Minelab Manticore Update Today (oct. 18th. 2022)

[phrunt]

My CTX has a clock, haven't paid much attention to it, it must set itself with the GPS or something as I never set it and it's got the right time.  I don't care about a clock on a detector, I don't care about time, I eat when I'm hungry and I go home when it gets dark.  🙂

 

[CPT_GhostLight]

Ditto that, phrunt! My D2 has a clock and I never look at it. When I go detecting, I'm off the clock. 😉

[UT Dave]

I actually wouldn't mind an hour meter.  I won't miss it either, though.

But a clock...  No.  Detecting time is like fishing time, or hunting time.  No clocks.

- Dave

[GB_Amateur]

Can't those who have a detector with a clock just ignore the clock?  (phrunt already answered this so mine is a rhetorical question.)  The reciprocal situation isn't possible.  A time accumulator would be nice instead or in addition.  I recall many years ago Steve H. mentioning buying those cheapo stick-on clocks at a 'dollar' store or discount department store and attaching them, but that was back when most control units were rather large, and they might not even sell those clocks anymore.  For those married to their cellphones (if you're off the grid when detecting I assume you don't carry one of those, either...), no need for even a wristwatch anymore.  I'd rather have a clock on my detector (I don't) than carry a cellphone when dectecting (I don't).  There's no danger the internal clock will interfere with the detector's performance.  Can you say that about a cellphone?  (warning:  more rhetoric 😉)

[phrunt]

Ok guys, let's clear some more up about the Mandymoore.

It has Bluetooth LE LC3 Audio, a new version of bluetooth.  This is why it can be used with the older Bluetooth headphones too, but the new ones will be LE headphones.  So again, it has better audio than the GPX 6000 which had very dated bluetooth even when it was released, basically discontinued audio on the 6000 when it came out.  

You can see it here under test report https://apps.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas/reports/ViewExhibitReport.cfm?mode=Exhibits&RequestTimeout=500&calledFromFrame=N&application_id=YwdXmpsuaYfdk%2FQl6JsBDw%3D%3D&fcc_id=Z4C-0049

Manticore (project name: Sirius) is designed as a high-performance coin & treasure metal
detector. The product is designed to detect metal targets buried at varying depths in the ground.
The metal detector supports a low-latency wireless audio connection f or use with wireless
headphones.

This is the Bluetooth specifications from the Manticore.

Radio: Bluetooth Low Energy
(Nordic nRF5340)
Frequency band: 2400 – 2483.5 MHz
Number of Channels: 40
Operating Frequency:
Low Channel: 2402 MHz (BT LE Advertising Channel 37)
Mid Channel: 2440 MHz (BT LE Data Channel 17)
High Channel: 2480 MHz (BT LE Advertising Channel 39)
Modulation: Gaussian Frequency Shift Modulation (GFSK)
Nominal Bandwidth: 2 MHz
Data Rate: 2 Mbps
Antenna:
PCB Trace Antenna
TEXAS INSTRUMENTS 2.4-GHz Inverted F Antenna
(TI AP #SWRU120D)
Antenna Peak Gain: 3.3 dBi

You can read about it here

https://www.soundguys.com/bluetooth-le-audio-lc3-explained-28192/

The new Low Complexity Communication Codec (LC3) is set to replace SBC in Bluetooth 5.2, and it will be capable of scaling between 345kbps to 160kbps both at a bit depth of 16. Alongside this, LC3Plus will boast a latency time of around 5ms, much quicker than SBC’s 100ms. As a result, the lingering issue of Bluetooth for gaming can finally be addressed, as the threshold for human brains to detect when audio is out of sync is as low as 30ms. 

So once again, it's all about the time the detector is being released, right as the new kick butt bluetooth is available, and the poor old GPX 6000 is released with crappy outdated Bluetooth aptX LL to go with it's twisting shaft when the Mandable gets the nice solid not twisting shaft.

[phrunt]

https://www.nordicsemi.com/products/nrf5340

nRF5340System-on-Chip

Dual-core Bluetooth 5.3 SoC supporting Bluetooth LE, Bluetooth mesh, NFC, Thread and Zigbee

The nRF5340 is the world’s first wireless SoC with two Arm® Cortex®-M33 processors. The combination of two flexible processors, the advanced feature set, and an operating temperature up to 105 °C, makes it the ideal choice for LE Audio, professional lighting, advanced wearables, and other complex IoT applications.

The nRF5340 is an all-in-one SoC, including a superset of the most prominent nRF52® Series features. Features like Bluetooth® 5.3, high-speed SPI, QSPI, USB, up to 105 °C operating temperature, and more, are combined with more performance, memory and integration, while minimizing current consumption.

