Rick K - First Member

As you pointed out, and as Keith Southern points out in a video he just posted, the FA mode is very useful for hunting small gold. Running the new F 75 in discrimination mode with the FA, it may be possible to get a much cleaner discrimination ferrous versus nonferrous reading on small gold than the F 75 has been capable of before.

I hope to have my hands on one by early next week and if I'm very lucky also one of the 10 inch elliptical DD coils for it. I look forward to playing with it and comparing it to my Gold bug Pro, my Deus and my Gold bug 2.

You might want to keep an eye on the companion version, the Fors CoRe. It has a dedicated salt beach mode.

It's unclear at present exactly what the difference between the two models is.

ATX - SDC2300 - Fors Gold - revised F-75 - Deus ---- it's raining new detectors in the goldfields and Steve is getting SOAKED! LOL.

Looking forward to your take on the Deus.

it will be interesting to see how the two new Fors machines compare - the Gold and the CoRe.

Also

Since it looks increasingly like folks are finally realizing that for most of North America, small gold is about all you can expect to find, and since Minelab has now brought out a PI detector optimized for it, i suspect a lot of reconsideration of what to "take hunting" may occur.

Viper - where did Ray M. Post his results,please?

Thanks

Nice, Steve. I was looking forward to your test report.

If somebody wants to buy a new VLF gold detector, this is obviously a candidate.

I believe Ray Mills got one as well, and since Ray is one of the leading exponents of the Gold Bug Pro, it will be interesting to see what he has to say.

Thanks.

I had occasion to talk to someone knowledgeable about the situation in the African goldfields and was told of some of the real human costs of fake detectors. Families in the goldfields borrow tens of thousands of dollars to buy a number of detectors, expecting to pay it off with their gold findings. Sadly, sometimes the detectors are fake look-alike crap VLF machines from China. Money gone, no gold and instead of Chapter 11, somebody in the family gets a long prison sentence till the debt is paid!

The United Arab Emirates, along with China, are the center for financing and supplying almost all the "New Industries" in Africa. When it is good (like financing and carrying out infrastructure projects, supplying equipment and spare parts to keep everything running) - it's very good. When it's bad (like counterfiet products, black market caviar, sex trafficking, smuggling and financing Somali Piracy) - it's HORRID.

Here's some news First Texas posted about what they are doing (Minelab has made similar efforts).

First Texas Products Again Successful Against Counterfeiters

El Paso, Texas, Sept. 25, 2014 -- Following on its September 2013 counterfeit raid and confiscation, First Texas Products, LLC, was again successful in penetrating a counterfeit distribution organization operating in the United Arab Emirates, resulting in the raid and confiscation of Teknetics® and Fisher® Research Labs metal detectors.

"Following on our successful 2013 raid, the worldwide leader in gold detection technology again apprehended the counterfeiters," said Tim Mallory, First Texas Vice President of Sales and Marketing. "Our determination to close down the illegal retailers, distributors and manufacturers continues to be as aggressive as ever,” he said.

A Sudanese national reputed to have operations in Dubai and Ajman was arrested at an Ajman warehouse facility where Chinese-origin counterfeit Teknetics T2 and Fisher Gold Bug® gold detectors were being assembled, packaged and distributed.

Tom Walsh, Chief Executive Officer of First Texas Products, said the ongoing anti-counterfeit operations in the UAE and Africa have made it more difficult for counterfeiters to operate. “We will stop at nothing to protect our intellectual property rights and defend our market position in the UAE and across the African continent,” Walsh said. “First Texas Products will not be hindered in the pursuit and prosecution of counterfeiters. And First Texas will continue to pay for information leading to the arrest of counterfeiters and the confiscation of their illegal wares.”

According to Mr. Mallory, “counterfeit Teknetics® and Fisher® products have been distributed in Dubai since 2009. Innocent and unsuspecting African miners suffer the consequences of counterfeit distribution. Our anti-counterfeiting programs seek not only to prosecute fraud; we also educate retailers and end users on the economic and legal risks inherent in counterfeiting. This seizure of counterfeited products of two of our strongest brands reinforces our resolve.”

