Testing The New AQ

[CCadrin]

4 hours ago, Joe Beechnut OBN said:

I think it 's the discrimination side of the "AQ" that most want to see, from what I'm getting messages about from the VLF and MDT owners........ I know several MDT owners that are on the fence about the "AQ" ...But everyone has to remember, like you said Steve. It's still a PI...NO doubt the deepest water machine I know of....I do think live dig's where the Nox is going thru a trashy area and picking out a good target then the "AQ" hunter coming back thru the same area to see if they can nail them. That would be a true test, one I think the Nox may win...

Now the MDT owners are worried about if there machine can get the same depth on a target when the "AQ" is in the discriminate mods....that maybe close also...I did have something lined up on that compare but distance and circumstances are not going to allow it .

Far as the TDI BH,...close but the "AQ" is just too strong a machine for the TDI water machine.....ATX, now that is going to be interesting...as far as depth. I think Barry owns the ATX so a easy match up there. 

Over all I think it would be a great video opp for the "AQ"..to get some of these questions answered. But I might recommend the "AQ" owner having some time with his machine to learn the disc side before setting out against experienced competition..

Joe, I ran the MDT here up in Connecticut. Very difficult to quiet it down with our beaches. In the water, it ran quiet but i had to back off on the sensitivity which cost me some depth. The deepest machine so far in the water that I owned (Dual Field, Excal, Nox. Impact) is the Excal in pinpoint. With discrimination the MDT was ok and if I was lucky maybe an inch deeper than the Nox. As for wet sand the MDT was not smooth when you put sensitivity at 8 or 9, therefore when you ran it as a machine it was only as deep as a NOX. At least at my beaches, the MDT was not the best or the deepest. My hunting style may had something to do with it. 

[barryny]

6 hours ago, Steve Herschbach said:

Sounds like you've bought the hype already Barry  - good luck!

Nah....haven't bought anything yet (still waiting for my turn 😉) but always like to see performance for myself.  I was just bringing forward some more video of previous testing done...after you had mentioned about the sand conditions in Hawaii....the volcanic soil they used in the video sounded like similar stuff. 

I think the term he used "does not work" maybe got lost in the French to English translation...who knows?

Anyway, I do remember all the testing we did using the Blisstool and a couple of buckets of Culpeper red dirt LOL...trying to figure out if it would discriminate out the ground and the iron while still getting decent depth on non ferrous in those conditions...of course it never measured up to a well tuned PI being used by a well versed detectorist...

[Steve Herschbach]

2 hours ago, barryny said:

I think the term he used "does not work" maybe got lost in the French to English translation...who knows?

My bad! I thought you were saying the TDI "did not work" on volcanic soil, but you were referring to the video. My apologies Barry.

I'm being a bit of a hard ass on the AQ, but in all seriousness I think it is going to be the best beach PI ever made to date, once the final version is done. The rear power cable and dainty fittings on the current version simply are not suitable for serious face down work in shallow surf. Heck, I used to hold myself in place with my ATX by ramming the body into the sand! This version of the AQ is really a wading unit, not a rough and tumble surf machine. But with the new battery system, and the top notch performance, Fisher has a real winner here. I just have a knee jerk reaction against people thinking it is a magic wand. It is still a PI, and as long as people are realistic about that and understand it is not a VLF discrimination system, all will be well. But if somebody gets it thinking it is a CTX with PI depth... they will be disappointed. It is only with that aspect in mind that I keep tossing out my little caveats as I go.

My TDI prototype in Hawaii in 2007

[Badger-NH]

10 hours ago, Steve Herschbach said:

I just have a knee jerk reaction against people thinking it is a magic wand. It is still a PI, and as long as people are realistic about that and understand it is not a VLF discrimination system, all will be well. But if somebody gets it thinking it is a CTX with PI depth... they will be disappointed. It is only with that aspect in mind that I keep tossing out my little caveats as I go.

Being able to tell ferrous from non-ferrous by tone ID deeper than a VLF would definitely be a magic wand for me, but it's starting to sound like the AQ is not going to have that capability. We won't know for sure until someone actually tests it in tone/mute mode and does a review.

I am really liking what we've seen so far with the all metal performance though and will probably still buy one when the improved model eventually comes out just for that extreme depth.

[Steve Herschbach]

3 hours ago, Badger-NH said:

We won't know for sure until someone actually tests it in tone/mute mode and does a review.

I already hunted with it in tone mode and did a review. I added additional commentary in this thread. The answers are already there for those that want them, and I don’t expect any tests will change anything I wrote. Maybe it’s just not what people want to hear so the hope is more “tests” will change things. No, the AQ does not cleanly split all ferrous from all non-ferrous. It is a PI, it is not a VLF, and does not offer VLF type ferrous/non-ferrous discrimination. I can’t say it any more clearly than that.

