Chase Goldman

Can you please specifically describe the issue you are seeing. I have seen no anomalous behavior when using the the double-hot-key shortcut to switch between the big and the normal TID display and it does so without inadvertently activating the audio shortcut options. The audio hot key properly enables volume control on all outputs and access to the equalizer without issue. Similarly, the frequency scan hot key works without issue.

Just to be clear, if you’re just talking Silencer behavior (and the “glitch” introduced by Ver 1.0), correct, the Beach Programs were and are unaffected because their min Silencer settings were not changed by ver 1.0 or 1.1. But obviously all the Beach programs can use the applicable Ver 1.X the enhancements to Full Tones, Expanded Silencer Range, Expanded Iron Volume Range, and Max F adjustments as well as Hi Square and the new Audio Filter Adjustment.

Yep. Something is going on.

Good question, I’ll put that on the list. On Deus 1, Silencer was not off unless you set it to -1.

Nice finds. I take it that you attempted a frequency shift noise cancel to no avail before resorting to lowering sensitivity.

I added this issue to the Deus V 1.0 consolidated issues thread:

Added this to my consolidated Ver 1 issues and assessment thread here. This Lock Up bug has been reported a couple times. Thanks

I get what you're saying and thanks for posting your assessment of Hi Square. But that just confirms why I'll just stick with PCM. Just so used to the "annoying" PCM audio since I started using Deus nearly 10 years ago. If I want it to sound nice, I'll use a Minelab, Garrett, or listen to music. If I want actual audio information about the target via the harmonics, I gotta use PCM. You can dress up PCM audio to an extent using square or hi-square which limits the "unpleasant" sounding PCM harmonics, then you are going to also naturally lose audio target information that you get with PCM, because it's those harmonics that clue you in to likely junk targets. Metal detecting involves swinging over random pieces of metal in the ground, not conducting an orchestra. So it's never going to sound like a symphony unless you dig the sweet PCM sonar echo sound of rings, buttons, and coins (symmetric/round targets) at a honey hole site.

The iron volume range was increased from 0 to 5 in ver 0.71 to 0 to 10 in ver. 1.0. So if you were using an old custom program iron volume setting (e.g., 3 out 5 for ver 0.71), you would have to increase the setting to at least 6 (out of 10) to get an equivalent iron volume level in Ver 1.0. The Ver 1.0 Factory Preset Program default settings for iron volume have been adjusted up to account for this range change. If you want threshold dropouts for iron targets instead of iron volume, you can set up a notch segment that covers all or part of the iron range (say from -6.4 to 8 or -6.4 to 0). Any target that falls in that notch segment will null the threshold. Using Relic or Gold Field works best for this, but you can use it on any program as long as you invoke Pitch tones audio to activate the threshold. I have only done this Notch “trick” with Relic mode, so I am not sure how it would work in conjunction with Discrimination based programs such as General (e.g, if you set Disc at 8 and invoked a Notch from -6.4 to 8 on top of it). HTH

I have started a DP XP Deus 2 Version 1.0 thread to centrally collect findings and assessments of version 1.0:

