Jeff McClendon

Thanks Simon. I did this little test to prove three things to myself and anyone else that wants to know. The Axiom is at least as sensitive as the GPX series on smaller targets. I was running it very conservatively. The GPX 4000 is quite the detector and can still hold its own today. Deus 2's gold prospecting mode and even the Mono mode running 45 kHz, set wide open -6.4 disc, using VCO audio and the 9" coil can hit some deep coin sized targets even in the crappy dirt I was testing in. It's basically beep/dig but that's okay. However, its normal default FMF discrimination modes simply can't handle that dirt nearly as well. I will do a test soon with a Coiltek 14X9 on the GPX 4000 and the Axiom with its 13X11. That should be fun. I am not looking for a winner. I know which detector I would pickup and use given a choice. Holding, swinging and detecting with the Axiom is a real pleasure. It's like using a finely tuned musical instrument that not only plays well, it feels great to use as if it was fitted just for me. I don't think I have ever been able to think that about a GPX 4000 to 5000. They detect well but the ergonomic design is just ridiculous.

I did a quick in the ground depth test today in a freshwater (frozen) lake beach cut using the Axiom with 11X7 Mono and DD coils, GPX 4000 with an older Nugget Finder 10X5" mono and Deus 2 using its 9" coil. Deus 2 was really along for the ride. I used it to test for iron mineralization and for targets in the test area so I tested these targets with it too. I had a 0.03 gram nugget at 2.5" depth, a 0.15 gram nugget at 5" depth and US clad dime (2.27 grams) and a US nickel (5 grams) at 10" depth. I had these targets taped to some 13" long shims and they were stuck about 2" into the vertical wall of the cut. Photo just shows the test setup. I only tested one target inserted into the cut at a time. Iron mineralization was moderate to high as shown by the Deus 2 iron mineralization meter (graph at bottom left of display screen). I first tested the GPX 4000 using General/Normal Mono coil setting with Gain on 12. That little Nugget Finder 10X5 coil gave clear, soft hits on both gold nuggets and also easily hit both US coins at 10" depth. Next I tested the Axiom with the 11X7" focused core DD coil running in Fine/Slow with gain on 4. I had no problems ground balancing this DD coil at this site. The responses on both gold nugget targets were faint and audible but they were not as sharp as the GPX 4000 responses with the Nugget Finder Elliptical. The Axiom DD had strong, clear responses on the 10" coins. Next was the Axiom with the 11X7" Mono coil running Fine/Slow with gain on 4. No problems ground balancing. The responses on the 2.5" and 5" deep nuggets were more sharp and rivaled the responses of the GPX 4000 with the 10X5" Nugget Finder. The Mono coil also gave strong, clear responses on the 10" US coins. Deus 2 using FMF Goldfield and the Mono program set on 45 kHz, Pitch tones, -6.4 disc, had almost identical responses on the 2 gold nuggets. The targets responses were a bit faint but clearly audible. For me anyway, definitely "Dig Me" responses. Both programs were also able to elicit a response over the 10" deep coins. They were not strong responses but at least FMF Goldfield had enough information to throw up some fairly accurate target IDs occasionally on both coins. I also gave the Sensitive and Deep High Conductor programs a chance to hit those coins..........absolutely no response. Hope this helps anyone that was wondering about the Axiom especially and even Deus 2. Both are very capable detectors in high iron mineralization even on small targets. GPX4000 with that ancient Nugget Finder elliptical......amazing.

I have personally been a problem looking for a solution all my life! So it doesn't surprise me that my metal detecting tendencies mirror that.

EMI is the main reason for me anyway along with ground handling. Since I like to use PIs for coin, jewelry and relic hunting, that is not always done at sites with little or no EMI. Just the opposite. Having a DD/Cancel option eliminates most of the EMI and does a good job of eliminating/discriminating smaller trash targets when I am concentrating on bigger coin/jewerly/relic targets.

