What Would You Like In The Next XP Detector ?

[Jeff McClendon]

 

1 hour ago, kac said:

True All Metal Mode would be nice. That's coming from an Orx newbie. 🙂

The Deus has a non-motion all metal mode that I have never used. It’s pinpoint function is similar.

Personally, Gold field on the Deus and the two Gold modes are touted by XP as being true all metal modes. Aside from being digital, displaying target ID numbers, iron probability bar, having adjustable iron amplitude rejection (which can be turned off) and iron tone/no iron tone......the two Gold modes on the ORX  and Gold field on the Deus (which does not have iron tone) are threshold based all metal modes with VCO audio and really as close as I would want to “True” all metal mode.....whatever that really is anymore.

Those modes can go really deep on larger targets, are really fast and are incredibly sensitive to tiny targets depending on what frequency and coil is used. They are outstanding for gold prospecting on smaller, shallower gold even in really badly mineralized dirt where several other gold prospecting specific detectors have been unusable from my experience.

[kac]

12 hours ago, Jeff McClendon said:

 

The Deus has a non-motion all metal mode that I have never used. It’s pinpoint function is similar.

Personally, Gold field on the Deus and the two Gold modes are touted by XP as being true all metal modes. Aside from being digital, displaying target ID numbers, iron probability bar, having adjustable iron amplitude rejection (which can be turned off) and iron tone/no iron tone......the two Gold modes on the ORX  and Gold field on the Deus (which does not have iron tone) are threshold based all metal modes with VCO audio and really as close as I would want to “True” all metal mode.....whatever that really is anymore.

Those modes can go really deep on larger targets, are really fast and are incredibly sensitive to tiny targets depending on what frequency and coil is used. They are outstanding for gold prospecting on smaller, shallower gold even in really badly mineralized dirt where several other gold prospecting specific detectors have been unusable from my experience.

When I say all metal mode I am refering to Gen Mode on the Kruzer series, All Metal in the Gold Racer which are straight up vco with a very controllable threshold. I think the Orx gold modes are far less intuitive when it comes to judging the target size and depth because it likes to lock on to a target and blast the audio with a honk of some sorts. That honk is so obtrusive I can't tell if I have an eariing or a beer can below. Certainly lacks the finesse I was looking for.

It might be fine if you want it to blast a tiny nugget but not for my purpose for hunting deeper coins and small relics like buttons.

[Jeff McClendon]

1 hour ago, kac said:

When I say all metal mode I am refering to Gen Mode on the Kruzer series, All Metal in the Gold Racer which are straight up vco with a very controllable threshold. I think the Orx gold modes are far less intuitive when it comes to judging the target size and depth because it likes to lock on to a target and blast the audio with a honk of some sorts. That honk is so obtrusive I can't tell if I have an eariing or a beer can below. Certainly lacks the finesse I was looking for.

It might be fine if you want it to blast a tiny nugget but not for my purpose for hunting deeper coins and small relics like buttons.

First, this topic is really about improvements to the XP Deus.......not the ORX. Anyway, having owned both I personally like the VCO audio on the Deus in the All Metal Mode Gold Field just fine and it was never overpowering as long as I had the Reactivity setting between 2, 2.5 or 3 and Audio Response on 2 or 3. My main beef with the Deus is the audio in its discrimination modes, but I am audio picky. As for the ORX, as I mentioned earlier, the Iron Tone not having a volume control made it very unpleasant for me and I just used it as a last resort for iron ID in the Gold Modes. I do not remember the VCO audio being remarkably different from the Deus VCO audio. 

You and I may have very different audio likes and dislikes as far as VCO audio preferences. Personally, I like the VCO audio on the Deus and ORX just fine (aside from the disgusting iron tone audio on the ORX). I like it better than the VCO audio on any of the Nokta Makro detectors I have owned including their Gold detectors in Gen mode. I also like the adjustability and depth of the XP all metal "Gold" modes better than the features included with the Nok/Mak Gen modes too.

The most important things about the XP all metal gold modes where I detect are setting the threshold on 3 to 6 or so which seems to smooth out the audio some at least for me and performing frequent pumping ground balances. The second that I start getting ground feedback I do a pumping ground balance.

Which coil did you get?

[Chase Goldman]

1 hour ago, kac said:

When I say all metal mode I am refering to Gen Mode on the Kruzer series, All Metal in the Gold Racer which are straight up vco with a very controllable threshold. I think the Orx gold modes are far less intuitive when it comes to judging the target size and depth because it likes to lock on to a target and blast the audio with a honk of some sorts. That honk is so obtrusive I can't tell if I have an eariing or a beer can below. Certainly lacks the finesse I was looking for.

It might be fine if you want it to blast a tiny nugget but not for my purpose for hunting deeper coins and small relics like buttons.

I use gold field/mode as my go to for relic hunting in hot dirt.  You can set the threshold to listen for dropouts, adjust sensitivity as desired and by manipulating reactivity (the most critical parameter) change target response.  To me, gold field renders the ground invisible with a huge dynamic range that suits tiny shallow squeakers, deep coin sized targets on the edge of detection, large trash and keepers and everything in between.  

[kac]

6 hours ago, Jeff McClendon said:

First, this topic is really about improvements to the XP Deus.......not the ORX. Anyway, having owned both I personally like the VCO audio on the Deus in the All Metal Mode Gold Field just fine and it was never overpowering as long as I had the Reactivity setting between 2, 2.5 or 3 and Audio Response on 2 or 3. My main beef with the Deus is the audio in its discrimination modes, but I am audio picky. As for the ORX, as I mentioned earlier, the Iron Tone not having a volume control made it very unpleasant for me and I just used it as a last resort for iron ID in the Gold Modes. I do not remember the VCO audio being remarkably different from the Deus VCO audio. 