Following this successful operation, an unrelated raid on smuggled counterfeit detectors was reported by the Sudanese General Customs Administration in West Omdurman, Sudan on Sept. 15, 2014. Thousands of counterfeit gold detectors were seized in that anti-smuggling operation. According to Mr. Mallory, “market intelligence leads us to believe that these counterfeit operations were related to one another.”

The Dubai Gold Souk is the primary destination for gold unearthed by African artisanal miners. Dubai's leading gold market position has established it as the major transit point and distribution hub for gold prospecting equipment destined for African and Asian markets. Counterfeiters attempt to infiltrate the Dubai market and distribute counterfeit detectors through both clandestine and authentic distribution channels.

Chris,

What you point out of course tracks with what I have read and to some extent experienced.

'Given the cost difference between the GB2 (or Whites GMT) detectors and the SDC it would be interesting to further describe by actual locale how they performed - one compared to the other.

Up to now, the PI machine's big advantage has been depth in mineralized soil. The SDC offers reduced depth compared to traditional PI detectors as a trade off for increased sensitivity to small gold and seemingly overall quieter operation. If they cost the same and the detectors weighed the same, then the remaining issues would be depth against a given target in a given level of mineralization. The hot rock issue is probably an even trade - SDC hot rock immunity for the GB2’s iron reject - which is not to be uncritically relied on but which can be pretty handy in some cases.

The details of comparative performance on a variety of sites would be really interesting. Hopefully someone who has both machines might get interested enough to run some comparison tests.

Chris,

It's good to hear about the sucess folks are having with the SDC.

From what I have been reading, it sounds like the SDC is getting the same nuggets that the Gold Bug 2 is so good at getting. Of course, the SDC won't hear all the hot rocks and might detect the same small stuff deeper in highly mineralized ground.

It would be really interesting to run them side by side in the field and see how they compare on te same ground and the same targets.

I guess the streets really are paved with gold - sort of.

http://nypost.com/2011/06/20/got-his-mined-in-the-gutter/

Minelab couldn't price the S DC 2300 at $2000 because they know full well that every sale of one of these is a potential loss of a sale of the GPX 5000. If you don't have a PI detector and you're looking to buy one in the US it will be real hard to spend the extra $2000 or so for GPX 5000 when people like Steve truthfully explain that most of the gold can be found is small. So from Minelab point of view better to get you to pay extra for SDC 2300 if you're not going to buy GPX 5000 than to offer you one at a reasonable price and lose three or $4000 difference is you bought it instead of the GTX 5000.

Early tests by Jonathan Porter seem to indicate that the SDC 2300 is significantly superior to - for example the ATX in his Australian conditions. When people like Steve and other users get their hands on SDC 2300 and have a chance to compare them under North American conditions to detectors like the ATX and the TDI we will know a little bit more about whether it's worth the substantial premium over those other detectors.

Time will tell

This looks interesting. An app for Android devices for tracking your detecting and recording finds. The possibilities for prospecting are really huge.

Here's a post regarding the app.

Link deleted since Findmall update broke all old links

Here's a link to the Android Play Store for the app.

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.trib.app.tectotraklite

The IOS version is a Kickstarter Project and I went ahead and pledged $5 hoping he gets it done - cause I don't have an Android phone.

I just looked on Google Maps - I hate driving for 2 hours - what a trip.

The road to Chicken looks pretty curvy! Is it paved?

I'm curious, was that stuff too small to find with a GPX-5000 on the right small gold settings?

And just to makeup for introducing some off topic stuff in the above post, here's an interesting thread from OZ about the small gold detector scene.

http://golddetecting.4umer.net/t18787-new-whites-pi

Cheers

Thanks Reg. But what about the pony?

Seriously though, a light detector with GB Pro class small gold capability, a smooth threshold and good field usability (GB capability, hot rock insensitivity) would be ideal for most actual North American gold detecting requirements. Add the ability to ignore or identify at least the majority of iron down to depths where a 1 gram nugget would be detected (8inches maybe?) and you'd really have something.

Problem is, I'm not sure anybody's marketing department would want it. The TDI SL already comes close and I suspect that it isn't setting the world on fire sales-wise. Africa doesn't seem to want it, witness the Whites SPP appearing at jimmy Sierra after it flopped in Africa. Australia is tough because ML can apparently sell cheaper there than foreign detectors can match.