***Lots of posts as I was writing this so, there is some redundant stuff in this post.*** I have been on the budget PI turntable for quite awhile. Under $3000, less than 4 pounds weight with a decent sized coil attached like an 11" round, it won't fall apart if I happen to drop it from a foot off the ground, I don't have to modify it or its power supply to get decent performance, was all I was asking for. I tried all of the White's TDIs both stock and modified and with modified battery packs, wouldn't ground balance due to single channel ground balancing on tough ground etc, and sensitivity to small gold was a constantly moving target. The QED, a user interface nightmare, rarely ground balanced on tough ground-single channel again and pressing the up/down button after getting back to MGB from wherever it was set...OMG, great ergos but only with a smaller coil, for God sake don't drop it! SDC2300, ergonomics of a 4X6X14" slab of concrete, crazy threshold, crazy coil selection, not enough controls. GPX6000, good ergonomics, poor DD coil selection considering half of its search modes are for DD coils, not enough controls, way too sensitive to EMI, hot rocks and hot ground (again, crying out for more DD coils from somebody!) Ridiculous price. Now I have an Axiom. I like it very much especially since I got it for really close to the $3000 price since it was a demo unit. Great user interface and display. Great ergonomics too. I still have serious questions about the focused core DD coils and those DD coils and the iron audio function were a big selling point for me since I like to use PIs for coin, jewelry and relic hunting. I also have a GPX 4000. Took the control box off of the shaft and attached it to my harness right next to the battery pouch. Awkward but it works and since it is a 4000, there are not that many settings to change. I can swing it all day and the coil selection is endless. Love the Mono, DD and especially Cancel functions for EMI. Now the Algoforce. This detector has some fantastic features like dual channel ground balance one button push ground grab, pinpoint function and conductivity target ID especially for coin/jewelry/relic hunting, vibrating handle for hearing impaired, good search modes, and I really like the coil calibration feature and coil compatability. I don't like no DD coils or a Cancel feature. I especially like the display right there where I can see it like it should be. Yeah, it looks like the PL4 QED but only superficially. The E1500 control unit and display make the QED control box and display look like something from the 1970s. I don't really care about having the best PI on the planet since that would be made by Minelab and out of my price range at this point whether Minelab releases a successor to the GPZ or not. No, I am not going to be buying or swinging a 5 to 7 pound detector either at my age. I look forward to seeing reports and some videos of the new Algoforce E1500.

You asked for some more hints so here are a few. Practice a lot on the coins that you can find in your area. Learn their target IDs well. Learn the target IDs of the aluminum trash in your area and by that I mean the regularly shaped trash like the wide variety of pull tabs, small and large aluminum screw caps. Forget about learning random aluminum canslaw and foil wrapper trash. It sounds so good that you will dig it if you are going after good targets like gold jewerly or bullets that share target IDs with all of that aluminum. Concentrate on the regularly shaped common targets like coins, gold and silver rings ( if you have any) and pull tabs and learn how the sound of these rounded solid objects starts, stops and the length of the silence in between along with whether they sound hard edged or kind of soft edged, elongated and squishy. Practice with the coil swinging right over them (double and triple beeping) and then with the coil farther away so that there is only a single beep with each directional swing. Also practice with the outer edges of the coil too and see if you hear a difference.

The statement you quoted me on was about telling the difference between ferrous/non-ferrous using Pitch tones. I did not make any definitive claim about me personally telling the difference between a coin and aluminum trash using Pitch tones and I am not going to either. I merely stated that if You practice, you might sometimes be able to with a little glance at the target ID. I generally use 6 or 60 tones on shallow to mid depth coin sized targets when coin/jewelry hunting. There is a lot of information within those tones about certain regularly occurring coins and certain, regularly occurring aluminum objects like pull tabs and aluminum screw caps that can be learned if you want to go to the trouble. Most people don't want to go to that trouble and some people will probably start taking shots at me for even saying it's possible.

Pitch Tones (plural) on the Legend is 2 tone, ferrous/non-ferrous audio and the tone break will occur where it is set by default in each Park and Field mode. Make sure you are using the A or G discrimination pattern and iron volume level is loud enough to hear. Try it out on some test targets to get the volume levels right for your hearing.

