Some Thoughts On The New Ver 1.0 Ability To Change Max Fmf For Any Factory Program

[Chase Goldman]

I was starting to think about how the ability to adjust Max FMF for any Factory Program might affect our ability to better customize Deus II FMF for just about any situation and to better visualize the similarity between base Factory Program capabilities with the additional degree of freedom this new feature proivides.  First I had to organize the programs into a specific hierarchy.

It is a work in progress but it basically racks out as follows:

FMF or Selectable Single Frequency (Under Single we only have Program 7 - Mono)

Under FMF there are basically Three Groups

Disc Process (e.g., all the non-salt, discrimination programs such as General, Sensitive, Park, Deep HC)

IAR Process (i.e., Gold Field and Relic)

Disc - Salt Process (i.e., Dive, Beach, and Beach Sensitive)

Under 2 of the 3 base processes above you have two categories (Note: Disc - Salt only uses Conductive soil subtraction)

Frequency Addition (Disc Example: Sensitive; IAR Example: Gold Field; Disc - Salt Example: None) or Conductive Soil Subtraction (Disc Example: General; IAR Example: Relic; Disc - Salt Example: Diving)

Finally, under each of these processes you can select one of 3 Max FMF Frequencies: 14, 24, or 40

In tabular form it looks like this:

MAX FMF FREQ (kHz)	FAST MULTI-FREQUENCY (FMF)						SEL SINGLE FREQ
	DISC		IAR		SALT		MONO - 7
	ADD	SUB	ADD	SUB	ADD	SUB
14	DEEP HC - 6	X	X	X	N/A	DIVING - 10
24	PARK - 5	X	X	RELIC - 9	N/A	BEACH - 11
40	SENSITIVE/FT/FAST - 2, 3, 4	GENERAL - 1	GOLD FIELD - 8	X	N/A	BEACH SENS - 12

Sorry about the clunky formatting, but just trying to do this fast on the fly.

The X's mark areas that are not covered by a default Factory Program.  So, for example, you can create a custom Silver Slayer variant that can perhaps deal better with wet soil (conductive soil subtraction) by using General and set MAX FMF to 14.  Similarly, per this table it appears that Silver Slayer using FAST with MAX FMF changed to 14 as the base program or using DEEP HC with the same Reactivity Setting as Fast as the base program should behave identically.  

Similarly, you can perhaps better chase micro targets in wet soil by using Relic with FMF Max set to 40.  Or maybe Gold Field set to 24 or 14 might do well better for relic hunting than relic under different soil moisture conditions or different iron pollution levels.  Definitely, room for experimentation here.

Also, notice, that none of the Dive/Beach programs have a frequency addition counterpart.  This makes sense, because the whole point is to subtract out salt soil conductivity.  So on dry sand, you might be better off using an inland program (just as is recommended in the Deus 2 User Guide).

Finally, another thing to keep in mind, since you can now vary Max FMF Frequency is that battery drain will be mostly dependent on the FMF Max frequency you select, with the lower FMF Max frequencies (not just with Deep HC or Diving) causing higher battery drain.  I noticed that the battery drain table in the User Guide was not updated to reflect this. FWIW.

Welcome your comments and thoughts on this.

[TJ Jeepguy]

I was thinking along those lines today. My custom program assortment got simplified with the advent of max frequency choice.  The names of my current custom programs I’m tinkering with for land hunting are simply “freqadd, soilsub, vcoadd, vcosub”.  I think that frequency addition and soil subtraction have not been given enough thought by many users, but can make a huge difference. 

[JCR]

Chase,  Your perception/thought process should hold true even if there are some differences in the filtering/processing of the signal between the search programs that are unknown.  This added ability to limit the max frequency is going to prove very useful for users that take the time to "think" out how they approach a site based on actual conditions. Wet, conductive ground, especially combined with high mineralization or heavy decomposed iron(rusty ground) is a real challenge many do not consider enough.  When you get your Program table in a more finalized form showing the possible combinations you will have a powerful tool.

[Calmark]

Great analysis and similar to what has occurred to me the past few days while out using v1.0 for around 8 hours now.  Nice to visualize the various combinations in table form, so thanks for that.

People are definitely going to have to watch their coil battery level more. Just yesterday, I realized I had been in 14khz General program for near an hour. I nearly always avoid DHC P6 since it drains the coil charge pretty fast. I forgot I had changed to 14khz, but luckily I started the day on a full charge and was close to home, ao no harm done. I can see people now forgetting what freq offset they are in for long periods of time and perhaps use the unintended one while swinging or draining a battery faster than expected, so we all have to watch out!

