deep1 said:

I don't your location but, I've had the same problem. Tried low recovery speeds and didn't work well. I hunt the waterline and if a wave comes in and covers my coil I will have a falsing problem, til the water recedes.

 

On ‎6‎/‎22‎/‎2019 at 7:21 PM, Sting Ray said:

My main concern was the increased noise going from wet sand beach to underwater detecting.  I was getting more noise with display both in and out of water but always when coil was submerged.

I am guessing both of you have read my saltwater report card a few topics below?  It is not just a "falsing" problem, but a significant lack of detection problem as well working in moving salt water. I had 100's of targets disappear when moving water was present, not to be heard again until the beach drained out.

During the times when water is moving on the beach slope it just seems the Nox is seriously crippled by this water wash. 

I am going to work harder in July to crack this problem. I highly suggest not progressing your movement on the beach until the water has drained off.   

If anyone thinks there is an answer, I am all ears!

Dave 

 

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Thought of you on this one, Dave, but it was kind of the opposite problem (too noisy vice too quiet and loss of depth).  A problem nevertheless in the surf.  Hope you have better news after July.  Otherwise, a different detector might be the answer, unfortunately.  

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Recovery speed...... i run at 4.   3 and below gives a unique sound from the salt water...... run it to fast along the bottom and you notice it especially with you coil slightly tilted.  It seems to be that same SWOOCH most detector give like the Xcal in PP when the water moves over the coil. 4 doesnt..... i assume because it give a bit shorter tone.   You arent going to silence this machine completely...... its sensitive.  A lot of that falsing i jumping to those lower digits so even disc mode .... unless you want to disc 1-6 is going to help.   The hotter you run the more it picks up shallow surface minerals/and salt in the sand out there.    The machine you are comparing it to is a very refine machine ..... even in the water.... thus the $2400 price tag.    You have to realize ... salt setting... reduced power in Beach 2... and turning things down a LOT makes the machine run smooth...... but may be a huge disadvantage.   What i did to try and silence it here is..... RS4, IB 2, 19 sensitivity (you may have more minerals than us), turned off threshold, turn down iron volume to 2...... i run AM, but disc would reduce iron more even.   I also run 50 tones..... which i prefer.   LESS tones might help....... but the key seems to be getting it to a tolerable level...... and still pick out the weak targets without loosing a lot of depth.  

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