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Cleaning Coin Finds -- An Incomplete Overview (long)


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The tale of two coins.  Several years ago at a park scrape in San Francisco I dug two Barber dimes from opposite sides of the park.  One was pretty dark, but a semi-key date, the other a common date, but it looked like it was dropped the day it was made (probably a 1906 SF earthquake camp drop shortly after the coin was minted).

I had some free ANACS gradings to use up and decided to send in both coins.  You can see how they graded them below, by their grading the 1906-S Barber dime is a $125-145 coin, and the 1892-S Barber dime is $275 coin based on their VF-35 grading, but they dinged it with "environmental damage" so I'd assume that would hold a similar demerit as cleaning.  Here's those coins side by side:

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At a Nevada stage stop I dug an 1860-S Liberty Seated Quarter, it's a very rare coin and I about fell over when I looked it up on PCGS:

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It was hardly circulated, but unfortunately as Gerry noted on his Nevada sites, many of these desert sites have heavy alkali soils that are not kind to silver or copper coins.  Even though on paper it was a valuable coin, I disliked the black crud alkali soil look and decided to preserve it.  I used a product called EZEST, and the salt minerals had penetrated the coin for so many years, that it took the better part of a week of soaking with multiple changes of the solution to get the black crud off.  I then used a silver foam to finish the job.  It came out about as good as could be expected.  I showed it to a coin collector, and he estimated that it would sell for around $3K in it's cleaned condition.  Sadly had it been dug at a park with soil that had been as kind to it as my 1906-S Barber dime, it would be a $30,000+ coin, but there's only so much one can do.

I've been fortunate over the years to find some nice semi-key date and key date coins.  Dug a 1916-D Mercury dime (the key date Mercury dime), and the two gold coins I dug were also good dates.

Earlier this year at a site I've been chipping away at for the past ten years,  finally produced a $1 gold coin, an 1856-S in beautiful condition, still has mint lustre so it would be a high grading coin, probably at least a 55:

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The first gold coin I dug a few years ago was an 1860-S $5 half eagle found at a Nevada stage stop, and it too is a good date and in good condition, probably would grade between a 40-55:

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The gold coins were only cleaned with water, no rubbing during or after they were dug, just rinsing with clean water with careful daubing to remove the soil.  Nice thing with gold is that in general it's not affected by the elements and will clean up nicely with gentle rinsing with water and daubing with a Q-tip or soft cotton cloth.

Keep in mind that I never sell any of my finds, so cleaning is only for personal enjoyment. 

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1 hour ago, Cal_Cobra said:

The tale of two coins.  Several years ago at a park scrape in San Francisco I dug two Barber dimes from opposite sides of the park.  One was pretty dark, but a semi-key date, the other a common date, but it looked like it was dropped the day it was made (probably a 1906 SF earthquake camp drop shortly after the coin was minted).

I had some free PCGS gradings to use up and decided to send in both coins.  You can see how they graded them below, by their grading the 1906-S Barber dime is a $125-145 coin, and the 1892-S Barber dime is $275 coin based on their VF-35 grading, but they dinged it with "environmental damage" so I'd assume that would hold a similar demerit as cleaning.

One piece of good news that I see -- they didn't degrade the 1906-S Barber dime.  So this is 'proof' that a coin can come out of the ground and not be labeled a problem coin.  I see that ANACS mentioned "scrached."  Was this something significant to your eye or just the 'usual' issues from spending a century surrounded by abrasive soil?

You are probably aware of the backhanded(?) practice of submitting a coin to grading services (even the same one...) multiple times until one gets a grade s/he likes.  It seems as though this technique can backfire if the most recent grading isn't the best -- you can't jump in a time machine and accept a previous grade.  I'm not recommending this practice since the cost of the service is a risk.  If you were going to sell it or put it up for auction then maybe, but you indicate you hang onto your finds.  I have to say that your photos show two attractive coins.

There is (at least in theory) a difference between coin investing and coin collecting.  Back before professional grading services it was more a "beauty in the eye of the beholder" situation than it is today, but a collector who isn't so concerned about his/her retirement account coins may still be interested in a detector find.

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

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9 hours ago, GB_Amateur said:

One piece of good news that I see -- they didn't degrade the 1906-S Barber dime.  So this is 'proof' that a coin can come out of the ground and not be labeled a problem coin.  I see that ANACS mentioned "scratched."  Was this something significant to your eye or just the 'usual' issues from spending a century surrounded by abrasive soil?

I think it was just from being in the soil for 100+ years, nothing that I did. 

At the end of the day, the odds are so stacked against you finding a valuable coin with the possibility of being graded without environmental damage or some other issue, it's really a wonder people even try, yet here we are 🙂 

 

9 hours ago, GB_Amateur said:

You are probably aware of the backhanded(?) practice of submitting a coin to grading services (even the same one...) multiple times until one gets a grade s/he likes.  It seems as though this technique can backfire if the most recent grading isn't the best -- you can't jump in a time machine and accept a previous grade.  I'm not recommending this practice since the cost of the service is a risk.  If you were going to sell it or put it up for auction then maybe, but you indicate you hang onto your finds.  I have to say that your photos show two attractive coins.