Another parrallel that occured to me, and will make sense to Nokta Legend users,is the new offset frequencies for the Deus 2 are similar to how Legend users can toggle M1, M2, and M3 and select their preferred frequency weightings. Most are additive, but M3 is designed to be ground subtractive. The new Park M3 is like the D2 in DHC with its low weighting, and hard-hitting on high conductors.  Some food for thought for any Legend owners contemplating getting a D2 in the future. 

[TJ Jeepguy]

3 minutes ago, JCR said:

Chase,  Your perception/thought process should hold true even if there are some differences in the filtering/processing of the signal between the search programs that are unknown.  This added ability to limit the max frequency is going to prove very useful for users that take the time to "think" out how they approach a site based on actual conditions. Wet, conductive ground, especially combined with high mineralization or heavy decomposed iron(rusty ground) is a real challenge many do not consider enough.  When you get your Program table in a more finalized form showing the possible combinations you will have a powerful tool.

Yes.  The rusty ground scenario is one of the main reasons why I mainly ended up using General as my go to  base program.  Rusty bits along with coal ash even in fairly dry ground can really affect things.  
 

 

[CPT_GhostLight]

Excellent food for thought, Chase! I feel like there are other differences in some of the programs, such as which lower frequencies may be in use for each. I think the Sensi/Fast programs are probably the same base frequency weightings but I could be wrong. Regardless, I can see the potential in your concept and realize the advantages to that line of thinking when creating programs for different scenarios. More tools for the kit and more experimenting to be done. 😎 

[CPT_GhostLight]

26 minutes ago, Calmark said:

...

People are definitely going to have to watch their coil battery level more. Just yesterday, I realized I had been in 14khz General program for near an hour. I nearly always avoid DHC P6 since it drains the coil charge pretty fast. I forgot I had changed to 14khz, but luckily I started the day on a full charge and was close to home, ao no harm done. I can see people now forgetting what freq offset they are in for long periods of time and perhaps use the unintended one while swinging or draining a battery faster than expected, so we all have to watch out!

...

I'm all out of likes today, Calmark, so thanks for pointing out the power consumption issue with using the lower 14 KHz Max Frequency. I didn't even think about that and will have to keep an eye on that like I do with Deep HC. Cheers! 😎

[Carolina]

Anybody have issues pairing the WSAll XL phones or issues with the WSA ll update ?

[F350Platinum]

38 minutes ago, Carolina said:

Anybody have issues pairing the WSAll XL phones or issues with the WSA ll update ?

I did not have any problems updating 2 pairs of them yesterday, but I did try to connect them today and could not. I was trying some other methods and ran into that. Could be because they were already updated 🤔

[Chase Goldman]

2 hours ago, TJ Jeepguy said:

I was thinking along those lines today. My custom program assortment got simplified with the advent of max frequency choice.  The names of my current custom programs I’m tinkering with for land hunting are simply “freqadd, soilsub, vcoadd, vcosub”.  I think that frequency addition and soil subtraction have not been given enough thought by many users, but can make a huge difference. 

Along those lines,  I kind of wish they they flexed back on the Base Factory Default Programs to a bare minimum that would give us the basic base program building blocks necessary to branch out and create the custom programs suited to our needs.  The reason being, that you can free up slots for saving additional custom prorams.

To that Point The Base Factory Default Programs Could be Distilled Down To:

1 - General - Subtraction - 24 khz

2 - Sensitive - Addition - 40 khz (As a minimum, the existing Sensitive FT and Fast Factory Programs which are both based on Sensitive are somewhat redundant and just take up program slots).

3 - Deep - Addition - 14 khz (not essential if covered by Program 2 above)

4 - Mono

5 - Gold Field - Addition - 40 khz

6 - Relic - Subtraction - 24 khz

7 - Deep Salt - 14 khz

8 - Sensitive Salt - 40 khz (not essential - covered by 7 above)

Freeing up an additional 4 to 6 Custom Program Slots.

If I could request an additional Program it would be Mono variant of the Gold Field/Relic process.

Also, the manual input of Custom Programs works but is tedious without a full keyboard for alphanumeric character inputs.

On the long-term wishlist:  Either provide a means to enter custom programs via phone or computer interface.  It is good that custom programs are not wiped after minor version updates.  So, hoping if a minor bugfix version is issued in short order (e.g., ver. 1.1) thet my custom programs are not wiped during the update.