Equinox Software Update 3.0...

[Tom_in_CA]

4 minutes ago, Chase Goldman said:

Not seeing this at least not on this forum.  The general consensus (including my experience since loading V3) is that not much if anything has changed regarding EMI performance ...

 

Then I must have mis-read something.   You might be right.  I might  have been thinking of some poor reviews (yet that didn't have  to do with EMI).   And now that you mention it, I HAVE seen posts to the exact contrary (doh!).  That some people think it has HELPED with any zones vulnerable to EMI. 

 

In fact, that was one of our reasons to go out for a re-match, now that I think of it.   That:  Maybe this will clear up the chatter that seems to start by 7am on this inner-city-noisy street.   But to be safe, we started about 12:30am, so that there'd be no stone left un-turned.  But still ... a dismal failure 😞

[Bootyhunter]

20 hours ago, Tom_in_CA said:

Dan you say :  "...this was before the V3 update had come out."

I'm glad you added this final sentence to your paragraph.  Because for a moment, I thought you were going to try to say that this duel-result would-be-the-same, regardless.  But since you added that last sentence :  Then I'll hold-open the hope that my buddy's horrible results were the result  of  the V3.

But this doesn't solve the dispute/debate on whether or not he can spank an Explorer, with NO v3 update.  All we can do is for him to take off the v3, and do  a re-match.  But at this point, it's sort of pointless.  As we are both now assuming that this area, is *simply*  not suitable for the Nox, no matter WHAT the settings, and no matter WHO the user is.   If you disagree, and think the Nox can spank the Explorer II here, then  bring it up 🙂

And I  don't doubt your personal tallies improved when you made the switch.  But .... I'm not so sure that the SE is the same as the II.   They had differences, as you  know.

You say :  ".....So, your Explorer was purring like a kitten the whole time during your hunt? Not a hint of EMI? What sensitivity were you using on your Exp?

Yes.  Stable.  But I suspect there was interference below the audio level.  Because sometimes a 6" deep wheatie or silver was "tough signals". And as you know, 6" is a cake-walk for explorers of any incarnation.   But on the other hand, no, no audible chatter.   

My  sens. level on the II was 18.   I'm not sure if that corresponds with the scale of the SE pro or not.   

You say:  ".... At most of these sites I’ve been hunting with my Nox, I’ve managed to pull many more silvers/wheats."

With this quote, I can imagine my friend "pulling his hair out".  It is what I predicted that , sure as heck, someone (with the V3 update, no less) could/would say "You're not doing it right", or "you must have the wrong settings", and "you need more practice".   Trust me:  For a good 5 hrs he tried everything in the book.  And to the extent that he could make one of my signals come in, yet, that was the moment that when he went to swing anywhere else, a symphony of chatter, that is indistinguishable from the signal he just coaxed out of my flagged spot.   Doh !  

So you would NOT be able to convince him that ANY Nox user (not even the mighty Dan) is going to magically come by and get a totally different result.   I would love to see my friend's face, when he reads this quote of yours.  

You say :  ".... I doubt it...EMI is the variable!! It can be downright nasty at times, then somewhat manageable in the same area you’re hunting...."

This is true.  There are times, at certain sites, where even something like my Exp. II just suffers, for seemingly no  reason.   Then another trip, I get deepies that present no problems.  Thus, sure, it's *possible* that it was just a fluke  night.  Like where someone in a nearby apartment left their blender or router/transmitter on, or the Muni bus line was doing electrical upgrades, blah blah.  Who knows ?   But .... at what point does anyone eliminate this as an excuse  ?  3 trips ?  4 trips ?  10 trips ?  At SOME point, 2 people are going to  have to conclude :  "This machine sucks  here", and "This machine will not spank  an Exp. here".

Yes this is not representative of all turf.  It could be a fluke (and exist 100% of the time there).  So to  be fair, my friend and I know a park in nearby Oakland, which is flush  with  easy pickens.  Albeit just 1940s/50s wheaties/silver (ugly orange wheaties, and common newer silver).   Perhaps my friend would want  a rematch there.  And in my experience, this park more accurately mimics low-rise anytown-USA type turf.    But better yet:  Get your  duff up here !  haha

You say :  " .... Has there ever been a time at a site you’ve hunted where the EMI rendered your Explorer useless (even to you, being a master level Explorer hunter)? "

I've been in places where I suspected that I was "not in tune" with the place.  Like ... I can't  find  silver to  save my life.  Might be the machine  (the Emi) at levels below audible.  Or it could be my personal mood.   But @ a single location, a freak event happened at a relicky site :   I started getting chatter, no matter what settings I chose.   Thus I assumed I must  have a frayed chord.  I hiked back to the truck, and made some coil swaps.  But the problem continued.  So I thought:  "Must be in the sun-ray  probe connections".  So I hiked the long way again, and swapped out the probe.  TO NO AVAIL.   Thus yes, something had happened on that singular night, that never before , and never since then, has repeated itself in that spot.   