Summary of Issues/Observations Identified Since Public Release of Ver 1.0: Ver 1.0 Silencer Filter Response appears to be more aggressive at the 0, 1, and 2 levels (and above) and step increases in silencer settings appear coarser than the equivalent settings in Ver 0.71 adversely affecting 3-D ferrous/non-ferrous target separation and causing masking even at high reactivity levels. See questions in next section regarding whether the Silencer filter is disabled when set to “0” or was changed from ver 0.71. (Addressed in the Ver 1.1 Update to restore Silencer behavior at levels 0, 1, and 2 to Ver 0.71, Note that Program 3 - Sensi FT retains the aggressive low level Silencer Settings introduced in Ver 1.0) Ver 1.0 Audio Response appears to be amplified over the equivalent settings in Ver 0.71. Deus 2 Micro/Sub-gram gold performance of D2 in gold field mode still significantly lags Deus/Orx Gold Field performance. XP should consider providing a selectable single/mono-frequency Gold Mode factory program in a future update. Enabling mono-frequency adjustments above the current Program 7 max of 45 kHz, perhaps in conjunction with a D2 small, elliptical high frequency coil (see more on that below). Bug (ver 0.71, ver 1.0, ver 1.1) - If the Big TID Display option has been invoked in any mode, accessing the Equalizer from the Audio hot key shortcut (long press of "+" key and then pressing the middle "^" key reverts the display to normal sized horseshoe screen. Big TID can be recovered using the Big TID hot keys (pressing and holding the "+" and the right hand "^" keys at the same time. This does not happen if any of the other audio options are selected or adjusted from the shortcut and if Big TID is your saved default display mode (such as in the ver 1.X General Program), it will return on a power cycle. Anomalous Clock operation appears to still be an issue. XP Needs to update the User Guide to address increased coil battery drain at lower Max F settings. Possible Bug: Remote parameter adjustment locks up after frequency scan or Sensitivity, Reactivity, or other parameter change, requiring a power cycle reboot of the remote. (Potentially Addressed in Ver 1.1 Update to restore Silencer behavior at levels 0, 1, and 2 to Ver 0.71) Odd Behavoir: If you go directly to bone phones as the audio output device, you can only select Square. Go to another audio device, change it to HiSquare and then back to bone phones, and it will then say HiSquare which can’t be changed directly back to Square unless you repeat the audio output switch procedure again. Switching a another device to PCM and switching back to bone phones audio is ignored by the bone phones output. It is difficult to tell if the audio is Square or HiSquare when it says HiSquare. (New: Added 6/29/23) Update issues: Various reports of WS6 lockups (requiring battery drain resets) or puck bricks during the update process or during version rollback. (Potentially Addressed in Ver 1.1 Update to restore Silencer behavior at levels 0, 1, and 2 to Ver 0.71) Questions: Is the only difference between FMF profiles used in the base factory programs the Max F setting and whether FMF uses Frequency Addition or Conductive Soil Subtraction or are there other Min F or frequency combination or signal processing differences? Put another way, do similar programs that utilize Frequency Addition or Conductive Soil Subtraction behave the exactly the same if set up with the exact same Max F and other user adjustable settings? Examples include Dive, Beach, and Beach Sensitive at the same Max F or Sensitive/Sensitive FT/Fast and Park and Deep HC at the same Max F and all other parameters adjusted equivalently. This is important information for users trying to determine the most appropriate base program to use for developing custom user program profiles. Is the Silencer filter disabled when set to “0”? If not, was Silencer at Level 0 modified from ver 0.71? (Answer to second question is yes, but ver 0.71 behavior at Silencer = 0 was restored in the ver 1.1 update except Program 3 - Sensi FT which retains the Ver 1.0 aggressive low level Silencer filter) Were Ver 1.0 non-ferrous ID ranges/segments (especially high conductivity TIDs) adjusted vs. Ver 0.71? When will the Go Terrain App be available in all geographic regions? Will it be possible in the future to delete some of the redundant factory programs to enable more custom user program slots? Ability to apply updates and reload/re-program custom user programs via a mobile device or PC interface as an alternative to programming via tge remote’s limited interface would be a welcome new feature. Expanding the number of Characters that can be used for naming custom user programs would also be welcome. Is a D2 compatible small elliptical coil (or enabling existing HF elliptical coil compatibility with D2) on the table (even if it is not-dive rated) or is that just out of the question as far as XP is concerned? A lot of prospective and existing D2 users have expressed a desire for this popular coil form factor for D2.

