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Avoid Digging Aluminum Trash


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This is a very good video from XP Team USA about tips for avoiding aluminum trash. Can't wait to try some of these on my XP ORX

Jeff

 

 

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Good video. Might just keep my XP Orx.

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Hopefully your dirt is a lot less mineralized than mine. Some of the techniques outlined in the excellent video will probably only work in milder soil. Also, I use the Coin Fast program on the ORX to mimic the Hot program.

I tried some of these ideas out a few minutes ago at a nearby park and on shallower 4" or less trash targets and they work fairly well here. On deeper targets it is totally a crap shoot since every target reads 90 to 99 here. I dug a 6" pull tab and a 6" US nickel. Both read 94 to 99 in every possible detector swing direction. There was no elongation of the audio on the nickel but there was just enough on the pull tab for me to call it as "deeper" aluminum despite its numerical target ID. 

This up averaging is not necessarily a weakness of the ORX and the Deus here. Every single frequency detector will do that here.

The ORX is such a pleasure to swing and it is an outstanding gold prospecting detector.

Jeff

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3 hours ago, Jeff McClendon said:

This is a very good video from XP Team USA about tips for avoiding aluminum trash. Can't wait to try some of these on my XP ORX

 

 

54 minutes ago, Rick N. MI said:

Good video. Might just keep my XP Orx.

Just a couple of considerations for those using the ORX.

The Deus Hot program utilized in the video uses full tones which gives some of the telltale tonal nuances heard in the video.  Unfortunately, it is not available on the Orx which is limited to 3 tones, but some of the principles still apply (e.g., TID variability).  Note also that he was using an HF coil at 14 khz.  On Deus, the HF coil target ID's are not normalized.  On ORX, the HF coil target ID's are all normalized to 18 khz equivalent target IDs so the Target IDs in the video will not correspond to the target IDs you will see even if running the HF coil at 14 khz on the ORX.

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I did a ton of target ID testing with both the X35 and HF coils on my former Deus and on the ORX. Running the Deus with HF coil or the X35 coils at roughly 15.6 and 18 kHz, the target IDs were pretty close both in air tests and In the dirt around here. With the drastic up averaging on deeper targets, Full Tones was not much use since all the non-ferrous tones ended up  being between 800 and 933 Hz on targets at 4" or more. The ORX 3 tones is all I need out here. I don't mind hunting in 3 tones at all. It really simplifies things and good targets sound really strong and the up-averaged IDs are fairly steady even at depths of 6" or more. I can still hear enough of the audio elongation effect on most shallower aluminum to make an educated guess. If I ever live in a place with milder dirt I may reconsider getting a Deus especially if it gets an upgrade in the future. Otherwise, many of the audio features are wasted for the places I hunt.

 

Jeff

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My ground is mild. I haven't used Coin Fast mode but it makes sense for jewelry hunting. Targets won't be real deep. I'll have to bury some test targets to help learn. In northern Michigan I don't have a lot of areas to hunt. I've switched to water hunting. I want to try the Orx for jewelry hunting on land though. I have the 9" hf coil.

Does it matter what frequency is used? A high frequency would get a better hit on gold wouldn't it.

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3 minutes ago, Rick N. MI said:

Does it matter what frequency is used? A high frequency would get a better hit on gold wouldn't it.

Yes.  I would use 28Khz for gold/gold jewelry.  You can push it to the higher frequency (54 khz) for micro gold but your depth will suffer a little.

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With the HF 9" coil on the ORX I just find the quietest frequency around 31 or 54 kHz for micro gold jewelry which usually won't be very deep anyway. Small gold chains and earrings may have slightly jumpy numbers. The larger gold ring jewelry will sound fantastic and have really tight numbers on the ORX, similar to detecting a surface to 4" US nickel although the numbers may be different from a nickel.

Oops, sorry Chase, you already answered. My internet is super slow this time of day with the kids needing the internet for school.

Jeff

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One of these days I'm going to keep my mouth shut (err, fingers dormant) but at the same time I feel that's being dishonest.  So here I go again, but I'll start with some disclamiers:

1) Jeff, I respect your knowledge and your sharing of that as much as anyone who posts here.  Anyone.  I also appreciate your posting this video as I seem there are things I need to learn.  In that sense I give the video a plus.

2) I don't have any XP products.  However, there are enough positive things posted on this site that I'm confident the Deus and ORX are top performers.  I even consulted with one of you (Chase) privately when I was considering picking one up, but decided it wasn't enough of an improvement over the Minelab Equinox (as always, better at some things, not as good at others) and buying another detector to share time with one I'm still learning is more like treading water -- one more detector I haven't mastered -- that I'm better off currently putting all my attention on the Eqx.

OK, now I'll (again) play the little boy watching the King dance around in his underwear.  Let's review the hits shown in the video:

14 total -- one clad quarter (90's TID), one copper alloy Lincoln cent (right around 88-90 TID), one zinc penny (low 80's TID), ten pieces of various aluminum (square tabs, foil, can slaw).  I'll save the 'best' for last.

The goal of the video was stated to be distinguishing aluminum trash from gold rings.  The coins are up there where you almost never get gold.  No big deal there, and the detectorist never claimed there was.  Now here's a question -- how many aluminum trash targets do you typically detect in the course of finding a single gold ring?  I've seen estimates from 100 to 500, and I think I vaguely recall someone saying 1000.  The reality is there is way more trash in the ground than treasure, especially when the treasure is gold.

Let's say I go out and try the same experiment, except I'm going to call everything less than zinc penny (and above ferrous) aluminum trash, or even more non-descript -- non-gold.  What's the chances I dig 10 targets and all of them are non-gold?

Oh, but there at the end of the video he does find a gold ring!  Pretty impressive.  He goes through all the techniques he's been using and shows the signal is different than the others.  Then the deflating comment -- he found that ring two weeks prior.  So this was planted.  He knew all along while he was going over the target exactly what it was.  This isn't simply about bravado ("I can tell trash from treasure").  This is why scientists do double-blind experiments.  When they know the result they can easily fool themselves.

Summary:  apples to oranges, again.  Real aluminum trash and a planted ring.  I do appreciate his honesty in confessing he had dug this target previously.  He had me fooled.

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I can definitely relate to your post GB Amateur. In fact, I really wish he could have also just planted a US nickel or found one with his settings. That would have been a very helpful comparison too. 

The only reasons why I currently own an XP ORX are: first and most important two outstanding no-nonsense all metal modes= therefore outstanding gold prospecting detector; then comes extremely lightweight and packable, and distantly last.......for coin and jewelry hunting preferably in wide open athletic fields with sparse aluminum trash. In dense aluminum I pick a different detector.

 I totally get why Dave D. used a planted gold ring and I really appreciate XP doing this video. I have been begging them for one for months!

 

Jeff

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