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Best Nokta Legend Settings For Small Gold


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Purchased my Nokta Legend (1.09 Software version) 95% for small gold in Arizona desert and washes hoping to do better on tiny gold than my MXT. I was finding individual paper staples near-surface with the MXT (What were they doing in a semi-remote desert wash??), which are small (0.8gr/0.07gr), but typical gold size is smaller than those staples, and the MXT wouldn't find that small a particle. My friend's GB 2 easily did 1/4th staple, though I don't expect that level of performance of the Legend.

Has anyone used theirs for this style of use enough to have best, or favorite custom settings that "best' the default settings?

The Legend offers SO many menus/parameters that can be custom set, I feel a bit lost picking my way through the multitude of menus and sub-menus. My previous units were Whites knob-set detectors (MXT and now a TDI P-I unit I recently acquired) that were more intuitive and easier to work with IMO.

I've only been out with it a few times due to lack of capable 4WD so far (which will be remedied when we get a house with an RV gate to park one, since my current HOA will violate/fine for driveway parking, especially with a truck or Jeep), but using the 6" search coil I found some tiny ricochet bullet lead fragments and small bird shot in crevices on recent outings, but I'm sure I could do better than default settings.

Is MultiFreq better than 40Kz alone (I know the higher the better w/ teh GB 2 at 71Khz)? Instruction manual lacking for prospecting.

I did a search here, but came up empty unless I phrased the search poorly. 

Thanks,

Bob

 

BTW, The remote washes are pretty devoid of typical trash. No aluminum yet, just some bullet or birdshot lead and the aforementioned staples. And a 1/4-20 steel nut FAR from any tire tracks (maybe from a long ways away where a trail crossed the wash).

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  • The title was changed to Best Nokta Legend Settings For Small Gold

hello

the staples are more than likely off drywashes .

i run the legend with the 6 inch coil in goldfield at about 25 on the sensitivity less if the ground is hot..

do a ground balance..

i find 40k runs smooth . remember coil to the soil ..

the legend will find nuggets keep at it & you will find them.

good luck you have a good machine...

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What witwidz said. 
 

I like Goldfield Multi better but that is just me. Starting points for me are——Discrimination pattern A, sensitivity on the edge of being chatty if you can stand it or lower it a bit, volume 3 or 4, recovery speed 4 or 5, Iron filter on 1, iron stability 1, bottle cap 0 (if you are using software v. 1.10) ground stability 0, threshold 7 to 9 or just so you can barely hear it.
Swing low and slow and do ground balances often.

Dig any target with an ID from -9 to +30 that seems to be coin sized or smaller. Practice on small bits of lead. 

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3 hours ago, Jeff McClendon said:

What witwidz said. 
 

I like Goldfield Multi better but that is just me. Starting points for me are——Discrimination pattern A, sensitivity on the edge of being chatty if you can stand it or lower it a bit, volume 3 or 4, recovery speed 4 or 5, Iron filter on 1, iron stability 1, bottle cap 0 (if you are using software v. 1.10) ground stability 0, threshold 7 to 9 or just so you can barely hear it.
Swing low and slow and do ground balances often.

Dig any target with an ID from -9 to +30 that seems to be coin sized or smaller. Practice on small bits of lead. 

Curious-

First Thanks!

Manual says: Default is same as Iron Filter 8, which is no filtering as on pre 1.09 software. I've read that under some conditions gold at low numbers can appear as iron (though it wouldn't likely show as ferrous). Manual says, "Lower IF Settings will increase the probability of ferrous targets to be classified as non-ferrous targets and vice versa."

Asking to learn (not disagreeing). Manual says "IF allows nonferrous targets in trashy sites, previously masked by iron, to be detectable."

It would seem that running a strong IF (lower #) allows ferrous and non-ferrous metals to be read the same.

I guess my question would be why one would want that? I'm sure there is a good reason I am not seeing, so your answer would educate me (the goal of the post, of course).