Updated to Reflect the Ver 2.0 Update released 5 September 2023 Updated to Reflect the Ver 1.1 Update released on 25 May 2023. This thread is an attempt to consolidate dispassionate, factual, and unbiased (pro or con) observations and impressions on the XP Deus 2 Ver 1.1 Update. If you have been plugged into the posts here related to this update, it is obvious that it’s definitely a glass partially full, partially empty thing depending on your perspective and how the changes, for better or for worse, affect the way you each use your Deus 2. People who focus solely on specific types of detecting or specific site conditions with their Deus 2 (e.g., beach and water hunters vs. park coin shooters vs. hot dirt relic hunters vs. gold prospectors vs. those detecting in highly iron or aluminum polluted sites) will each have different reactions to this update be it elation to ho hum to bitter disappointment. And just to be clear, it’s apparent things have changed beyond the obvious added features touted by XP, no denying that. Also, it’s apparent that long time, identified issues that have existed before even ver 0.71 was released have still not been addressed (e.g., micro gold sensitivity, the clock, high target ID compression). What’s not clear at this stage is the impact (net positive or negative) of the “unexpected” changes and whether the omissions are intentional because XP hasn’t figured out the fix or have it prioritized for a subsequent update. My point is, the forum community is better served, at this point, by level headed assessments and exchanges of factual information and observations. Information that can be usefully disseminated amongst Deus 2 users, rather than knee jerk, emotional, and/or over the top proclamations (good or bad) that just stir the pot or satisfy people’s hidden agendas. That type of commentary does little to help Deus users nor does it help XP get the useful feedback needed to enable addressing improvements in a timely manner. So if you can’t help being significantly biased or hyperbolic in your commentary either because you are an unapologetic XP FanBoy or a perpetual XP basher, please just sit this one out. Also, this is a reminder that Gary Black @Gary XP is a member of DP and drops in to monitor and exchange information with existing and prospective Deus 2 users so if we can keep the discourse civil and to the point, Gary can be a useful resource to shed additional light on what changed with ver 1.0 and a direct conduit back to XP regarding our Ver 1.0 experiences, good and bad, and what else we might like to see that was perhaps broken by or not addressed in Ver 1.0. Have at it. Also, here are links to some useful official information and videos related to the update. Also, @F350Platinum discovered that there are Ver 2.0 variants with different time stamps (XP's strict adherence to SW version configuration control methods (not) apparently strikes again). If you upgraded to V2.0 the day it was released or on or before 9/26/23, check your version time stamp (Option/Settings/Infos) to make sure you have the latest 9/26/23 version. More info in this post. Version 2.0 Update Link Addresses compatibility with the new XP Xtrem Hunter Two-Box Coil Improves Goldfield small gold sensitivity (verified in air tests conducted by @Jeff McClendon) Enables the Audio Equalizer to work with the XP wired, bone-conduction "Bone Phones" V1.1 UPDATE XP would like to express its gratitude to all users for providing valuable feedback following the release of version 1.0. We appreciate your input, and based on your feedback, we are pleased to introduce version 1.1: Bug Fixes: We have successfully resolved the issue of remote control rebooting or WS6 freezing in very rare configurations. Other Improvements: The FE.TID (Ferrous Target display) setting is now enabled by default. If you prefer not to display ferrous target IDs, you can turn off the FE.TID setting. We have made corrections to the SILENCER function in programs P1, P2, P4, P5, and P6. Now, Silencer levels 0, 1, and 2 provide the same rejection as in V0.71, while higher levels from 3 offer better iron rejection. The program 3 SENSI FT uses different Silencer close to V1.0. Notes : - Previous versions 0.6, 0.71, and 1.0 are still available online and accessible thanks to the new updater. - All other new functions and improvements introduced in V1.0, such as Audio Filter, Freq Max, HiSquare audio, Fulltones Offset, fast TID, etc., remain unchanged in V1.1. We encourage you to read detailed information about these features in the documentation below and watch the video by Gary Blackwell. Additionally, we strongly recommend watching the tutorial video below titled "Update Procedure" to guide you through the update process. Thank you once again for your valuable feedback and continuous support! The XP team What's new in Version 1.0: FULL TONES (DISCRI > EXPERT) DISCRIMINATION=TONE BREAK Values below the discrimination level, such as the ground and iron, are now audible without having to lower the discrimination to -6.4. The discrimination setting acts as a "tone break," and the Iron Volume setting adjusts the volume of ground and iron below the discrimination level. OFFSET-FT (FULLTONES > EXPERT) Shifts the audio frequency to the high tone of the first targets with a signature just above the Discrimination level, in order to easily differentiate them audibly from iron: 0=disabled OFFSET. 5=default setting allowing a first level of offset to the high tone of the first non-ferrous targets. 10=more pronounced offset. 40 (max) = all targets above the discrimination level will produce the same high-pitched sound. Full Tones -TONE VOLUME (FULLTONES > EXPERT) Configures the tone breaks and volume levels of 5 conductivity ranges of the Full Tones in order to prioritize certain target ranges. TONE VOLUME (MENU > DISCRI > EXPERT > TONES > EXPERT) Adjusts the individual volume of each tone on 11 levels to attenuate certain target ranges and prioritize others. FREQUENCY MAX (MENU > FREQ MAX) Limits the maximum high frequency used in the multifrequency spectrum FMF to 40kHz, 24kHz or 14kHz for each program. Reducing the Max Frequency improves ground stability and iron discrimination. This also reduces sensitivity to weak conductors (T.ID 25-50) and the ability to accept coins mixed with nails or heavily mineralized soil. For example, program 1 GENERAL coupled with a Max Frequency of 14khz (4-14khz spectrum) is more suitable for locating high conductive targets (silver coins) through aluminum foil, compared to the default band up to 40khz. Note: The frequency shift and auto frequency scan have been moved to the Max Frequency sub-menu. AUDIO FILTER (OPTION > AUDIO) Cleans up the audio and sounds smoother, less instability, particularly at depth, choosing the correct Audio Filter for your search area can gain a few extra centimeters of performance. On clean beaches or clean open ground, higher levels from 2 to 5 will be interesting. In polluted iron environments, lower levels from 0 to 2 will retain enough nuances in the iron feedback to better recognize Ferrous and Non-Ferrous targets. At 0, this audio filter is disabled. HI-SQUARE AUDIO TYPE (OPTION > AUDIO > AUDIO TYPE) This new audio type has a richer and clearer harmonic content than the SQUARE Audio Type and can very often help identify deep quiet targets. In Pitch mode, strong targets close to the coil will be less sharp and softened compared to SQUARE, in order to better identify deep targets without saturating your hearing with close and strong signals. FASTER T.ID The target ID (T.ID) display now updates faster, so that the ID of a ferrous target does not linger on a non-ferrous target. Also, adjust the FE T.ID setting to OFF to favor the display of non-ferrous targets. FE T.ID (OPTION > CONFIG > ON/OFF) FE T.ID = ON: Displays the ID of ferrous targets. FE T.ID = OFF: Will not display the ID of ferrous targets but only targets with an ID value higher than the discrimination setting (even if you keep the Iron Volume). In iron-polluted environments, set FE T.ID to OFF to focus on the display of non-ferrous targets. SILENCER (DISCRI > EXPERT) Now more effective and staggered with 8 levels from 0 to 7. With the silencer set to levels 2-3, difficult ferrous targets displaying a high ID and generating high-pitched tones will be better eliminated. If you want to further improve the discrimination of ferrous targets, consider: - Increasing the Silencer to 3, 4, 5... - Increasing the discrimination level to 8-10. - Use the B.caps reject (rejecting ferrous and large iron capsules) - Reducing the Max Frequency to 24 or 14kHz OTHER Program 1-GENERAL Program 1-General now uses 2 tones and the Big T.ID display mode as default. Its reactivity is slightly reduced from 2.5 to 2 to offer you more performance in general use on less polluted ground. Multi Notch and Ground menu is now available on the WS6 The Multi-Notch as well as the Ground menu with its all-metal mode are now present on the WS6 Master.

