auminesweeper

Them Mozzie's can ruin a good day out, Had them Call A Halt to A Fishing spot Once, They were Big Scotch Greys, Big Critters, The Only Difference between them and an F16 was the F16 had a Gas Cap Underneath,

 

Trouble with Notching Pull Tabs is they can come In where small Gold Lives and over here Hammered Coins come in At And there are so many types of them And they have the same Signature as our most wanted Items

 

But that's real Impressive getting that Kind of Depth In such Hot Ground, I use the Two Tone setting on my Machine because I don't have to think about the Sounds, Its either a Dig or No Dig which helps In junk Infested Sites,

 

Here's Why Pull Tabs are Such A Pain,

 

John

Ouch, That's A Problem, I have not come across Ground Like that, YET

 

How it the 705 managing in that Ground??

 

John

It Beats me how the most expensive detector made for our use is Made of such Brittle Plastic and breaks into pieces is beyond me, If this happened 5 or 10 years from now the blame could be put down to aging but this is just Crazy, Over here the ZED costs 16,600 AUD or 13,416 USD.

 

I don't think I would be quite as Patient with Minelab.

That's A Beautiful Specie/Nugget Steve, Congrats WTG.

After seeing my mate bring out An MXT and Put my Detectors to Shame Got me Interested in the MXTs and when I read your posts back on AMD 5 years ago Convinced me even more so,

Then A Minelab Official Told me that They reversed engineered the MXT when they were Building the Xterra Machines Confirmed how good they Are, I still Can't find Anything that Equals It, And Like Many Here How can you Judge A machine that Finds Gold the First Time Out with It.

Since then I have Had the MXT 300, The MXT Pro and Now The MXT All Pro, I don't know if it is the Coil, But this One Seems to Be the Hottest One to Date and to the Point there is Not much difference between it and my GMT, And I have of 2 or 3000 hours in with the MXTs and I am now at the Point where If I can't have an MXT then my Kit is Incomplete,

But Like you Steve, I have been thinking about Whites Putting On The + & - Buttons for a Manual GB and then that would Be As good as any Machine could Get

Thanks again Steve,

John

Yeah I love it...I love it so much I just sold my gb2 because I never use it anymore..it literally had dust on it... Lol lol lol

 

 

I can understand that, This Fors Gold is filling the Gaps between Coin Machines and Prospecting Machines, Which makes me wonder where the Fors Cores Fits In,

Seems like it certainly has the power and it sounds like it is easy to get carried away with it, Maybe Steve can through some light on the subject??

 

I do like that machine,

 

John

I have a different # setting ... I run my Nokta in boost mode with the sensitivity at around 80-85 and my discrimination at 5-8... Lowering my sensitivity a little at a time to take away some but not all of the ground noise... With the smallest coil on this machine I have dug atleast close to a ft for a square nail and over 6 inches for a piece of foil the size of a half dollar.. I thought I hit the big one that day...lol lol I've tried the general mose which is all metal mode on this machine and way too much work steadily every 2 ft resetting it.. I found that boost mode gets me greater depth and hits a target dead on... I'm still learning though and having fun doing it...

Foil is always going to be A Killer, So I am wondering how it would ID Targets if you run it with less or no Boost and turned up the Gain, As Steve pointed out these Modern Machines Do Run Right On The Edge, But Sometimes that Can and will work against you,

john

Thanks for starting this Thread Steve Houston,

Oh My, what a Place to be In, Well Done Steve H, The Size of some of them Machines, Makes an ATX look like A Tooth Pick, I wonder How Many Batteries Per hour they Use,lol

I have Just Seen A Coils for that 66 TR on Ebay,

I would really love to play with those Machines,

John

Oooo That's Not Good, Breaking like that,

Sounds like you have your work cut out, I am Thinking a BCD might come in Handy with that Amount of Water, They it needs time to dry Out,

Still you can always work the Ground out side the Mine,

Good Luck,, John

Wow that makes all the sense I guess... Thnx again for the advice...this machine is doing great for me...best decision I ever made....ready to go other places with it.... Ready for the patch ...only cause everyone talks so much about it... Lol lol

Nugget65, When you have your Machine Set up as you Normally Hunt, IE:- running the Gain at 10- +1, Then Just Try Lowering the Gain to 9.5 ish and see if that Helps or Running at 10 Try It just above 9, Don't be Afraid to turn it Down  and learn to Trust the Machine, You will Be Surprised How Little Depth you will Loose IF ANY, But What This Will Do Is Allow Fainter Signals To Come Through, Because .Your Machine is Telling you that Junk Targets Are Good, It can Also do the opposite and On Small Iron Stained Nuggets it Can Tell You They Are Bad,

 

The MXT Is A Prime Example of that, YES It will work Running it Flat Out But you can Only Get away with doing that On Really Clean Ground, 

 

Hope This Helps,,, John.