It doesn't sound like FT hired Carl just to please us, so I suspect we won't see anything new in the US for a while PI wise. If I had to bet, I'd bet on a European PI for their conditions.

The ML 5000 had devotees there based on extreme depth along with (reported) discrimination to 12" or so. This is based on a Danish report I read of an Iron Age battlefield dig where a Deus was used first, then a CTX used by the same team to find more stuff, then a GPX-5000 found "lots more". The same source emphasized that without the DD coil and ML's discrimination, the GPX-5000would have been useless.

I will be in Denmark for August and September and plan to meet up with the leading exponent of the GPX-5000 for relic hunting and see how it goes.

Wow!

Several of the most interesting folks in the MD world posting on the same thread.

I love the part about leaving baggage (but not hard-won knowledge) behind. Metal Detecting and especially prospecting attracts a lot of folks with strong convictions and (maybe it's the years in the sun) - sometimes sensitive skins ("thin skins" sounds so ugly).

Sensitivity to small gold down to 1 grain levels, stable threshold, immunity to most hot rocks, ability to deal with high levels of mineralization (at least by North American standards) and light weight - just add iron reject to 5" or so and I'll happily pay $1000 for it. Now how hard could that be - LOL!

Oh yes - and a pony!

Seriously though, reading this thread I felt like something significant just happened. Thanks for the forum, Steve.

Rick Kempf

Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

Apparently Carl Moreland has left his position as Engineering Division Manager at Whites Elecrtonics and is now Engineering Manager at First Texas Products. This according to Carl's Linkedin page -

https://www.linkedin.com/pub/carl-moreland/8/481/4b5?_mSplash=1

Carl is very experienced in PI detector design, both from his time at Whites and from his role as owner of the Geotech Forum.

First Texas makes a big chunk of their sales in the goldfields of the developing world. Their gold detectors are all VLF'S - you would think a good PI gold detector would be something they would want to have.

My bad. The Pro Swing is great!

It's gonna take a lot of sales to,shift $50M or so of inventory, but maybe a lot of it is Codan radio stuff - who knows and Codan's not saying.

In any event, Federal law - I think- makes it illegal for manufacturers to set retail prices and dealers are free to sell for any price they want. Restrictions on where they can sell are legal, so - if you want a good deal on new ML start with the most responsible and knowledgable dealers and see what you can work out.

The GPX 5000 remains for now and for the foreseeable future the absolute top gold nugget detector, so,if that's what you need, now might be a good time to buy.

The Pro-Swing Harness is included and it is GREAT.

ML's parent company has a $54M inventory which they REALLY need to get rid of. Now is a good time to buy - and remember "MAP" or Minimum Advertised Price doesn't mean minimum retail price. It will sell for whatever price you and an eager dealer agree on!

Apparently this is exclusive to Jimmy Sierra. It is not entirely clear if this is a one-time run of product or if this will form part of Whites regular offerings. Would seem to be more aimed at the African gold market, but who knows?

It looks like a smoking deal with the 2 coils.

Is this another Jimmie Sierra exclusive? I can't tell because the way Whites has their website set up – because I live in Arizona – whenever I try to go to their website I get sent to Jimmie Sierra.

I should be an interesting beach detector – you could detach the control box and put it in a more or less waterproof case pretty easily. The 10 ms pulse delay is shorter than the DF PI and you can use it at inland sites unlike the DF PI. If whites doesn't waterproof this darn thing themselves I have to wonder why. A relatively light waterproof case - add $300 to the price – and it seems to me that they would have a world beater here.

85¢ each at Jameco

http://www.jameco.com/1/1/52214-12bh341-gr-4-aa-battery-holder-snaps.html

What a beauty!

This is not the busiest Forum in the world, but there seems to be a certain focus developing of thoughtful, inquiring folks who want to share and learn without a lot of noise and nonsense.

Thanks for sharing. I suspect that there are a number of outlets for beautiful specimens like yours. It's not only the finding which requires a bit of digging, it can also be the marketing which can add great value.

Because I thought they didn't come with the coil cover – I didn't find the darn thing inside the front panel of the case until a couple of weeks after I had spent a happy hour plastering gorilla tape all over the bottom of my coil. Sad part is the gorilla tape is a heck of a lot harder to get off that was to get on. Life's tough when you're stupid!