I have not downloaded v1.10. I just read the "new features" of that version. Do you find the new features useful? (I had a hassle loading 1.09 and not sure if I solved he problem of how to do it, or if 1.10 will be a hassle as well). If you think it's a GOOD thing, I will attempt it.

You use MultiFreq because it's more stable, or more sensitive to very small gold? 

And yes, I should have kept a tiny piece of lead to practice on. Unfortunately where I live the ground is SO full of EMI all around I cannot use a metal detector at all which makes practicing difficult, though I have not tried the P-I detector. Not sure if it is susceptible though it sure cuts through mineralization and hot rocks like they're not even there (though in Australia not necessarily true). 

Bob

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3 hours ago, wltdwiz said:

hello

the staples are more than likely off drywashes .

i run the legend with the 6 inch coil in goldfield at about 25 on the sensitivity less if the ground is hot..

do a ground balance..

i find 40k runs smooth . remember coil to the soil ..

the legend will find nuggets keep at it & you will find them.

good luck you have a good machine...

 

Good point on the staples coming from prospecting. Finding staples made me think of office paperwork, but they are used for many things really.

You mention 40Khz "runs smooth" meaning more stable, or less chatty? I have not tried single frequency yet to be honest so don't have any basis for comparison.

BTW, How does the Legend stack up for very small gold compared to the Gold Monster 1000 and the Gold Bug Pro? I know the GB 2 is supposed to be more sensitive to tiny gold than the GB Pro, but the GB Pro is reputed to be more user friendly. Lots of folks here in AZ use the GB 2 and the Gold Monster 1000 so they are both very well thought of. No one I know has a Legend, though it generates curiosity.

 

Funny how there are misconceptions out there, though with some machines. I find the TDI P-I machine is fairly sensitive (on lead as I haven't found gold with it) and a pleasure to use (I LIKE the weird sound it seem intuitive), but the sound seems to drive some people around me nuts where I've used it. Everyone says P-I is only good for deep targets, but it seems good for shallow ones as well. I only have an hour of using it, though, so maybe I just don't know the machine well enough yet.

Until I can get out often enough in real conditions I am at a disadvantage, especially w/ the Legend given all the steps to program all the features since you have to go through menus to get to adjustments. Eventually I know it will be second nature like all things.

One thing that surprised me: I found the Legend makes a GB 2 virtually UNUSABLE closer then 20ft due to emitted radiation. The GB 2 goes into loud oscillation inside that 20ft radius. It's not friendly with at least some other VLF machines for sure. I have not heard that mentioned anywhere before I experienced it. I had to go far away so my buddy could use his GB 2 to verify or compare a target response unless I turned my Legend off completely.

 

Bob

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8 hours ago, bobinyelm said:

Manual says: Default is same as Iron Filter 8, which is no filtering as on pre 1.09 software. I've read that under some conditions gold at low numbers can appear as iron (though it wouldn't likely show as ferrous). Manual says, "Lower IF Settings will increase the probability of ferrous targets to be classified as non-ferrous targets and vice versa."

"default is same as Iron Filter 8, which is no filtering....."

Iron filter default setting of 8 is not zero filtering. It is full filtering on 1.09. Saying it another way, if you are detecting in Gold mode multi using iron bias set on default 8 using 1.09 AND the ground your are detecting on is highly iron mineralized you better be running the Legend using the A discrimination pattern and dig everything because really small sub gram gold nuggets and especially sub .1 grammers are going to have ferrous target IDs. Put the iron filter setting on 1 (minimum filtering-there is no zero in Multi) you stand a better chance of having a small nugget or picker have a target ID number above 1 and maybe even above 11.

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My error then.

The manual for V1.09 (pg 16) says that IF 8 in V1.09 is the same as pre- V1.09 default setting, which I assumed to be NO filtering.  Makes me think of the old expression that "assume" makes an "ass" out of you and me. I should have asked rather than assumed. I guess I had it backwards.

You're saying the previous V1.05/V1.07 by default was HIGH iron filtering then.