You and I may have very different audio likes and dislikes as far as VCO audio preferences. Personally, I like the VCO audio on the Deus and ORX just fine (aside from the disgusting iron tone audio on the ORX). I like it better than the VCO audio on any of the Nokta Makro detectors I have owned including their Gold detectors in Gen mode. I also like the adjustability and depth of the XP all metal "Gold" modes better than the features included with the Nok/Mak Gen modes too.

The most important things about the XP all metal gold modes where I detect are setting the threshold on 3 to 6 or so which seems to smooth out the audio some at least for me and performing frequent pumping ground balances. The second that I start getting ground feedback I do a pumping ground balance.

Which coil did you get?

Topic says Next XP Detector, didn't say Deus or Orx. I never used a Deus and don't know all the modes it has but using the Orx for the short time I have it the Gold modes are more of a 2 tone mode than an all metal mode. This isn't necessarily a bad thing but I did wish it had an all metal mode and one that where the VCO was very proportional to the target in response to depth and size much like the Tejon.

I have been running the Gold mode and set one up for bit of beach hunting and where there is minimal trash with recovery speed at 2 and even dropped it to 1 and running it at 13khz to squeeze some depth out of it. In low trash areas it is ok but any shallow objects or crushed cans I have a difficult time judging the size as it is loud and audio seems to overshoot the target much like the deep mode on the Kruzer.

The Gold Racer iron audio is brutal compared to the Orx so I don't mind that but it seems far less sensitive even at 54khz so it only sounds off on iron objects and doesn't really have any audio on the ground most of the time with the disc at 7. I may drop that lower because I have a hard time nosing off of bottle caps to get any signs of steel.

Using the 9" round hf.

[Chase Goldman]

1 hour ago, kac said:

I have been running the Gold mode and set one up for bit of beach hunting and where there is minimal trash with recovery speed at 2 and even dropped it to 1 and running it at 13khz to squeeze some depth out of it.

That's not the best way to think about reactivity with Deus.  Depth is not affected as much as ground noise with reactivity.  Adjust Reactivity to minimize ground noise reactivity and to get the target response you want at depth and you might be surprised.  Don't be afraid to run it at 2.5 or even 3.  I typically run at 2.5 and bump it up to 3 if I need the separation.  I encourage you to experiment with the higher reactivity settings.

[Jeff McClendon]

I agree with Chase, running the reactivity on 1 is just going to elongate shallower target audio even more. If all of the targets are fairly deep and spread out, then running at 1 might be an option. Also, just lowering the frequency will not necessarily mean more depth either on an extremely high gain detector like the ORX and Deus.

If you want to use the Gold modes on the beach........good luck. Salt mode may help some. Turning off Iron tone and just adding a bit of Discrimination Iron Amplitude Rejection will break up the audio on most shallower iron/steel targets and won't mask coin sized non-ferrous targets.

I am glad you got the 9" HF white coil. To me, it is the best coil for general use with the ORX. The X35 coil to my ears, is a noisy coil that makes the already brash ORX audio even more on the edge of being raucous.

You are right about the topic title and the ORX is fine to offer suggestions for the future..........I disagree with you about the ORX not having an all metal mode. In my opinion it has two excellent almost true threshold based all metal modes. 

If the next XP detector happened to be an upgraded ORX, I would happily buy one if it had iron tone volume control in all of its modes, and a Full tones option in its discrimination modes.

[kac]

I did try 2.5 at the beach and the lower frequency does reduce any chatter and got the machine to run nice and smooth. Will experiment more with the reactivity on that as I haven't tried 1 on the beach but it seems to work ok in low trash areas.

From my past experience lower frequencies are less sensitive to smaller targets and less suseptable to ground noise but that is comparing 5 khz machine to a 56khz. General hunting in these parts I have been doing well with 15.6 which seems to be a happy medium for coin shooting with reactivity of 2.5.

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Quick yard test and yup you guys are right, too low on ractivity extends the response of the target making it seem bigger than it is.

Thanks

[Chase Goldman]

1 hour ago, kac said:

Quick yard test and yup you guys are right, too low on ractivity extends the response of the target making it seem bigger than it is.

Thanks

You bet. Yeah, Jeff and I know a thing or two about these odd duck XP machines.  Gold mode is not entirely intuitive, as you have seen, especially the reactivity setting and which is different than how you would use and adjust it in the coin/discriminate modes.  It really is like two different machines in one.  I really needed to master gold mode for the relic fields because it really shines in mineralization.  It took the Andy Sabisch book, one of his live bootcamp day sessions, and several hundred swing hours for Deus (in my case) to click in both the gold modes and the disc modes.  Now I assist him in teaching the bootcamp when he brings it into my neck of the woods, lol. You probably don't need all of that because you have a number of great "live" XP resources here, so take advantage that, perhaps in your other Orx thread.  You are doing well to keep experimenting and check out the Deus Skill School video series videos that address the Gold Field.  It should really click eventually and at least it is a light swing.  👍

[kac]

My quick yard test Orx vs Tejon and my god the Tejon feels like an old wooden boat LOL. Both can do the same thing essentially and for what I am using it for it is starting to work out well, will take me just field time not books to learn the audio. Pretty easy machine to run.