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Deus 2 May Be First Multi Freq Multi Freq Detector....


Tnsharpshooter

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Does that make any sense?  I don’t think we have seen multi freq detector engineered like this.  Assuming what’s in the manual is the truth.

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It is my understanding that the Equinox 800 uses two primary simultaneous frequencies for each given search mode (I wish Minelab and others would tell us more about what is actually going on under the hood). E.g. if the Equinox has frequencies A,B,C,D,E,F, from low to high, then Park1 uses B,D, Field1 is A,C, Park2 uses D,F and Field2 is C,E, or something to that effect.

The Deus II manual seems to imply that it will use A,B,C,D, etc. up to a maximum frequency. I wonder why XP's marketing department hasn't attacked the Equinox over that.

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18 minutes ago, Chase Goldman said:

When I read the mode descriptions XP has provided with the Deus II, I am really not seeing an A, B, C, D combined frequency approach.  What I am seeing is merely a description articulating the limit of the top end of the frequency spectrum (i.e., the "max frequency") used in each mode (e.g., either 14, 24, or 40 khz) and use of rather ambiguous terminology regarding "frequency addition", "frequency subtraction" and "conductive ground subtraction".  The lead in paragraph to the mode descriptions seems to imply with some ambiguity that basically three, dual frequency combinations or ranges are used 4 and 14 khz, 4 and 24 khz, and 4 and 40 khz, although only 4 and 14 khz is explicitly called out.

Sorry, I wasn't clear with my original explanation, but that is what I mean by two primary frequency combinations, e.g. A,C.

I do have a hunch that "something extra" is occurring with the Deus II over the Equinox 800, at least based on early videos, that the Deus II might have achieved a broader range of resulting frequencies from combinations of two primary frequencies. The Equinox 800 very much has this behavior where changing the modes / frequencies creates a more significant shift in the range of targets that it responds to, while the Deus II doesn't seem to display as much difference between the operational modes. We wouldn't simply conclude that the reason the Deus II shows improved depth and a broader range of target acquisition simply because it outputs more power, but rather it has to be something else.

Until I get my hands on the Deus II, it's too hard to tell yet. But I am getting the suspicion that the Deus II gets more frequency coverage / broader target range responses while being less dependent on which mode you select.

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28 minutes ago, Loren said:

I do have a hunch that "something extra" is occurring with the Deus II over the Equinox 800, at least based on early videos, that the Deus II might have achieved a broader range of resulting frequencies from two primary frequencies.

We'll probably never know for sure based on information direct from the manufacturer as XP and ML are rather tight lipped on their SMF secret sauce (and rightly so).  We may only ever be able to infer that something "extra" is going on based on comparative testing and real world results but never really know precisely how or why from a technical stanpoint.  And frankly, it probably doesn't really matter whether or not we know or understand those technical details as long as we are satisfied with the detector's real world performance.

FWIW the following frequency specs are stated the RF emissions regulatory compliance documentation they are required to publish:

For Equinox/Vanquish, ML reports an emitted RF frequency range of "5 to 143 khz" on their included safety pamphlet.

For Deus II, XP reports an emitted RF signal frequency range of: "3.9 to 135.7 khz" (top of p. 43 of the User Manual)

Looks pretty similar.  Again I think the true secret sauce (in both cases) lies in how the SMF target signal is processed and how many and what specific frequencies or range of frequencies matters less and perhaps is not really useful or meaningful information when comparing Nox to Deus II.

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8 minutes ago, Chase Goldman said:

And frankly, it probably doesn't really matter whether or not we know or understand those technical details as long as we are satisfied with the detector's real world performance.

Haha, I am not satisfied 😄 but also I understand they want to protect their intellectual property.

I just want all relevant technical information necessary to understand how the machine works so I can use it optimally. Knowing which frequencies it is spitting out is pretty important. I am not sure denying us regular folks that information prevents a competing company from essentially reverse engineering their detector, I mean... look at Nokta Makro (I suppose it could slow them down which is valuable).

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40 minutes ago, Loren said:

Haha, I am not satisfied 😄 but also I understand they want to protect their intellectual property.

I just want all relevant technical information necessary to understand how the machine works so I can use it optimally. Knowing which frequencies it is spitting out is pretty important. I am not sure denying us regular folks that information prevents a competing company from essentially reverse engineering their detector, I mean... look at Nokta Makro (I suppose it could slow them down which is valuable).

Hey, I get it, I'm an engineer. But you have a lot more info about FMF frequencies on the Deus II than Multi-IQ frequencies used on the Nox.  XP is basically giving you the explicit operating frequency range for each mode (4 to 14 khz > optimized for deep high conductors or large targets; 4(?) to 24 khz > optimized for general purpose mid-conductive targets (i.e., relic hunting, larger jewelry); and 4(?) to 40 khz > optimized for small targets, micro jewelry, or natural gold prospecting) and how ground conductivity is canceled out.  That and the mode description should be all you need to decide how and when to use each mode.

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4 minutes ago, Chase Goldman said:

Should be all you need to decide how and when to use each mode.

At least in my specific case I could use some more specifics. E.g. on the Equinox 800, some of the smaller non-hammered silver coins I target light up in Field2 but not Park2 (despite both modes claiming to have higher frequency weighted signal that ought to respond well to these types of targets). 

It would be helpful to know if that is primarily a result of different frequency distributions or a difference in signal processing. Trial and error will eventually reveal which Deus II mode is optimal for targeting these coins, but a more complete picture would help me optimize the detector for this specific goal.

 

Don't get me wrong, I am doing this sort of guesswork on both machines, so I will gladly take the one with the better apparent performance, even if I didn't have a better understanding of it's workings.

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14 minutes ago, Loren said:

At least in my specific case I could use some more specifics. E.g. on the Equinox 800, some of the smaller non-hammered silver coins I target light up in Field2 but not Park2 (despite both modes claiming to have higher frequency weighted signal that ought to respond well to these types of targets). 

It would be helpful to know if that is primarily a result of different frequency distributions or a difference in signal processing.

Don't forget the disc breakpoints and default tone volumes are different between the two modes as well as the default recovery speed settings.  Unless you tweaked the user adjustable settings to be identical during your small coin hunts, it's hard to definitely say the difference in detectability is solely due to a difference in frequency weighting or signal processing between these very similar modes.

At the end of the day, regardless of how much detailed technical information is provided by the manufacturer, how I use the detector is based primarily on trial and error field experience that only gets optimized/honed after racking up a lot of swing hours.  The manual just initially points me in the general direction of the starting point from which I learn by doing.

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We don’t seem to see the term freq weighting with Deus 2.  Rather a different max freq used with whatever program..  why I said what I did in title of thread.  Rather wee see the object being weighted (more ideal) by freq used by each program.  My take anyway.  This is not posted in detector  comparison thread.  But seems just by reading, Deus 2 can be run more like both Etrac/CTX as well as Equinox depending on program selected.  Does this if true make Deus 2 more versatile ( have ability to solve more detect scenarios overall)?  Time will tell.

Also notice mono factory default sensitivity with Deus 2 like Deus 1 factory default.  Seems multi freq program use though most cases higher default sensitivity across the board versus Deus 1.  Maybe the noise cancel capability using multi freq is the why behind this.

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