Hence, yes, I  know what you're saying.   But at the spot in question for this topic :  It's an ongoing thing.   And only got worse once he put the v3 on there.

 

Sounds like user error with the person running the Equinox. Ehh, depends on sites and what you are hunting for. I know for relic hunting in old iron and highly mineralized soils, the Equinox SMOKES fbs, fbs 2 and bbs machines. SMOKES THEM. No comparison, your mileage may vary in your conditions and what you are hunting for, to each his own, thats why there is a mirad of detector choices. I dont get into "x is the best detector over y" because y may be best for you while x is best for me. Too many variables, but Ive owned and mastered the Etrac, CTX, Excal 2, and the Equinox is hands down much better than all of those for my type of hunting in my sites. Again, to each his own. HH!

[Tom_in_CA]

3 hours ago, Bootyhunter said:

Sounds like user error with the person running the Equinox.

I love it.  I just love it.   I will point out this quote to my friend.  And chide him : "Tsk Tsk".   Just to watch him pull his hair out, haha

 

Ok  he will ask :  "Pray-tell :  What settings did I do wrong ? "   

 

Because, mind you, it's never the machine,  right ?  It's always the user, right ? 

[Bootyhunter]

2 hours ago, Tom_in_CA said:

I love it.  I just love it.   I will point out this quote to my friend.  And chide him : "Tsk Tsk".   Just to watch him pull his hair out, haha

 

Ok  he will ask :  "Pray-tell :  What settings did I do wrong ? "   

 

Because, mind you, it's never the machine,  right ?  It's always the user, right ? 

Not "always" but,  most of the time, and unless you were checking exact same targets with both machines then luck was and is always a factor. 

[steveg]

10 hours ago, Tom_in_CA said:

I love it.  I just love it.   I will point out this quote to my friend.  And chide him : "Tsk Tsk".   Just to watch him pull his hair out, haha

 

Ok  he will ask :  "Pray-tell :  What settings did I do wrong ? "   

 

Because, mind you, it's never the machine,  right ?  It's always the user, right ? 

Tom,

One thing I have heard anecdotally -- and I can't imagine how/why this could be the case -- but I've heard from a few folks that when they have installed one of the new EQX updates, they find the machine to suddenly be extremely unstable -- and so they end up doing a "restore" or "reset" back to original settings, and then re-installing the update, and then things work properly.  Based on what you are saying, I have to wonder if a "reset" and "reinstall" might be worth a try, on your buddy's machine.  What you describe, just does not sound normal.

Oh -- and one other thing -- he will NEVER "spank" you, if he has to keep his sensitivity down due EMI.  I know this is kind of obvious, but perhaps especially so with this machine.  While the EQX does quite well on "fairly deep" targets at lower sensitivity levels, sensitivity over 22 (I think that is the number) is where I believe NASA-Tom Dankowski has stated that the machine really begins to "shine," in terms of maximum depth (almost like a "boost" process, if I recall correctly?)  So, if he has EMI problems -- at that site, or any other that you hunt -- and he combats it by lowering sensitivity (which, of course, must be done sometimes to fight the EMI), then he'd be handicapped (since you are hunting only for the ultra, fringe-depth targets).  NOT that there's much else he could have done, but hunting a site where the EQX's sensitivity needs to be kept in the teens, is NOT a fair fight in terms of putting it up against FBS and hunting for the fringe-deep coins.  I rarely hunt the machine below 23 or 24 sensitivity, unless absolutely forced to, by EMI...since I too (as you know) spend a good bit of my detecting time hunting those "fringe depth" old coins that have been left behind by others...

Steve

[midalake]

9 hours ago, steveg said:

but I've heard from a few folks that when they have installed one of the new EQX updates, they find the machine to suddenly be extremely unstable -- and so they end up doing a "restore" or "reset" back to original settings, and then re-installing the update, and then things work properly. 

I have been saying this since update #1 !!!!!!!!!!   In which I installed it and my machine was unusable!   Did an uninstall and reinstall everything was great! 

Also do a FACTORY RESET before all installs.  [ya I know they say it is not necessary] 

[Tom_in_CA]

11 hours ago, steveg said:

.....  I have to wonder if a "reset" and "reinstall"...........

That's the ticket.   🤣   Another remedy that doesn't need to point to the machine vs another machine itself  🙂

 

But seriously :  I'm game for anything that can prove me wrong.  Because I'd certainly like the lighter  package, waterproof, etc....

