Equinox Good For Trashy Parks Or Not???

[unearth]

Went to a local So. Cal. park this morning, and boy what a workout! I'm not sure the Nox is the right machine for a modern trashy park. In some area's of the park the Nox was sounding off like a machine gun. I tried P1, P2, F1, F2, 5 tone, 50 tone, 0 GB, manual GB, auto GB, recovery at 5, 6, 7 and IB at 3, 4, 5. It seems no matter what I tried, I couldn't get the machine to quiet down. It might just be too much trash. I couldn't keep up with the Noxs' noise. I got tired of trying to distinguish good target sounds from bad target sounds, so after two hours my head couldn't take it anymore so I just gave up and headed home. 

Anybody got any ideas on the best way to handle this type of park? Or, is it best to just pass it by?

Thanks in advance for any help in this area.

[Chase Goldman]

Actually, set up properly, the Equinox is the PERFECT tool for a trashy park, if you hope to snag keepers that would otherwise be masked by the trash, due to its high (and adjustable) recovery speed.  If you are not hearing the machine gun bursts of trash target then you are not going to hear the keepers either because the silence you would hear with slower detectors is just the recovery circuit playing catch up while you pass the coil over that keeper target.  Some suggestions:

First of all, you need to figure out what your objective is.  Grab all jewelry, nickels, clad, and silver.  Or just cherry pick the high conductors.  That will tell you what mode to use.  For example, if the trash is indeed modern (i.e., aluminum can slaw, pull tabs, freshness tops, twist tops, crown caps) then just try notch out everything below 20 and go for the clad and silver because you will be hard pressed to pick out the gold rings and nickels amongst all that mid-teen stuff without a trained ear (after awhile you can start to tell the difference between a nickel and a pull tab and a gold ring and a crown cap by tonal quality) and will just be digging it all.   Sure you will give up on gold and nickels, but you will lower the audio fatigue as you just listen for the the high conductors to ring out.  If you are just going to cherry pick high conductors, then keep it in Park 1.  Depending on the ferrous situation you might want to consider lowering the iron bias as that may exacerbate high conductor masking in iron, but that will also create more iron falsing.   Avoid the "2" Park/Field modes if there is a lot of modern mid-teen trash, those modes which are optimized for mid-conductors and you will just hit that trash harder.  

Key is DO NOT MODE HOP and DO NOT TONE HOP.  Pick an objective, pick a search mode and stick with it otherwise you will drive yourself insane.  The only time I will switch modes during a hunt is if I want to use an alternate mode to interrogate a specific target (i.e., see how the target sounds in Park 2 vs. Park 1 for example for a mid teen target.  Pick the tone setup that you are most comfortable with.  I prefer 50 tones because it gives me a lot more information about the target than just a visual number.  I think of TID number as a Black and White television - sure you get a single tone corresponding to that number in 50 tones but the audio "quality" not just tone gives you so much more information than a number.  Is the tone sharp or pinging with steep rising an falling edges (likely coin) or is it soft an long (freshness cap) or distorted (bent pull tab) or unstable and flutey (rusted crown cap).  Just a wealth of info - I call that Color TV!   5 tones gives you less audio fatigue but also less information, it is like having a TID display with 5 numbers on it.  You need to decide which is the best tone setup for you, learn it and stick with it.

Other strategies to consider to reduce fatigue:

