Manticore Headphone Option Experimentation/experiences

[GB_Amateur]

I've only gotten out with the Manticore for a bit over 2 hours in the wild and only a few minutes in the test garden so I have insufficient time to report on my new detector's performance.  But in the still questionable weather I have been able to do some indoor testing and headphones are one of my targets.  I go through the options, starting with the most important(?):

1) ML105 wireless headphones (included).  I was able to use these in the field.  Much better than the Equinox 800's stock ML80's, IMO.  First off from a comfort standpoint they are over-ear (and I have not so small ears 😁).  Second, they don't clamp on my head like a vice, nor are they so loose they fall off.  A goldilocks fit (so far) in my case.  The sound is also good, and again much better to my taste than the ML80's were.  I didn't notice any dropouts, either, from positioning, body shielding, etc.  Very important to me is latency and I didn't notice any.  Yeah!!  AFAIK ML hasn't reported a latency spec but I seem to have been pretty picky with latency for the ML80 APTX LL option (~40 ms) so either I didn't have those set up right or these new APTX 5.x LE's that Minelab has configured are faster than that.  Finally, they are lightweight.  Everything seems good so far.

2) Garrett Z-Lynk T/R pair.  These work fine with my Sunray Pro Golds although the volume is low compared to the ML105's.  (I didn't check the ML105 volume settings but the fact they need to be charged makes me think they have a built-in amplifier.)  I maxed out the volume setting on the Z-Lynk WR-1 (receiver) module but with the Manticore's volume level at 21 out of 25 (where I ran the ML105's) it was too low.  I did crank that up to the max (25) and they were fine, but I prefer having some headroom.

3a) OK, now what about wired headphones.  First off, as was the case (I reported that in another recent post) with the Equinox 800, I found that most right angled 3.5 mm plugs don't fit into the deep socket on the Manticore, either.  You either need to search around for one that does or use a straight plug -- not ideal IMO.

3b) Using a 3.5 mm male to 1/4" female adapter I was able to test my collection of headphones.  Here are the ones that worked:  Koss UR30, White's Prostar, Garett MS-2, Bose SoundSport earbuds.  That's the good news.

3c) My Sunray Pro Golds with the yellow knob (these are NOT the CTX3030 version which I think has a red knob) did not work.  I could configure the two Pro Gold switches to silence the Manticore control units internal speaker but even then could just barely hear tones.  (More on this below).  I had just recently (also reported here) replaced the stock Pro Gold 1/4" plug with a straight 3.5 mm plug hoping this would make them compatible with the Manticore.  Interestingly that solution *does* work in the Equinox 800's WM08 module (which I remind you is proprietary wireless not compatible with the Manticore).  But when I just checked to see if my Pro Golds work when plugged directly into the Equinox 800, that failed identically to the way it did with the Manticore.  BTW, one more set of headphones had the same problem -- those were a generic set I bought from Garrett in 2015 (no model # that I could find) which I had removed one of the speakers to make my own "poor man's" Rattlers.

OK, back to the Pro Golds.  I tried using the included (with Manticore) waterproof(?) plug cord and a 3.5 mm female to 3.5 mm female adapter on the other end (a 3.5 mm male meant to plug into the ML105 in case its battery goes dead).  Thaat didn't work, either.  Below is a Minelab Knowledge Base report on headphone incompatibility (and their proposed solutions) for the CTX3030:

My next attempt will be to BYO 3.5 mm female stereo to 3.5 mm female mono adapter similar to the lower recommemdation above to see if that will allow my to use the Pro Golds mated to the waterproof plugged cord -- an extra long cord solution at that!  Parts arrive Monday.  Stay tuned.

[Chase Goldman]

Chuck,

Great report.  Glad you like those included wireless phones.

Regarding the "waterproof" ML headhone adapter, ML states that the plug end can be submerged but obviously the jack end where you plug your wired phones cannot be submerged (especially in salt water) and probably should not be exposed to a steady rain.

Regarding the non-CTX compatible version Pro Golds, a good recap of the incompatibility of those phones with the Equinox (and by extension, Manticore) headphone jack was documented extensively in your 2019 Equinox thread here:

https://www.detectorprospector.com/forums/forum/53-minelab-equinox-forum/

 

[GB_Amateur]

On 3/12/2023 at 1:33 PM, GB_Amateur said:

My next attempt will be to BYO 3.5 mm female stereo to 3.5 mm female mono adapter similar to the lower recommemdation above to see if that will allow my to use the Pro Golds mated to the waterproof plugged cord -- an extra long cord solution at that!  Parts arrive Monday.  Stay tuned.