 

Excellent point John!

 

Thanks Steve,  People Often Follow the Manuals Instruction, But they Only really Apply Under Average Conditions, In Hot Ground or Iron Infested / Roman Sites, High Gain Does and will work Against you,

A Friend of Mine and I were Both Running MXT's with the 12" Coils, I was running the Gain at 10+, He was Running the Gain at 6.5 - 7.0 and yet he pulled an English Half Penny At 13 / 13.5 Inches ( MEASURED ) But where He got a Nice Clear Normal But Soft ish Signal, My Signal was Booming and erratic with Iron signals Thrown in, And Yes I could hear it Because I knew it was there, But at normal Sweep Speeds I would have never of Heard it.. So I guess the perfect setting was somewhere in between Both of Our settings

 

So that taught me that just because my machine was not Falsing  or Chirping when it was Set At 10+ does not make it right for The Ground Conditions, and when A Person sets up the machine to the Point of Falsing and then Backs it Off they are only setting it up for EMI Stability and Not The Ground Conditions As In Mineralisation or Iron Infestation., That Power / Gain Knob Is A Harsh Mistress and she Wont be Abused, Turning it Up is Like a 70s Radio,,, When it Gets to about 3/4s on the Volume after that it Just Distorts,

 

Hope this Helps,,  John

Wow that makes all the sense I guess... Thnx again for the advice...this machine is doing great for me...best decision I ever made....ready to go other places with it.... Ready for the patch ...only cause everyone talks so much about it... Lol lol

I have found if you have the Gain up to High In Hot Ground that will make your DISC tell you targets are Good when they are in fact junk,

Some times I lower the Gain to check Targets when the signal start to fluctuate and I can't work out what it Is.

 

John

Correlating numbers from GMT to MXT is like correlating to the Gold Bug Pro. Different scales.

That is what is so confusing about them, A Person would think that A Company who Made them both would use a Universal system

 

When My GND's Numbers almost match the Ground balance ( Mineral Type ) yet the Black Sand is the Correct one to use yet it is Half the Value of the other machine,

IF I could find Fault with these two Machines it would be that the Prospect Mode Readings are Not Uniform.

 

Thanks Mate,, John

On 6/21/2015 at 0:26 PM, Steve Herschbach said:

The Mineralization Level is the same thing the GMT is trying to tell you with the Follow Black Sand reading. The MXT displays this number as GND is the prospecting Mode but gave it the wrong name to confuse people. GND as displayed on the MXT in Prospect mode is not the Ground Balance setting but is an indication of Mineralization Level.

 

whites-gmt-follow-black-sand.jpg

 

This is also what Fisher is doing with the Fe3O4 graph on the Gold Bug Pro and other models. All these are attempting to measure magnetic susceptibility. Ground Balance numbers are related to the ground phase reading and so are basically like a discrimination VDI number for the ground. Magnetic susceptibility is more directly related to detector performance. The higher the reading, the more problems you have with depth, but it hurts the discrimination side more than the all metal side of things as far as depth. it also is what will make a non-ferrous item read as ferrous. The higher the magnetic susceptibility, the more inaccurate the VDI numbers.

 

fisher-gold-bug-pro-fe3o4.jpg

 

Thanks Steve, That explains it Better, In the GMT Manual they have removed the Pages that Told you about following the Black Sand and just written  a couple of Paragraphs and its use's. john

Mineralization level readings (we are not talking ground balance numbers) are relative numbers and the number displayed by an MXT may be different than that displayed by a GMT over the same ground.

I can't say that I pay much attention to the numbers in reality. I detect the ground and respond to how the detector acts, not what the numbers say.

Yeah I don't take too much notice of them apart from when I first Ground Balance and Only if I think of it, But it is the difference In the different Readings of the 2 Coils on the same Machine that made me Question what we are lead to believe about coils,

 

John

This Is the Most Confusing thing about the MXT and the GMT, Because I just Tested the 2 Machines and The MXT's GND reading was Very Similar to The GMT's  Ground Balance (Mineral Type) Reading On The Left, Yet On the MXT you use That Number to Follow the Back Sand and with the GMT you use the Much Lower Reading On The Right to Follow the Black Sand,

 

IE on the MXT 85 is the Follow the Black Sand Reading and on the GMT the GB is 78 yet the Follow the Black Sand was Reading 46 - 48, It does not make sense when Comparing these sets of numbers,

 

I do not understand why One Machine  has a GND or Black Sand reading of 85 and the other One ( Amount of Mineral ) Says 46 - 48 and yet the GMT's GB reading is almost  the same AT 78.