I've heard of this practice.  IMHO you'd have to have a potentially valuable coin to begin with, as it's not inexpensive to have coins graded, but you get to a point where only a few points difference in grading can make a substantial difference in value for higher grading coins.  My finds, and coins I've both found as well as collected over the years will stay put unless I were to fall on hard times, otherwise I guess my daughter will inherit them or perhaps they'll pay for her collect (I better start finding a lot more gold coins, college isn't cheap these days, I can only imagine what insane price tag it'll have in 15 years when she's of age to attend).

9 hours ago, GB_Amateur said:

There is (at least in theory) a difference between coin investing and coin collecting.  Back before professional grading services it was more a "beauty in the eye of the beholder" situation than it is today, but a collector who isn't so concerned about his/her retirement account coins may still be interested in a detector find.

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

Grading of all types of collectables has really changed the collector landscape, sports cards, comic books, just about anything can be graded these days, and has the potential to increase or decrease the value of collectables.  One of my detecting buddies sells his dug coins if they have any value.  He hits them with Ezest then flips them on fleabay, and typically does pretty well with them.  I've often wondered if anyone has tried to send them in for grading and received back a "cleaned" rating.  Heck I thought about selling all of my common dug silver recently with silver prices approaching $30/ounce, but I decided I'd rather enjoy the memories they'll serve up over my lifetime, which is to me more valuable than selling them for scrap.

HH,
Cal

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7 hours ago, Cal_Cobra said:

At the end of the day, the odds are so stacked against you finding a valuable coin with the possibility of being graded without environmental damage or some other issue, it's really a wonder people even try, yet here we are

It seems like the kiss-of-death to get a coin professionally graded as 'damaged' or even 'cleaned'.  At least you have the option of breaking it out of its 'sealed' holder and pretending it never got graded.  Of course your checkbook/cc record will remain a sore reminder.

7 hours ago, Cal_Cobra said:

One of my detecting buddies sells his dug coins if they have any value.  He hits them with Ezest then flips them on fleabay, and typically does pretty well with them.

Sounds like the way to go to access the collector (as opposed to investor) market.  As long as the seller shows accurate, high resolution photos in the Ebay ads, it's caveat emptor after that.  I have noticed that many sellers don't even bother advertising a non-certified grade.  Makes sense as grading (even professional) isn't an exact science and you don't want your sale contested by a remorseful buyer claiming you misrepresented the coin.  Smart collector-buyers can judge for themselves and probably don't trust non-certified grades anyway.

BTW, you (Cal_Cobra) probably are aware of this but other readers may not be.  There is a cable (and YouTube and other media?) shopping channel called Rare Collectibles TV.  From 8:00-11:00 in the evenings Tu-->Sat (in my Eastern time zone, anyway) they sell rare collectible coins, mostly certified, but not always.  About half are modern (like the 1 ozt issues of the last ~35 years) but they also have historic coins.  I'm not recommending them for investment (might or might not be a good idea, just like any investment product) but for educational value, I like a lot of the presentations.  Rick Tomaska is the main guy, with two associates also doing the hawking.  Tomaska is an award winning numismatic author and a member of the Professional Numismatics Guild, which is an exclusive 'club' you don't buy your way into.  Often they compare professional grading services populations (historic records that include all grading done by a particular service -- either NGC or PCGS which are the two main ones).

The one thing I disapprove of in their sales tactics is showing Ebay supposed 'comps' which are usually asking prices, not prices realized.  That's misleading, IMO.  But when they talk about history of the mint, the country, etc., that part is interesting to me.  And of course there's always the eye candy.  😁  If you're a channel surfer, you may want to take a peak now and then.  Watching an entire 3 hours, though -- you better be doing some multitasking (book or computer) because the hawking part is obviously tiresome.

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I've wondered this for a long time and decided its impossible but I'll pose the thought here :  Is there any reliable way to return the shine to nickle's and modern nickle/copper clad?

So far in this thread I've seen some pretty cool, and some common, methods of cleaning.  Most of my modern stuff I just tumble in fine sand for a bit to knock stuff off.  Anything of value is just tooth brush and tooth picks.  I like the ammonia formula~ I"ll have to try that.

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39 minutes ago, kac said:

Wonder if EZEST would work in an ultrasonic cleaner?

I can't see why not, but it could get pricey as Ezest isn't cheap IMO.

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Ya saw a gallon jug for $99. There is a jewelry cleaner on Contenti for 19 that handles gold and silver. Not sure how it handles copper and copper alloys. May have to shoot them a note.

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  • 5 months later...
On 1/3/2020 at 5:00 PM, GB_Amateur said:

Naptha can be bought at hardware stores.  It's similar to the hydrocarbons in gasoline, but gasoline also has other additives as most know.  Hexane is a purer form but otherwise similar.  If your remember, or even still have, cigarette ligher fuel (Ronsonol in the blue and yellow small rectangular can is a common brand), that is also just naptha.  So is 'White gas' or Coleman Lantern fuel.

 

I have always understood Naptha(also known as Stoddard"s Slovent) as a low flash solvent similar to common paint thinner. We use to use it by the 55 gallon drum in our shop to clean parts. White gasoline is Benzine, same as Coleman Lantern Fuel. Lighter fluid used to be Benzine. What you get now is Naptha. I use the Benzine in my lighters because it burns much cleaner.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_spirit

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petroleum_ether

Common petroleum based solvents (and other 'household' chemicals) have a lot of nicknames, and unfortunately they get all mixed up with regional usage.  Another thing that happens is that one chemical will get multiple names, as you point out.

I had never heard of benzine (with an 'i'), but fortunately Wikipedia has.

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