Success.  Here is what I did:

I bought four identical panel-mount jacks (3.5 mm female) as shown before and after assembly.  I soldered together the lugs corresponding to the associated plugs' central pins.  I then soldered the other four lugs (associated with the plugs' middle band and upper=common band) all together.  This is effectively what the last sketch in the Minelab Knowledge Base article shows -- turning stereo into mono.  Here are all the pieces (sans Manticore):

That's a lot of cord!  The downside is that any stereo output audio the Manticore sends is turned into Mono.  But is there stereo audio??  (I think there may have been speculation this is occurring in some instances.)

Keep in mind this option is down the list.  And assuming Minelab's software doesn't limit Bluetooth devices that can be attached wirelessly, as Phrunt has pointed out, we should soon get multiple audio device options -- low latency wireless headphones, earbuds, and probably receivers that allow headphones to be plugged into them.

Bottom line is that we already have multiple acceptable audio solutions with hopefully even more to come.

[Dug D]

I hope you are correct about the BT, but I have found no reference to BT in the Manticore manual and found printed elsewhere that they are not Blue Tooth compatible. 

I  checked the 900 manual no mention and note the missing BT symbols on the control heads.

Manual says this below.  (I ordered a transmitter already, hope it works well)

[GB_Amateur]

1 hour ago, Dug D said:

I have found... printed elsewhere that they are not Blue Tooth compatible.

Care to provide details?  If you mean they aren't campatible with Bluetooth 4.x, that seems to be a gimme.  But it's kinda like saying a car isn't compatibie with bias ply tires.  That's old technology.

 

[Chase Goldman]

2 hours ago, GB_Amateur said:

Care to provide details?  If you mean they aren't campatible with Bluetooth 4.x, that seems to be a gimme.  But it's kinda like saying a car isn't compatibie with bias ply tires.  That's old technology.

 

He's probably referring to the thread below.  Even though the Manticore and Nox 700/900 Headphones utilize a Nordic Semiconductor System on a Chip that is known to support BT LE Audio and the LC3 codec, the headphones (and also the Manticore and Nox 700/900 transmitters) do not appear to be BT 5.X compliant because they don't fall back to the standard SBC codec when paired with devices such as cell phones that don't support the LC3 codec, which is what they should do if fully compliant.  So this does not bode well for third party BT LE Audio accessories that support the low latency LC3 codec being compatible with these latest ML detectors.  I also picked up a pair of BT LE Audio/LC3 codec compatible earbuds (Anker Soundcore VR P10's and cannot get my Nox 900 to pair with them at all.  Not looking good.

 

 

[Sinclair]

3 hours ago, Chase Goldman said:

Not looking good

Seems like the whole LC3 / BT LE thing still walks in baby shoes.. who knows, if they're just not compatible.

How ever, for me that's all to vague. I can't really understand, why they've ditched the module, or at least make that thing compatible to something else. I don't like the idea of using a transmitter. Another thing to charge, problematic in the surf.. even if I don't hunt with the controlbox submerged, the detector falls into the water every now and then.

For me the headphones thingy is still the biggest thing, which keeps me from ordering this detector.

[TampaBayBrad]

I realize the M-105's are not waterproof, but I rarely venture into surf heavy enough to be splashing my headphones. The stock phones are fine with me for use wireless on the sand or knee deep water or wired with the supplied cord if I want to go deeper and dunk the control housing.

But....I only hunt for 3-4 hours at a time. If comfort during an 8 hour hunt is why you guys want options, I can see that in the heat of the summer.

What are the reasons for not using the stock phones other than not being waterproof? I did notice they get noisy in heavy wind.

[GB_Amateur]

6 minutes ago, TampaBayBrad said:

If comfort during an 8 hour hunt is why you guys want options, I can see that in the heat of the summer.

What are the reasons for not using the stock phones other than not being waterproof? I did notice they get noisy in heavy wind.

You've hit on a couple -- comfort (whether that simply be the fit or as you note, hot weather) and how well they block out external noise.  I have a couple hunting spots that are next to busy streets.  Even the SunRay ProGolds which are among the best at passive noise attenuation still let some noise in.  My other headphones are way worse in that regard.  But some people prefer hearing outside sounds so as not be surprised by creatures, both the four- and even two-legged varieties.

Another issue we won't know for a while is how durable these ML105's are, and how much they will cost to replace.  You may be aware that the ML80's were significantly more expensive bought from Minelab than were their identical twins available from various internet outlets.  But if the ML105's are proprietary....

Sound quality differences between headphones is another potential reasons for going a different direction.  That was easy for me (and some others) to notice with the ML80's.  So far (with very limited experience) the ML105's sound good to me, though.

 

[Dug D]

I am pretty sure I sniped this off of the Minelab site back on January 5th.

Recently I have looked everywhere for a reference to "BT anything" on the Manticore, and find nothing.

Either its not BT or they are keeping it a secret.  Bluetooth is trademarked (I think) I am pretty sure they have to say if they are using it and note it with the correct TM logo ? 

I know I might be on a island all by myself at the moment, but I've been there before.