[Carolina]

16 hours ago, CCadrin said:

Joe, I ran the MDT here up in Connecticut. Very difficult to quiet it down with our beaches. In the water, it ran quiet but i had to back off on the sensitivity which cost me some depth. The deepest machine so far in the water that I owned (Dual Field, Excal, Nox. Impact) is the Excal in pinpoint. With discrimination the MDT was ok and if I was lucky maybe an inch deeper than the Nox. As for wet sand the MDT was not smooth when you put sensitivity at 8 or 9, therefore when you ran it as a machine it was only as deep as a NOX. At least at my beaches, the MDT was not the best or the deepest. My hunting style may had something to do with it. 

It has been a learning experience on the MDT for me over a year and a half. I think your noise may have been due to the salt balance setting vs frequency used. Don’t be scared to run the salt on up higher as you enter more water. 35> 40 is not unheard of. Play with your black sand and one trick most don’t use is run sensitivity high say 9 but run your threshold at -9. Their are many combinations to try and I’m sure one will tame your beach. I hope Tom has an opportunity to use his not only in the gold field but also on the beach. If your Tarsacci runs quite on the dry and damp sand and you enter the water with chatter, your salt balance is off. Good luck with all your spins.

[barryny]

5 hours ago, Badger-NH said:

Being able to tell ferrous from non-ferrous by tone ID deeper than a VLF would definitely be a magic wand for me, but it's starting to sound like the AQ is not going to have that capability. We won't know for sure until someone actually tests it in tone/mute mode and does a review.

I am really liking what we've seen so far with the all metal performance though and will probably still buy one when the improved model eventually comes out just for that extreme depth.

Steve - If a faint signal is obtained and investigated while in All Metal, then by quickly scooping some sand (as easy as that really is vs. dirt digging) - maybe by taking a scoop or 2 off, then getting closer to that faint target and possibly identifying it at that point - that's what I'm really hoping for in terms of performance.  In the salt water beaches here...typically I have not come across many hair pins, there are few "rusty nails" and other bits of small iron...but bottle caps, bits of aluminum & stainless, sinkers, etc - yeah they are everywhere...

Just becoming aware of deep faint targets that the Nox/Excal passes over - that will open up many opportunities for the very old beaches here on the east coast...If I can knock out the higher conductors and avoid going another 2-3 scoops down - that will increase efficiency and overall detecting time....then for PI hunting as you have said - it could be the total package.

[CCadrin]

1 hour ago, Carolina said:

It has been a learning experience on the MDT for me over a year and a half. I think your noise may have been due to the salt balance setting vs frequency used. Don’t be scared to run the salt on up higher as you enter more water. 35> 40 is not unheard of. Play with your black sand and one trick most don’t use is run sensitivity high say 9 but run your threshold at -9. Their are many combinations to try and I’m sure one will tame your beach. I hope Tom has an opportunity to use his not only in the gold field but also on the beach. If your Tarsacci runs quite on the dry and damp sand and you enter the water with chatter, your salt balance is off. Good luck with all your spins.

Thank for the reply but I ended up selling it. I was running at the frequency at 9. In the water I was able to achieve a sensitivity of 7 or 8 and I can't remember how the threshold works but it was 3 or 4 digits from the highest setting. The more I adjusted the less depth I was getting so I ended up to running the Excal in pinpoint mode. I had better luck stablilzing the machine in the water. Out beaches here are packed with black sand and clay. Not like the ocean beaches of the Jersey or Florida coast.

 

[Badger-NH]

3 hours ago, Steve Herschbach said:

No, the AQ does not cleanly split all ferrous from all non-ferrous.

It's all LEJAG's fault for making those videos where the nails gave a low tone and the gold ring gave a high tone. I think that got a lot of peoples attention and made some believe that target ID in a PI might be possible.

I just noticed in the recent flyer that there is no mention of the AQ having any form of target ID except for iron which is only going to be in Tone and Mute modes. The question is, how useful are these modes?

[Willy]

Le Jag never implied that there was a target ID (VDI) on the Impulse AQ.

All the video sessions have shown the IRON REJECTION in one of the two disc modes; no more, no less.

Indeed, in TONE mode, a gold target gives a HIGH PITCH sound and ferrous target gives a LOW PITCH sound.

In MUTE mode, the ferrous targets give NO SOUND and non-ferrous targets give HIGH PITCH sound.
The only non-ferrous targets shown have always been GOLD JEWELRY , no coin of any type.

It is also what is specified on the 'flyer '