Beach Mode For Park Cherry Picking With Far More Accurate Id's On The Manticore

[JCR]

Also, the Sensitivity control on many detectors effects the receiver Gain AND audio Threshold levels.

[TampaBayBrad]

14 hours ago, GB_Amateur said:

3) I'm throwing water on the argument some people are claiming:  tying the the gain scales together on the two detectors.  25 on the Eqx 800 is 25 on the Manticore?  Where'd you get that?  25 on the Eqx is 35 on the Manticore?  Where'd you get that?  Since when is what you expect a substitute for the truth? 

From page 1 of NASA Tom's Manticore thread he states:

"Yes..... Sens now goes up to '35'. And yes..... a EQX Sens of '21'..... is fairly equiv to a Sens of '21' on MC."

Link

[GB_Amateur]

On 2/4/2023 at 8:54 AM, TampaBayBrad said:

From page 1 of NASA Tom's Manticore thread he states:

"Yes..... Sens now goes up to '35'. And yes..... a EQX Sens of '21'..... is fairly equiv to a Sens of '21' on MC."

Link

Good to know!  Thanks for clearing that up.  "Fairly close" is still open to interpretation, but if he had said 'exactly' I would have been skeptical.  😁  Apparently ML made an effort to align the two scales, within the constraints of changes in hardware and software.

Addendum: Here by 'align' I mean what Tom D. is quoted above -- similar numerical values correspond to *approximately* the same gain.

[fishersari]

I don't know about the scaling, but I do know that my nox 800 with sensitivity of 25, recovery speed of 4 IDing targets as iron, which manticore with sensitivity of 28, recovery speed of 4 ID the same target as nonferrous (jumpy ID). Now manticores at my country gets a bad rep among other detectorist due to bigger and deeper holes and they jokingly said that the manticore is no longer allowed to enter the sites 😆

[phrunt]

I've been playing with the Manticore quite a bit, I can't do much digging unfortunately as we are in a drought and the grass is a bit dry and brown, if I start digging up the fields I'll be causing damage which I don't want to do as I want to maintain my access to these areas without causing trouble so I've just been finding targets with the Vanquish or Equinox 800 and comparing results.  The Vanquish is and has always been my best cherry picker out of the multi-IQ machines, its jewellery mode and EMI handling is just great around here, perhaps its the v12 elliptical coil helping I don't know but it is always the most accurate with ID's on these deep coin targets, and that's still showing now.  I wish the Nox had the Vanquish coils.

The Manticore is actually doing better with EMI than the Equinox, mainly because I can run the Manticore in lower sensitivity settings and still get the depth, where the Nox starts to drop off the Target in lower sensitivity the Manticore is still doing great at 14 sensitivity, these are coin targets at 20-30cm deep (8 to 12 inches), I have dug a couple of targets just to be sure what I was finding but I'm purposefully not digging much at all unless in a spot I'm not concerned about the ground like in the dirt car parking areas.

The 2D Target trace is working very well, ID stability although not quite Vanquish is doing pretty good on lower sensitivity settings, if I try go over 16 to 18 the stability of ID's drops away, this is in All Terrain General, in Beach mode I can have 25 sensitivity and still maintain stable ID's on the same targets.

The fields I'm detecting are in a town that does have quite a bit of EMI even underground powerlines under the field,  outside of the town area I may not see this Target ID instability in the higher sensitivities, I'll find out with time when I try it in more places, it's just hard at the moment as I can't really dig anywhere where I'd find good stuff with the dry ground so it's not worth going anywhere further away.  I may have to wait until a change of seasons before I can go and see if the Manticore will find me anymore silvers in my fields I've missed with the Vanquish/Nox and then CTX.  It's certainly showing promising depth, it is deeper than the Equinox and Vanquish, that I'm sure of.  I'm not so sure it's deeper than the CTX though, I can't lift the Manticore coil off the ground and still get good hits on deep targets like I can the CTX so in long grass the CTX is likely to be the better choice for me.

Plenty to learn with the Manticore, I'm much happier with it now I know to keep my sensitivity lower and I won't be missing these deeper targets by doing so, it really has improved the Target ID a lot by doing that.  So far so good, really like the Manticore.

[midalake]

On 2/4/2023 at 7:54 AM, TampaBayBrad said:

From page 1 of NASA Tom's Manticore thread he states:

"Yes..... Sens now goes up to '35'. And yes..... a EQX Sens of '21'..... is fairly equiv to a Sens of '21' on MC."

 

On 2/4/2023 at 8:58 AM, GB_Amateur said:

Good to know!  Thanks for clearing that up.  "Fairly close" is still open to interpretation, but if he had said 'exactly' I would have been skeptical.  😁  Apparently ML made an effort to align the two scales, within the constraints of changes in hardware and software.

The more I read. The more I think the scales are NOT aligned. My thoughts are the Manticore is ahead on performance number for number with the Equinox. 

[phrunt]

8 minutes ago, midalake said:

The more I read. The more I think the scales are NOT aligned. My thoughts are the Manticore is ahead on performance number for number with the Equinox. 

I'm confident they're not aligned.

[storagebox]

Phrunt, you mentioned potential EMI issues multiple times and I am wondering how you are doing your noise cancel?  Are you doing the quick 1-2 second press and taking what channel it gives you, or are you doing the "long hold" noise cancel where you keep holding the noise cancel button and the machine cycles through every channel, slowly weeding out the less effective channels until it eventually narrows down to one or two channels, and then finally comes to rest on one specific channel?  Tom D has stated that this is a critical factor to getting the best out of the Manticore.  The manual mentions it, but almost in passing and really doesnt stress it at all.  Tom makes a very pointed issue out of it!  Perhaps this will help?  Also, are you finding any differences with or without ground balancing?   So many factors and "tweaks" to dialing in a new machine to attain maximum performance!

[phrunt]

7 hours ago, storagebox said:

Phrunt, you mentioned potential EMI issues multiple times and I am wondering how you are doing your noise cancel?  Are you doing the quick 1-2 second press and taking what channel it gives you, or are you doing the "long hold" noise cancel

I certainly am, I learnt some time ago the quick noise cancels do next to nothing, I don't trust them at all. I like the good hearty old fashion wait a minute noise cancels as I genuinely believe they do something, these 1-2 second instant noise cancels I believe do next to nothing and just randomly select a channel and they expect you to keep pressing it until it clears up.  I even preferred the older detectors with the frequency shift option instead of noise cancel as it also genuinely worked.

I find the Manticore long noise cancel quite good, it really does settle on a channel and if you press it again and wait it often settles on the same channel which is a good indicator it's doing something, if doing it and it settled on random channels I wouldn't trust it near as much.

I am in very mild soil, I've never met a detector that actually gives feedback on my ground prior to balancing, I do however out of best practice do a ground balance.

I just think the Manticore is a different beast to the Equinox, it's sensitivity scale appears to be different as if I was to set the sensitivity level as low as I do with the Manticore, both using 11" coils I can make coins completely disappear on the Equinox that the Manticore can find.

Perhaps it's not the scale that's different and it's just a more powerful deeper detector on these coin size targets, I think the only people that REALLY know are the geniuses sitting in an office in Adelaide Australia that designed and coded the thing.

The more I learn and fiddle with it the more I appreciate it's advantages over the Equinox, especially as a coin and jewellery detector, not so sure about prospecting but it's very early days and with that opinions can change overnight.

[Hunterjunk]

A small coil for the Manticore might really put the cat amongst the pigeons !   Will be trying the 11" on a goldfield in two weeks time , not very confident as the gold there is pretty small , but not as small as Phrunt's bits so hoping .