Congrats. Glad you finally got it downloaded and thanks for getting back to us to let us know.

Click on the videos posted by Zord earlier and you will get an idea. Basically folks are complaining that going from a 1 to 2 setting on silencer will result in significant masking of mid-conductive, non-ferrous targets co-located with nails in the same plane and above the target in the direction of swing negating fast reactivity settings. Silencer appears on the surface to be a lot more aggressive than the same silencer setting on ver 0.71. I postulated that it was XP's aggressive response to iron falsing complaints with ver 0.71. To be fair, Silencer range of adjustment was expanded to 7 from 5. With a larger range of adjustment, people are understandably thinking that would also translate into a more gradual increase in filtering effects as you make step change increases in the silencer filter vs. what is being observed. I think some time is needed to fully vet these changes before making knee jerk hyperbolic claims of unsuitability of this release. There may indeed be needed near-termtweaks to ver 1.0 at the end of the day, but let's get through the growing pains and see what shakes out to be real show stopper issues. So far I haven't seen anything that is a serious flaw or that can't be worked around.

Ever since Deus 1, I basically stayed away from heavy use of silencer and relied on other methods and tells for falsing iron. As far as I was concerned, with or without silencer. Deus 2 still handled thick iron environments very well.

People who perennially play with backyard boxes and desktop coffee cups are great. But how about some actual detecting and finds... You swing from one extreme to the other it's hard to take what you say with any seriousness. One moment you're in "heaven" with the new Ver 1.0 audio, the next moment Ver 1.0 is "useless" because of a desktop test of an arcane expert setting under one specific condition. You cherry pick video air tests with tailored setups yet ignore real world results here and here. So which is more "ridiculous"? Don't get me wrong. It's good to get the word out there that it appears the silencer behaves differently, perhsps more aggressively, on ver 1.0 - presumably XP's response to the complaints of iron falsing (which neither of these test videos address, btw). It doesn't make Ver 1 useless, it just proves the timeless fact of life that if you use a filter to address one issue you may impact performance. It's called balancing tradeoffs and the informed and savvy detectorist knows when silencer is of benefit and when it is not. The demonstration of the less aggressive silencer on ver .71 only showed the difference in masking but did not show if the ver 0.71 silencer was effective at mitigating iron falsing, which is it's purpose. Based on the numerous complaints regarding falsing on ver 0.71, I suspect it was inadequate at what it was designed to mitigate. Frankly, if you want to be sure a legit target is not masked by a filter setting under an extreme case of iron co-location, then turn the Silencer off. If falsing is ruining your hunt, turn silencer on and take your chances. It's a detectorists judgment call not a magic wand. Simple.