 

Whites Need to Decide whether it is A GND or a Black Sand Reading The Two Can Not Be The Same On the MXT Because on the GMT The Black sand measures the Amount of Minerals

 

And On the MXT you have to Be In Tracking to Use That Meter and On The GMT the Follow the Black Sand Updates whether it is in Tracking or Fixed.

 

John

G'day All

I have just been Testing the GND readings On My MXT and My GMT and naturally they don't Match??

Anyway the MXT read 84 to 85, But the thing that has me Thinking Is with the GMT If I have the 6x10 Long Scan coil on it I get a reading of 65, but If I put the Twin D Coil on it I get A Reading of 78, So If DD's are meant to be Better In Hot Ground, Then why does the Concentric give A Lower Ground Phase Reading Than The DD,

I am starting to think that Concentric Coils are just as Good In Hot Ground BUT ??? because they are more sensitive that they pick up More Noise, And the fact that they are more Sensitive they Give A Truer Ground Reading??

I know that the 6X10 Long Scan see's things that you would normally find with the Little Shooter Coil, Which is another reason why the GB 2 Is So Hot on Tiny Gold.

But It is those GND Readings that are making me think this way.

John

Ground like that is not all that uncommon in California and the ground right here in Reno is almost as bad. Just loaded with magnetite. Ground balance reading is only part of the equation. It only tells you TYPE of mineralization. Use the Mineralization Level to determine the AMOUNT of mineralization. This is the more valid reading when talking about how bad ground is.

So Is that Reading the same as my GND on the MXT and On the Left hand Screen On The GMT which is the GB setting?

Thanks Steve,, john

Lol lol when I dig target the magnet on my pick has 3-5 little tiny rocks and is always full of sand

Struth, Well you Are doing extremely well with it, Considering that Ground Is PI Country, I'm Impressed.

There's not too many who would even try A VLF In Ground that Hot.

What sort of Depth are you finding your Targets??

Well done Nugget65

John

Up where I'm at in N. Cali the ground is real hot around old hydro mines.. When I ground balance the reading is usually around 79-85 and actually I hate mining them because of my lack of experience has me digging like a retarded rat in a bag of cheetos every 5 inches...alot of times I'm digging targets that aren't there because I haven't yet figured out every sound my machine makes yet the one thing I wil l say is that when this machine hits a target whether it's trash or gold ..u definitely know its a target unlike my gb2 which makes what I feel like a million different sounds....but still fun though..

Anyhoo wish I could provide more help...

79-85 ?? where are you Detecting ?? A Blacksmiths Shop, That Ground must be full On Magnetic.

It's good how well these Lower KHz Machines handle Hot Ground and they don't have you Digging too much junk. Why don't you set it up On the Two Tone setting ?? that will make it easier on the ears and you won't have to think too much about the Sound ??

John

Call me akward,... but I've got a few detectors in the arsenal. Costing much, much more. My 705 with the elliptical coil just makes me smile!

LOL, What's this Torture Steve Day, hahaha

Seriously though they Are A Good Duel Purpose Machine.

UP to...... Lol

You Started all This ?? Go And Stand By The Naughty Wall, lol,

X-Terra Z7005 ?? Indeed,

Yes, Gold Bug Pro, another fine unit.

 

I am very much at the point where I think single frequency 13 - 19 kHz tech is maxed out for depth and sensitivity to small stuff. It really now s all about the "additionals" like ground balance methodology, coil availability, and intangibles like how the machine sounds, feels, and even how it looks. Performance advances, if any, are in the area of how well a machine operates in dense targets and how well they separate ferrous from non-ferrous.

 

Long story short they all work about as well for me. I am just as guilty as anyone however when it come to playing with the toys so I get where you are coming from.

Well it was the Recovery speed that prompted me to ask about it because I saw A Video that showed how fast it could pick up the second Target, So I tried it with my machine and they are about the same, I tested the GB-P and it could see Tiny Gold Staters hidden under a Plough Blade, I have only seen One other machine do that,

But Money Wise I think the Fors Gold Gives the best bang for the Buck, Although It has not had A Chance to Prove it's self, I think it is as good as other machines costing Twice as much.

Thanks Steve, Yeah my MXT tells me that too, I am searching for something new to keep me busy for a while, I did some testing a while back with the Gold Bug Pro and that is a Clever machine, But these Nokta's have got my thoughts at the moment,

John

G'day Steve, No I was thinking more about how it handles hot Ground and as to what sort of depths are people making finds,

I was watching a Video on the recovery speed of it today and just wondering if it was Blinded by high mineralization by etc

john

Oh yes.. Up to 40% better... Grinning..

Struth,, That must Be An Xterra 7005,  no wonder it goes 40% Deeper, lol