• Consider lowering sensitivity.  If the park is really trashy, it is likely that keepers missed by other detectorists with slow machines are just sitting there at the same shallow trash depth.  No need to light up the machine with all that trash and ground noise as the higher conductive targets will be "visible" even with lower sensitivities.  Also, avoid the tendancy to lower reovery speed to compensate for the depth loss as that will likely just result in more ground noise plus you will lose a key performance attribute that enables you to separate the keepers from the trash.
• Consider hunting in single frequency (5 khz).  People have run some single frequency tests and have found that running single frequency at 5 khz really helps shallow high conductors pop out of the trash vs. multi IQ.   Give it a go and see what you think.  Be advised though, once you go single frequency - it doesn't really matter which mode you are in as the only thing that then differentiates the Park and Field modes are the different user settings.  It is the unique multi IQ profile (including the multifrequency weighting and target signal processing) that gives each of the Park/Field modes their unique personality.  You also lose some other "performance" enhancements that Multi IQ brings to the table like precise and forgiving ground balancing, no iron bias setting is available in single frequency mode, and of course, if you use the lower single frequency, you will be less optimized for mid conductive keeper targets too (besides the mid-conductive trash).  But that is what metal detecting is all about - managing and balancing the tradeoffs.
• Consider removing some of that trash.  Getting the trash out of the way will help uncover even deeper, older targets.  This takes a lot of time (and multiple visits), effort, and finesse.  You don't want to be digging up the entire park and destroying the landscape, but if you have a large beer can impeding your view, then by all means get it out of there.  Use pinpoint to interrogate probable trash targets to get an idea of depth and size of the trash and make a call as to whether it makes sense to get rid of it to see what else may be hiding there.

HTH  HH

[GB_Amateur]

Wow!  I vote for Steve H. to add this post to the compendium of Equinox tips.  My favorite quote of all (but it was a difficult choice) is:

19 hours ago, Chase Goldman said:

If you are not hearing the machine gun bursts of trash target then you are not going to hear the keepers either because the silence you would hear with slower detectors is just the recovery circuit playing catch up while you pass the coil over that keeper target.

IMO, target masking is still the bane of coin and relic hunting.  The Equinox has made significant strides in the right direction, but the problem isn't solved yet.  Keep working, detector engineers!

I have to give my 'honorable mention' award to one more quote:

19 hours ago, Chase Goldman said:

Consider removing some of that trash.

Detectors are going to respond preferentially to the strongest target in the field of view.  Sometimes that target is so strong that it masks desirable targets.  This has been true since Adam and Eve started using metal detectors, and it's still true today even with these lightning fast recovery speeds.  It's not just large iron and aluminum cans that are the culprits.  Sometimes modern coins mask the older, deeper coins.  I hate Zincolns but I recover them just in case they are hiding the stuff I really want.

[Happa54]

Hey Unearth.....Haha !!! Reminds me of my 1st day out with the Nox. 

I too hunt the So Cal (Los Angeles) polluted parks. My first day out there it sounded like machine gun fire through my earphones.

Coming from the ML Safari, which is a much slower machine, I couldn't believe the quickness in its recovery speed. It was overwhelming and I immediately didn't like the machine. It was just too fast for me. But I will say this... I did get a merc and an injun my first day out irrespective of my frustrations with it. 

Take the advice of Chase & GB.... they have given you some suggestions and comments that are above my understanding of the Nox. As for me, I just slug it out in these parks and try to train my brain to tones and depth.

In real heavy trash, I block out mid-conductors but leave 12/13 open (nickels and gold). This for me calms the machine down cuz it eliminates a lot of the pulltabs you are hearing. This way I can hear more high conductor targets and cherry pick from them. Even still, you will hear the screw caps, rusted iron etc. But this is where you listen and learn the tones as there is a slight but noticeable difference from these and coins.  In light trash, I just go all metal so I can hear it all as a way to train my brain to the tones & targets. 

You will get better at it as time goes by simply by getting to know your Nox (as with any machine).

 

[Chase Goldman]

1 hour ago, Happa54 said:

In real heavy trash, I block out mid-conductors but leave 12/13 open (nickels and gold). This for me calms the machine down cuz it eliminates a lot of the pulltabs you are hearing. This way I can hear more high conductor targets and cherry pick from them.

That is a good tip I should have added to my post.

[UtahRich]

Unearth,

I’m impressed with the ability of the 800 to sort through dense park trash. 

The 800 audio can certainly pound the brain unless you do something about the sounds of those unwanted targets. Early on I stumbled on this YouTube video by Dirtfishin. 