I'm certainly not seeing 1.0 as useless and more specifically that the silencer has a "major problem" or that the video has even proven the silencer to be a problem at this stage. Holding out judgement until I form my own opinions based on real world situations and experience which is going to take hundreds of hours of swing time. I certainly don't want XP making knee jerk mods to this update because of some nails sitting on top of a coffee cup on someone's desk. Anyway, simple solution, roll back to your beloved ver 0.71 until the dust settles and monitor whether XP feels a change is needed.

XP has never really explained what frequency addition means. So that could definitely affect the FMF frequency spectrum for modes that otherwise "look" identicsl. However, the beach modes use conductive ground subtraction which makes sense in the beach modes, as salt conductivity is being notched out. Perhaps Beach Sensitive, in addition to having a higher Max F, has less of a salt "notch" to provide greater sensitivity to small beach gold. Still surprised they behave that differently. Dan - Can you be more specific about how you set up the two modes to be identical and what was different about how they behaved? Specifically, did you set up Beach to emulate Beach Sensitive or vice versa or both. I know it shouldn't matter if they are identical. The only adjustable parameter defaults that are different between Beach and Beach Sensitive are Max F (24 and 40 khz, respectively) and Salt sensitivity (9 and 7, respectively), I believe. Thanks for checking that out, Dan.

Agreed. The more I think about it, I think Garrett made the right move pivoting to take on ML on the PI front, where no one else has really challenged them. The market is saturated with SMF derivatives of Equinox/Manticore (Legend, Deus 2, and the forthcoming Quest V60/80). Garrett basically released a proof of principle SMF with Apex to demonstrate they still had the engineering chops to stay relevant with the latest IB VLF detecting tech trend but focused their development horsepower on Axiom. After Quest drops their SMF offering out there, I anticipate a lull in new releases of mid-to-high-end SMF detectors. Perhaps a perfect time for Garrett to make a splash with a new AT SMF flagship of their own while others (Nokta and Quest) try to counter ML's XTP.

Yeah, you showed them Simon by waiting at least a month before getting that Manticore. Sorry, couldn't resist. Glad you are showing strength by not hopping on the XTP. I Broke down and just purchased a ML product myself...

Surprised it’s so popular. For me, I avoid Camo on my detector gear because I want to be able to find it again if I intentionally or unintentionally leave it behind in the field (like if I have to go back to my vehicle to fetch something). I guess some folks find it useful for keeping a low profile, or something?

Would have kept one of them as a backup, but getting $500 for both is not too bad a deal.

Do you mean less falsing or less iron tones? The latter makes sense because at disc -6.4, you lose iron tone/volume, unless you force the next multi tone bin to a low pitch. On Full Tone (FT), in 0.71, you had no non-iron volume pitch adjustment. Now, with 1.0, you can adjust the pitch and offset of the 2nd Bin even in FT because XP added tone bin groups. If you are running Pitch tone at -6.4 disc, everything will sound non-ferrous.

Yes, you can roll back to v 0.71 The login page is: https://updater.xpmetaldetectors.com/#/login, but the browser may not show https:// in the address bar, which is normal browser behavior.

That’s certainly a strange one. Hopefully, it’s not a bug like we had early on as described here where with disc set at -6.4, you would get no iron tone (which would be sort of the opposite of what you were describing, Lodge). Frankly, if the detector is falsing on iron with a TID well above the disc limit (iron tone break) shifting disc up or down a few points should not theoretically make falsing noticeably better or worse. The main factors should be, as you noted, Silencer and Max F. BTW note that the max silencer setting is now 7, so maybe increasing it further is what is needed for 40 kHz Max so you can re-invoke disc and at least don’t get non-ferrous tones on all targets. Will have to play with that one. The only real way to verify is to find a falsing nail and see if it really stops falsing at -6.4 disc. Yep that is really odd behavior but sometimes weird behaviors an anomalies show up at the extreme endpoints of parameter settings’ ranges.