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Minelab Sues Nokta


PSPR

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On 12/4/2022 at 12:10 PM, Steve Herschbach said:

Quest actually makes pretty good detectors, some would say very good

Ive heard more than a few ppl say that Quest make a pinpointer that Minelab should copy....so that they get it right.... :biggrin:

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On 12/2/2022 at 3:12 AM, PSPR said:

Just a couple weeks ago it looks like Minelab sued Nokta for patent infringement.

https://dockets.justia.com/docket/pennsylvania/pawdce/3:2022cv00211/293964

 

My dealer in Paris told me about this Nokta/ML infrigement story a few months ago

Actually the legend and the equinox look very similar , I have never used a legend but I imagine that their electronics are similar . Even their coils sizes-shapes are very similar , a 11 and a 8 for both ... Then I am not surprised by the ML reaction ...

Concerning Quest  , they have probably copied the T2 a few years ago , but now they make their "own" machines , and they have good ones ,especially the Quest X5 and X10 which are excellent entry level detectors , perfect for beginners at very low prices ...

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15 minutes ago, palzynski said:

Actually the legend and the equinox look very similar , I have never used a legend but I imagine that their electronics are similar . Even their coils sizes are identical , a 11 and a 8 for both ... Then I am not surprised by the ML reaction ...

All detectors are similar in way or another. It has to be a specific patent or trademark violation to carry any weight.

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 Rollin White's patent for the bored-through cylinder is a good example.  All revolvers look the same but without the patent you couldn't use self contained cartridges.  SMF was Minlabs baby but can they prove others directly copied their content.

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On 12/2/2022 at 8:24 AM, Steve Herschbach said:

Detector wars are prohibited on these forums, since it fosters conflict with fellow forum members. Calm sane rational discussion is the order of the day here, not picking teams and engaging in team sports. Nokta is no where near going out of business. That’s baseless pot stirring.

Nokta clearly lifted heavily from Minelab, especially in the look and feel aspect of the Legend user interface. Icons are near identical, for instance. Who knows about the aspects of the multi involved, more a question for engineers. We will see when details emerge, but one would assume Minelab is alleging some violation here regarding how the multi is implemented.

The irony here is Minelab immediately copied Nokta back, including the flashlight and up to now Nokta exclusive vibrating handle. Add the telescoping rod, and the new Equinox upgrades look more like the Legend than ever. A stick in Noktas eye?

People who wants to go on about this outfit copying that outfit don’t know how product development works. Companies copy what succeeds elsewhere all the time, in virtually every product made and service sold. Unless it violates a patent, it is the norm. Equinox is very similar to the earlier Quest designs. Who is copying who? Companies also cross license technology from each other as a regular part of business. Worst case here is Nokta might be forced up to pay Minelab if there was a use of some patent. I suppose they could try and force a stop in sale of product, but that’s pretty rare, unless it’s really blatant, like the Quest and Fisher thing. Or the whole thing gets dismissed as just another blocking tactic by Minelab, which they are not shy of undertaking, just to mess with the competition.

Be interesting to see how it unfolds, but pretty much a sideshow as far as most of us are concerned.

Equinox was released in 2018. This is the Deteknix Quest Pro and Deteknix Quest Gold from 2016. Anyone see any resemblance between these and the later Equinox, and then Legend? Or is it also the coincidence of great minds thinking alike, and form follows function? All smart phones look alike. Some of that is copying, but some is just because a phone needs to be a phone.

869BBC97-7FD0-4A84-9CF7-6B98E614B2E2.png

deteknix-gold-metal-detector.jpg

 

Well put Steve, from what I understand, White's invented VDI.  Now everyone uses it.  Minelab's "Gold Chance Indicator" and Nokta's "Ferro Check" probably came from White's "Probability of Iron" feature on the GMT (Bar Graph) and MXT Series (as a numbered percent).  I don't know which company came out with Ground Balance and Auto-Tracking first, now it's up for grabs.  Not to mention Garrett's Iron Audio which is on both Minelab and Nokta Products.  The list goes on and on.

Walt

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From Minelab

1596288145_IP1.jpg.db6f7b3d7266f1a238beca0bcff9bcd2.jpg

400734061_IP2.jpg.c67a6e40895111b656e18b2f2d15fda6.jpg

1655384833_IP3.jpg.0bc5f474cf530d71bc9d9adcc9c67dfc.jpg

 

They heavily defend their IP, rightly so.  Hopefully it's a misunderstanding and Nokta are in the clear, if not it is pretty sad, especially the way they were singling out Minelab and their detectors pricing, quality and other factors to promote their detector.

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I remember Whites having to pay Minelab a royalty for the Dual Frequency XLT (DFX).  I've also heard that all you have to do is change something by 10% to get around the Patent laws.

I find it interesting that it only lists one American Distributor when there are two Major Players.  The other is Outdoor Outfitters.  Maybe they don't sell the Nokta brand.

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15 hours ago, Bohemia Miner said:

I find it interesting that it only lists one American Distributor when there are two Major Players.  The other is Outdoor Outfitters.  Maybe they don't sell the Nokta brand.

I find it interesting that Minelab is suing a distributor that distributes their own product...I guess I'm not sure how all that works..So minelab sells to dealers directly and also distributors directly something like that? why not sue the dealers that are selling the Notka detectors as well is it all just too much? 

strick 

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On 12/12/2022 at 12:43 AM, strick said:

I find it interesting that Minelab is suing a distributor that distributes their own product...I guess I'm not sure how all that works..So minelab sells to dealers directly and also distributors directly something like that? why not sue the dealers that are selling the Notka detectors as well is it all just too much? 

strick 

I'm not a Minelab dealer anymore due to misinformation from my previous Distributor.  Now they want me to do another buy-in of several thousand dollars.  If I could just pick up where I left off, I might consider it.

In the past, Minelab, Garrett, and Fisher all used distributors AND sold to dealers directly.  When Fisher started competing with their dealers on Amazon, the two US Distributors stopped carrying their products, so those are factory direct to dealers now.

As far as suing the dealers, if they used the phrase, "et, al", in their legal documents, that would include dealers also.

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