[Tom_in_CA]

2 hours ago, midalake said:

I have been saying this since update #1 !!!!!!!!!!   In which I installed it and my machine was unusable!   Did an uninstall and reinstall everything was great! 

Also do a FACTORY RESET before all installs.  [ya I know they say it is not necessary] 

Yup.  My silly friend simply isn't done with all the steps.  It's not  the machine vs another machine.  It's "you didn't do it correctly".  Will love to see him reading this/these "outs".

 

As it turns  out,  my buddies and I are planning another trip to do some turf hunting in SF .  And they (both 800 fans) are simply saying that this particular *ss*kick spot will not be on the list of spots to try . DESPITE the oldies that are being porked out.  They are not interested in re-setting, re-installing.  They are contented and resolved that this is simply a spot where NO AMOUNT OF FIDDLING is ever going to allow the Nox to outhunt the Exp II.  

 

So now it appears we'll be off to other turf zones.   Ok, anyone care to guess the outcome ?   Ready to roll out the excuses ?  🤣

[steveg]

Tom,

I don't know why the "snark" is necessary, in your response my post; I was genuinely trying to be helpful for your friend, not "making excuses."  If there are install problems, that others have mentioned, where a glitch occurs (unstable machine after updating), and then a full factory reset and then re-install resolves the issue, I don't know why you'd imply that your friend would not appreciate the suggestion.  

I will say one last thing on this topic.  I have a test garden, that's been buried for 10 years now.  When I got the CTX, about 3 years ago, I tested it thoroughly against my Explorer.  Obviously -- similar to what you and your buddy did when comparing targets -- I was taking a KNOWN target, and comparing it...first, with the Explorer (which at the time was my "go to" machine) and then with my CTX.  I knew quite well how each of the different coins in my garden tended to react, when the Explorer was run over them (I ran the Explorer -- and many other units -- on these targets MANY times).  In my garden, I know which of those coins are "tough targets," which ones are on the very fringe of detection, and which ones you MIGHT get a chirp from, but is NOT a "diggable" target if you were "in the field."

What I concluded, was that no matter what settings I adjusted on the CTX, it was nearly identical, in terms of depth capability, to my SE Pro.  I could not get it to trump my Explorer, depth-wise.  THEN -- I got an Equinox.  By this time, my last Explorer had died, so the CTX was my "go to" machine.  But -- as I said -- I knew the CTX to be very nearly identical, in terms of depth capability, to my Explorer (which I had used for about 7 years prior to getting the CTX).  

SO -- I then tested the CTX and Equinox head-to-head; obviously, very similar to what you and your friend did, I compared the two units to known targets...I knew the depth of each target, I knew the coin type, and I knew how it "behaved" when detected by various machines.  And what THIS testing revealed, is that my Equinox is roughly 1/2" to 1" DEEPER than my CTX (and, by extension, my SE Pro).  This was testing on multiple buried targets (including silver dimes, quarters, and wheat cents).  Finally, then, over the course of a couple of months, I did the same type of head-to-head testing IN THE FIELD.  I'd find a deepie with the CTX, and then grab the EQX, and interrogate.  And -- confirming the test garden results -- the EQX would give a slightly clearer/slightly more "diggable" signal on the targets as compared to the CTX.  

These results -- in central Oklahoma dirt, anyway -- were gathered using the very same type of "testing" that you and your buddy did.  And the results are MUCH different from what you report.  And for the life of me, I can't understand why that carries exactly ZERO weight, in your mind.  I COULD say that yes, it may be such that your California dirt renders the EQX less capable than your Explorer (as opposed to my Oklahoma dirt).  Obviously that's a possibility, but then you have Raphis -- a very long-time, very talented detectorist to say the least, confirming that the EQX is at least the equal of his Explorer in CALIFORNIA dirt (although, not specifically San Fransisco dirt).  

I don't know, Tom...hard to figure why you have such a hard time putting any weight on the experiences of others...BUT -- we've had this discussion before.  I know it doesn't have any influence -- but it's all good!

Steve

[Tom_in_CA]

18 hours ago, steveg said:

.... I've heard from a few folks that when they have installed one of the new EQX updates, they find the machine to suddenly be extremely unstable -- and so they end up doing a "restore" or "reset" back to original settings, and then re-installing the update, and then things work properly.  Based on what you are saying, I have to wonder if a "reset" and "reinstall" might be worth a try, on your buddy's machine.....

Thanx Steve.   I'll pass this on to him.  If the problem of constant chatter persists elsewhere, he was simply going to take the 3.0 back off.   But perhaps he'll try what you say,  and re-install for another trial period .  Thanx.