I took the ideas and adapted them for my trashy park hunting. It got me started on the right track of taking advantage of the equinox features of changing tone and volumes of various target ID’s to allow me to hunt the trashed areas without getting a headache. I can change tones and volumes on the equinox so that unwanted targets are a pleasant low freq tone that’s also very low in volume, then make the ID’s of wanted targets stand out with higher tones and increased audio.

Good targets literally jump out at you and stop you in your tracks to investigate.

If there is little trash, and my brain isn’t getting pounded, I can go back to Park 2 with multi-tones which I prefer for general hunting and coinshooting .

good luck

Rich (Utah)

 

 

[Chase Goldman]

9 hours ago, Rich (Utah) said:

Unearth,

I’m impressed with the ability of the 800 to sort through dense park trash. 

The 800 audio can certainly pound the brain unless you do something about the sounds of those unwanted targets. Early on I stumbled on this YouTube video by Dirtfishin. 

I took the ideas and adapted them for my trashy park hunting. It got me started on the right track of taking advantage of the equinox features of changing tone and volumes of various target ID’s to allow me to hunt the trashed areas without getting a headache. I can change tones and volumes on the equinox so that unwanted targets are a pleasant low freq tone that’s also very low in volume, then make the ID’s of wanted targets stand out with higher tones and increased audio.

Good targets literally jump out at you and stop you in your tracks to investigate.

If there is little trash, and my brain isn’t getting pounded, I can go back to Park 2 with multi-tones which I prefer for general hunting and coinshooting .

good luck

Rich (Utah)

 

 

Just for clarity - if you are working in 50 tones you cannot do the above as the breaks and volumes are set other than the delta between the iron and non-ferrous tones and the ferrous to non-ferrous break.  If you want to do this in a mode that defaults to 50 tones (like Park 2 or Field 2), then the first thing you need to do is shift to 5 tones then follow the instructions above.  Other than that, I do not customize tones as I am a 50-tones guy so I am the wrong person to ask on the details to how the above gets done, but the video lays it out pretty well.

[flakmagnet]

 Chase, thanks for pointing out that you need to shift to 5 tones in programs that default to 50 tones, if you are going to use Dirtfishing's video which imho is one of the clearest and most easily implimented ways of learning the Equinox.

 

[UtahRich]

1 hour ago, Chase Goldman said:

Just for clarity - if you are working in 50 tones you cannot do the above as the breaks and volumes are set other than the delta between the iron and non-ferrous tones and the ferrous to non-ferrous break.  If you want to do this in a mode that defaults to 50 tones (like Park 2 or Field 2), then the first thing you need to do is shift to 5 tones then follow the instructions above.  Other than that, I do not customize tones as I am a 50-tones guy so I am the wrong person to ask on the details to how the above gets done, but the video lays it out pretty well.

 

I'm a 50 tones guy too. Actually, I've been an audio Target ID fan since I bought my first Target ID machine, a Teknetics Mark I, back in the mid-80's. I continued with the Minelab FBS series beginning with the Explorer XS when they first came out. I'm with you on the tones. I am most comfortable with them and like I stated above, it is my go-to for general hunting.

So why try this other method ?     It Works in the conductive trash.

Rich (Utah)

 

 

[NCtoad]

19 hours ago, Chase Goldman said:

Actually, set up properly, the Equinox is the PERFECT tool for a trashy park, if you hope to snag keepers that would otherwise be masked by the trash, due to its high (and adjustable) recovery speed.  If you are not hearing the machine gun bursts of trash target then you are not going to hear the keepers either because the silence you would hear with slower detectors is just the recovery circuit playing catch up while you pass the coil over that keeper target.  Some suggestions:

First of all, you need to figure out what your objective is.  Grab all jewelry, nickels, clad, and silver.  Or just cherry pick the high conductors.  That will tell you what mode to use.  For example, if the trash is indeed modern (i.e., aluminum can slaw, pull tabs, freshness tops, twist tops, crown caps) then just try notch out everything below 20 and go for the clad and silver because you will be hard pressed to pick out the gold rings and nickels amongst all that mid-teen stuff without a trained ear (after awhile you can start to tell the difference between a nickel and a pull tab and a gold ring and a crown cap by tonal quality) and will just be digging it all.   Sure you will give up on gold and nickels, but you will lower the audio fatigue as you just listen for the the high conductors to ring out.  If you are just going to cherry pick high conductors, then keep it in Park 1.  Depending on the ferrous situation you might want to consider lowering the iron bias as that may exacerbate high conductor masking in iron, but that will also create more iron falsing.   Avoid the "2" Park/Field modes if there is a lot of modern mid-teen trash, those modes which are optimized for mid-conductors and you will just hit that trash harder.  

Key is DO NOT MODE HOP and DO NOT TONE HOP.  Pick an objective, pick a search mode and stick with it otherwise you will drive yourself insane.  The only time I will switch modes during a hunt is if I want to use an alternate mode to interrogate a specific target (i.e., see how the target sounds in Park 2 vs. Park 1 for example for a mid teen target.  Pick the tone setup that you are most comfortable with.  I prefer 50 tones because it gives me a lot more information about the target than just a visual number.  I think of TID number as a Black and White television - sure you get a single tone corresponding to that number in 50 tones but the audio "quality" not just tone gives you so much more information than a number.  Is the tone sharp or pinging with steep rising an falling edges (likely coin) or is it soft an long (freshness cap) or distorted (bent pull tab) or unstable and flutey (rusted crown cap).  Just a wealth of info - I call that Color TV!   5 tones gives you less audio fatigue but also less information, it is like having a TID display with 5 numbers on it.  You need to decide which is the best tone setup for you, learn it and stick with it.

Other strategies to consider to reduce fatigue:

• Consider lowering sensitivity.  If the park is really trashy, it is likely that keepers missed by other detectorists with slow machines are just sitting there at the same shallow trash depth.  No need to light up the machine with all that trash and ground noise as the higher conductive targets will be "visible" even with lower sensitivities.  Also, avoid the tendancy to lower reovery speed to compensate for the depth loss as that will likely just result in more ground noise plus you will lose a key performance attribute that enables you to separate the keepers from the trash.
• Consider hunting in single frequency (5 khz).  Tnsharpshooter and others have run some single frequency tests and have found that running single frequency at 5 khz really helps shallow high conductors pop out of the trash vs. multi IQ.   Give it a go and see what you think.  Be advised though, once you go single frequency - it doesn't really matter which mode you are in as the only thing that then differentiates the Park and Field modes are the different user settings.  It is the unique multi IQ profile (including the multifrequency weighting and target signal processing) that gives each of the Park/Field modes their unique personality.  You also lose some other "performance" enhancements that Multi IQ brings to the table like precise and forgiving ground balancing, no iron bias setting is available in single frequency mode, and of course, if you use the lower single frequency, you will be less optimized for mid conductive keeper targets too (besides the mid-conductive trash).  But that is what metal detecting is all about - managing and balancing the tradeoffs.
• Consider removing some of that trash.  Getting the trash out of the way will help uncover even deeper, older targets.  This takes a lot of time (and multiple visits), effort, and finesse.  You don't want to be digging up the entire park and destroying the landscape, but if you have a large beer can impeding your view, then by all means get it out of there.  Use pinpoint to interrogate probable trash targets to get an idea of depth and size of the trash and make a call as to whether it makes sense to get rid of it to see what else may be hiding there.

HTH  HH

What a great post and I agree with everything said especially lowering sensitivity.  The OP never stated what sense he was using, but I suspect it was at least the factory default of 20.  Lots of times I go down to 15 or 16 and still have dug coins at 7-8".  And if you're looking for gold, you can probably go lower than that...most modern gold dropped in parks and ballfields isn't very deep...at least the gold I've found.  

On another note, Chase, are you the guy that wrote the Equinox book?