I had it opposite I guess thinking the earlier versions had NO iron filtering.

So by selecting IF 1 I would be eliminating (or reducing) Iron Filtering (or turning it down as much as possible at least).

Thanks-

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1 hour ago, bobinyelm said:

My error then.

The manual for V1.09 (pg 16) says that IF 8 in V1.09 is the same as pre- V1.09 default setting, which I assumed to be NO filtering.  Makes me think of the old expression that "assume" makes an "ass" out of you and me. I should have asked rather than assumed. I guess I had it backwards.

You're saying the previous V1.05/V1.07 by default was HIGH iron filtering then.

I had it opposite I guess thinking the earlier versions had NO iron filtering.

So by selecting IF 1 I would be eliminating (or reducing) Iron Filtering (or turning it down as much as possible at least).

Thanks-

Multi frequency detectors like the Legend which is similar to the Equinox have to use iron filtering/iron bias in order for ferrous range targets to be identified a little better. Unlike single frequency detectors that process a ratio of the ferrous vs non-ferrous target characteristics of the return signal, the Equinox (and I am assuming the Legend) when using their Multi settings only use the non ferrous parts of the return signals for processing. If they had no way to bias those return signals towards iron they would probably false on iron even more than they already do. So using Multi, there is always a small amount of iron bias/filtering going on and setting 1 is the least amount of iron bias on the Legend. The earlier Legend software versions only had a fixed iron filter setting which was similar to the current setting of 8.

Also, you asked for the "Best" settings. I won't assume that I know what is best for you. I definitely don't. The settings I quoted are what I use on the Legend as a starting point for gold prospecting near Morristown AZ and at a site nearer to me in Colorado. I have them saved as a user profile.

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Thanks much for clearing that up with the technical explanation, and I can see why Less is More for prospecting.

I was trying to think who said this (below), but it proved to be right again. Donald Rumsfeld used the sentence, so I looked it up to be "sure," only to find Samuel Clemens used it, then to prove the accuracy of the expression found another reference to its author, a Henry Wheeler Shaw.

"It's not what you don't know; it's what you [think you] know that ain't  so" [that gets you]

So thanks for setting me straight on Iron Filtering, and it makes total sense why minimal Iron Filtering would be useful.

By the way, given the number of metal detectors you own and have used, curious where the Legend stacks up on the scale in general (Multi use detectors) and as a Gold Detector compared to your impressive list? Just curiosity on my part. 

And given that it appears you used yours not only FOR, but WHERE I intend to use mine for the same specimens (near Morristown AZ/San Domingo/Hassayampa drainages and Yavapai Co.) and last weekend I was working some washes west of Lake Pleasant, you most likely know exactly what is best for me! Certainly you have FAR more time swinging and observing the results.

And I appreciate it.

Bob

Question- Not exclusively about the Legend, but a VLF ground balance question that might be pertinent to the Legend as well. I was fooling w/ my trusty Whites MXT today with a 4"X6" DD Coil (seems to work much better than the stock concentric 9.5" round coil in the field) and I was curious how far it would "air test" with a single standard paper staple (0.7 grain wt).  I had the MXT standing vertical away from any metal and I was sweeping the staple rapidly back and forth past the coil, ending the swings a foot or more either side of the coil so as to not mess up the ground balance tracking (which I know if you hover or stay too close, continuous tracking will 'balance out' the target). After about a half dozen passes it no longer reported the staple at all. The only way I could get it to see the staple again was to turn the machine OFF, then ON essentially rebooting/resetting the ground tracking (I suppose).

Is the reason it stopped "seeing" the target because in the absence of swinging the coil over anything with mass (soil) makes the circuit especially prone to be desensitized to the target by repeated passes? I thought as long as you swept well past the coil with the target that would not happen. But is it because it was an air test with nothing for the circuit to "see" that it de-sensitized itself after a few passes?

On soil I never noticed it doing that, and as long as I swept well past a target, the machine would keep "seeing" that target each time the coil passed over it.

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