HF coil batteries are in the lower shaft. If you have a dead HF coil battery, they are not expensive and they are ridiculously easy to replace. So, you didn't try the charging clip on the 10x5" HF coil? If you do try it make sure you get a solid white light on the coil to show it's charging.

I never expected and really don’t want the same extreme sensitivity to really small gold that the GPX 6000 will hit. Along with that extreme sensitivity on the 6000 comes extreme sensitivity to everything else detectable in the coil’s detection field including EMI. My Axiom even with conservative settings has no issues detecting 0.03 gram flakes and smaller near the surface using the 11X7” mono or DD coils. Anything smaller than that is VLF territory for me anyway. The replacement 11X7”. Focused Core DD coil that Garrett sent me ground balances better than the one it replaced. Sometimes I can get it to properly ground balance on difficult dirt and run well enough in Fine/Slow with sensitivity on 3 or 4. The 11X7” mono has zero problems ground balancing and running the identical settings in the same dirt. That’s kind of weird…..

I would like conventional DD coil choices too. Otherwise, I am happy with my Axiom.

I thought really hard about it but that had nothing to do with how it detects. It does just great for me, ergonomics are good and it has the best EMI handling I have ever experienced. I sold my Nox 800 instead to a great new owner who absolutely loves the 800 as much as I do. However, I think the Manticore is Minelab's worthy successor to the Equinox 800. It took awhile for me to come to that understanding but, that is what I decided and I am going to stick to that.

You would get a better answer just by doing some testing/training. Just get a small target like a #6 shot gun pellet or other target that weighs less than 0.25 grams, get a little dirt and bury that target 2 to 3" deep. You don't have to bury it in the ground, just use a container that is roughly as wide as the coil you are using. The dirt can be potting soil or just sand. Try detecting it in M2 with the discrimination patter on A or G using the multi tone options and then try detecting it using Pitch. I don't know anything about what the "people" you see calling out targets are doing so I can't answer that. I do know that I can sometimes usually tell ferrous from non-ferrous using Pitch and that I can tell a deep target from a shallow one and a small target from a large one for starters. You should be able to do that too with a little practice. Who knows, you may be calling coins from trash pretty quickly using Pitch and with a little help from a quick glance at the target IDs.

For my hunting style, the Axiom is a better choice. I do like using my GPX 4000 for relics and deep coins but I just like the Axiom's press the button for on demand iron ID with typical Garrett iron grunt audio instead of using iron reject on the GPX and having it on all the time. Like Steve H and Chase said above, that could create unwanted target masking. I do like how the GPX iron reject is incremental but being threshold based, it to me anyway is more prone to masking.

If you just want to hunt for gold nuggets you have lots of choices from dedicated VLFs and pulse induction detectors. If your area has mostly sub gram gold, a VLF like the Fisher Goldbug 2, Minelab Goldmonster 1000, Garrett/Whites Goldmaster 24K, Nokta Gold Kruzer, Nokta NuggetFinder 2000 and the XP ORX with the white HF coils would be good choices. If you want to also hunt for sub gram gold nuggets plus relics, coins and jewelry eventually there are also some great VLF choices for that too that have simultaneous multi frequency operation like the Minelab Equinox 800, Minelab Equinox 900, Minelab Manticore, Nokta Legend and XP Deus 2. Those detectors have excellent dedicated gold prospecting modes that easily rival the sensitivity and mineralized ground handling of the dedicated gold prospecting detectors listed above them. All of the detectors listed in this paragraph are $1600 or less if you shop carefully. If you are current or former US military, Minelab and Garrett offer 15% discounts for many of their new detectors. There are some used pulse induction detectors that are good for a wide range of gold nugget sizes from 0.1 gram small nuggets and up. They are not cheap even when buying used. If you can find a Minelab SDC 2300, GPX 4000, 4500, 4800 or 5000 for $1500 or less that actually works, buy it. The Whites TDIs are good too but they simply will not hit sub 0.25 gram and smaller nuggets consistently.

