Hi Fred, Thanks for the info. Ive heard the 4500 dont discriminate very well past six inches but its to use on the fields thats bashed out. Ive got some really good permissions thats had alot of the trash took out so signals are few and far between. The problem im having now is depth, my detector is struggling to get good signals past 14''. and theres loads of iffy signals and when ive dug them they've turned out to be small Roman silvers and deep hammered silver. so there's still quite a few good finds there to be found. Thats why i thought by getting one of these machines i wouldn't miss anything if its there to be found. Ive heard the CTX units are good but do you know what sort of depths can be achieved on small silvers and gold because the Etrac which ive heard for friends is nearly on par with the CTX but struggles on the deep gold. Theres nothing wrong with them and not to upset anyone who uses these detectors there all top machines just with different strengths and weakneses thats all. Paul