The application processor is optimized for performance and can be clocked at either 128 or 64 MHz, using voltage-frequency scaling. It has 1 MB Flash, 512 KB RAM, a floating-point unit (FPU), an 8 KB 2-way associative cache and DSP instruction capabilities. The network processor is clocked at 64 MHz and is optimized for low power and efficiency (101 CoreMark/mA). It has 256 KB Flash and 64 KB RAM.

The nRF5340 takes security to the next level. It offers trusted execution, root-of-trust and secure key storage security features. Arm TrustZone provides trusted execution by implementing a division between secure and non-secure Flash, RAM, peripherals and GPIOs. The state-of-the-art Arm CryptoCell-312 provides hardware-accelerated cryptography, and together with the key management unit (KMU) peripheral, root-of-trust and secure key storage are implemented.

The nRF5340 SoC supports an extensive range of wireless protocols. It supports Bluetooth Low Energy and is capable of all angle-of-arrival (AoA) and angle-of-departure (AoD) roles in Bluetooth Direction Finding. In addition, it supports LE Audio, high-throughput 2 Mbps, Advertising Extensions and Long Range. Mesh protocols like Bluetooth mesh, Thread and Zigbee can be run concurrently with Bluetooth LE, enabling smartphones to provision, commission, configure and control mesh nodes. NFC, ANT, 802.15.4 and 2.4 GHz proprietary protocols are also supported.

The nRF Connect SDK is the software development kit for the nRF5340 SoC, offering a complete solution that integrates the Zephyr RTOS, protocol stacks, application samples and hardware drivers.

The nRF5340 DK is the development kit for the nRF5340 SoC, and has everything needed for development on a single board.

 

[sevastras]

On 10/18/2022 at 5:37 PM, Gerry in Idaho said:

 

Simon - You cheap Mongrel,🤣 trying to get an extra coil out of them.  This coming from a guy who has purchased more detectors than 95% of the people I know.  Yes it would be great if they did in fact offer it as "Introductory Sale".  But you and I know, they could have offered it for $1999 and I think many would purchase it anyway.  Seems the $1600 price point is right on with the Deus-II though and that seems to be its competition. 

 

And then he complains about them until a new one comes out and then complains about why the new one doesn’t do things as well as the old one he complains about. 😂

Just messing with you Simon. 

[GB_Amateur]

13 hours ago, phrunt said:

LC3Plus will boast a latency time of around 5ms, much quicker than SBC’s 100ms.

Sounds too good to be true.  Seems like the above might be (I'm no RF 'pert) inconsistent with the following (and BTW I'm no Mackie Messer, either):

It’s also much lower latency–we don’t have real-world figures just yet, but codecs like SBC and AAC often have a total latency of over 200ms, while LC3 has a default frame time of only 10ms, so even with a full encoding and decoding pipeline the latency is likely to be well under 100ms.

(Cut and pasted from this July 2022 article: https://www.macworld.com/article/797884/bluetooth-le-audio-lc3-codec-airpods.html .  Maybe this author is just being extremely careful not to overstate expected performance?)

It's good to get some clarification as Lawrie never seemed to want to go into detail on this topic while on his European Tour, leaving us (well, me anyway) confused.  I think the proprietary wireless (via WM08 module) on the Equinox was 17 ms while the Bluetooth LL APTX was in the high 30's(?).

Presumably aftermarket headphones, earbuds, etc. will be available which will make a lot of users very happy not to be held hostage to ML pricing.

[phrunt]

The latency will depend on the bitrate they send the audio, seeing it's not some device playing music and needing fantastic audio they'll be able to use lower quality audio without it being detrimental and use a much lower latency. 

We don't need deep bass or any such things that someone playing music through speakers might.  LC3 also compresses the audio on the fly sending less data through the air meaning lower latency. 

LC3 scales from 345kbps right down to 160kbps. SBC, Bluetooth Classic’s mandatory codec, ranges from 345kbps to 240kbps—ut it takes a substantial hit to audio quality as a result. aptX Adaptive runs between 279 and 420kbps, while LDAC ranges from 330 to 990kbps. LC3 is by far the most compact Bluetooth codec used in consumer audio to date. But what effect does that have on audio quality?

Part of the Manticores delay of release will be it's processor, it's basically not even released in any great quantities yet.

https://www.hackster.io/news/nordic-semiconductor-announces-the-new-nrf5340-microcontroller-9014f5841168

I doubt we'll be getting our Mandymoores before Christmas, they must have just wanted to slow the sales of the Deus 2 and Legend by announcing the Muncheroo

[dsb]

PHRUNT you type faster then i think, was going to post this.     Somewhere in the info PHRUNT added i found this Quote.  LC3Plus will boast a latency time of around 5ms, much quicker than SBC's 100ms.   Latency may vary by device?  What ever it's good news.  With all the test graphs i saw in the FCC report I'm sure someone will distill it into dirtynesse for lugs like me.