Since 60 tones, 6 tones, 4 tones, 2 tones and 1 tone on the Legend are more similar to square wave audio…….no you will not “hear the same loudness or softness just like pitch tones” Goldfield’s one tone VCO and 2 tone Pitch VCO-voltage controlled oscillator audio has audio that can dramatically increase in volume AND dramatically changes pitch over a strong target. That change of volume and pitch is less pronounced on deeper/weaker targets. Square wave type audio like the Legend’s 1,2,4,6 and 60 tone options increases in volume on stronger targets and has softer volume on weaker targets depending on the audio gain setting. Square wave audio does not change pitch however unless the target ID changes. Try it out for yourself.

As far as VLFs, if I was helping you (Steve H) with updating this list, I would suggest adding the Nokta Legend, Equinox 900, Manticore and Deus 2 (much better with V2.0 software).

$549

Great deals on new ORX right now in the USA. Mi-6 price is great too.

If I needed a Tesoro addiction fix (thankfully I don't), Deeptech sure makes some really nice detectors.

Hi stateguy, I am learning the Manticore just like everybody else. Quite the detector for sure. I don't know what kind of sand your were hunting in whether very low, low, moderate or high amounts of magnetic sand. I hunt on turf mostly, haven't used the Manticore at a saltwater beach yet so anything I say here needs to be considered with that in mind. Also, the dirt I hunt in has moderate to high amounts of magnetite particles, enough to easily cover a magnet with sand sized particles if I roll it around in this dirt for a couple of seconds. My Manticore has been updated and I have the red numbers turned on, iron volume turned up and I usually hunt with the horseshoe button engaged so all target IDs are accepted. I regularly get red numbers and black numbers on most targets from surface to 8" deep that have a target ID below about 30. That definitely includes nickels and I am talking about standalone nickels, not nickels with an actual iron target nearby. I totally agree with everything TampaBayBrad said above. I will dig any target that has a target ID from 24 to 27 even if some numbers are red, it sounds like it is coin sized target, the dot at least starts on the center line (even though it may "bleed" downward a bit) and like TampaBayBrad said it has a "solid hit". That solid hit is very key to distinguishing US nickels from other targets including modern pull tabs. So, some red numbers on buried nickels may be "normal". I will probably get some grief for saying this from people that don't want to hear it (literally) but the Manticore using its Normal and Enhanced audio themes (all I've used so far) if recovery speed stays between 3 and 6 or so, is very capable of giving some major amounts of "descriptive" audio response information that can be learned and depended on. So learning what a US nickel sounds and responds like with all of the Manticore's visual and audio aids can make digging them almost guaranteed if you learn their tendencies opposed to modern oval and rectangular pull tabs for instance. It takes some practice and no strategy is ever perfect, but the "tells" are there for anyone that wants to take the time to learn them.

I enjoyed using the one I owned for relic hunting in mild to moderately mineralized ground even though I had constant EMI issues due to it being an Aussie detector battling with 60 Hz USA electricity. It was just OK, nothing special for smaller gold nuggets below 0.5 grams. As soon as the ground mineralization became more difficult, it was pretty useless. Hated to sell it but it went to another good home in Virginia USA for relic hunting.

Have those spouses swing an ORX and they might think differently. They are really easy to operate too with just enough features to get serious.

XP ORX detectors with HF 9" round, HF elliptical, or one of the X35 coils and WS wireless audio headphones, charging cables, etc are available in the USA, I mean the entire package with great coil, headphones and remote (some dealers are including a nice XP finds pouch) for $549. I don't care much for the ORX coin modes, but I was always comparing them to something they aren't meant to be=original Deus full featured coin modes. But those two gold prospecting modes are no joke. A coil that will run at 14, 31 and 81 kHz plus with a little disc IAR and iron volume On, you get a two tone VCO gold prospecting/relic hunter/micro gold jewelry hunter that weighs about 2 lbs. That is insane.......thank again to Nokta Detectors (and XP). Compare that to a Minelab GoldMonster 1000 with one coil for $799 to 999 US that takes 30 seconds to ground balance......I could go on but there is no point.

Or buy a Nokta Score for 449 euros.