palzynski

I am not quite sure about this . I have a brand new viper coil sent by the Garrett after service and I still have some issues from time to time with it . Not critical but annoying . Weird .. One last thing , it is very difficult on my Apex to insert/remove the coil connector in/from the control box, especially with the ripper , a little less with the viper . And I have some concern with this because this adds a mechanical stress on the PCB at each time I connect or disconnect the coil. Dont know if anyone else has this pb ...

Interesting your sons feedbacks from GM Denver thx ... It not easy at all when you have to deal with quality issues whatever the product . I have been working in a software company during 20+ years and I know it is not funny when you provide a service which does not work properly , too slow or(and) not reliable , I have experienced this ... But usually most of the issues can be solved with work , time and patience and I guess it will be the same for garrett and the apex ...

I have been using a Deus since 2013 , the HF round coil since 2018 , the HF elliptical since 1 week ...🙂 . I use the Deus for coin hunting in the North of France , then European conditions For the HF round I use the following settings , so far for the elliptical they should be similar : - moderate iron trash : Deus Fast nr 3 mode - 5 tones - 14khz - high iron trash Deus Fast nr 3 mode - 5 tones - 30khz I dont modify other factory settings than tones ans freq I dont use the higher freq at 50k , because of the too important depth loss , but it may interesting for searching tiny targets in the high iron trash Hope that helps ...

yes you cant go wrong with the ripper , the Apex is much more cumfortable to sweep with it , good depth , fast target centering ,very good in the iron trash . It is a big plus for the Apex ...

This is normal the Deus HF coils have been designed to pick up tiny targets like very small coins ( down to 0.5g ) that we are frequent over here in Europe. I agree that it may be different with the US bigger coins . I will post more details on the elliptical because I received it a few days ago and I already did an outing with it . I have the round HF coil since several years now ...

Yes but if we look at the figures they are not really good . Garrett has ( had ? ) definitely an issue with their Apex manufacturing quality , as I said in an other thread. Now the figures . There are 5 active Apex users on this forum at this time : Monte (4 Apex ), Jeff MC ( 1 ) , abenson ( 1 ), kac ( 1 ) and me ( 1 ). From what I read in the forum , 2 detectors and 2 coils have been send back by these users to the garrett after service. Which means a failure ratio of 50% ( 8 Apex , 4 issues ) which is really huge ...🥵 It is a pity because the Apex is really a good detector and I like it 🙂. Just I wonder why Garrett do not communicate a little more on this , at least we would know what is exactly going on ... And I hope that they will fix these issues . Hopefully mine is working well now even if I have an EMI ? or other ? issue from time to time for which I have a turnaround...

Well done kac for your gold ring with the Apex .. 🙂 On the other hand Garrett has definitely an issue with their Apex manufacturing quality . We are 4 active Apex users on this forum : Monte , Jeff MC , you and me , and all the 4 had to send back the Apex or a coil to the Garrett after service since last year. 🥵 And I know people over here have had issues from the discussions that I have from french MD dealers ... btw I had exactly the same pb than yours , crazy Viper coil . Garrett replaced it ok but now I am wondering what is going on at garretts . They should communicate a little bit on this because many customers seem to be involved... I hope that they will solve these issues because the Apex is really a nice detector

I just watch your videos they are interesting ... I think that what you notice about the falsing is important ; the Apex emits false signals in the mid tones from time to time on the ferrous ( nails head ) . The pb is that these signals sound very clean as if it they were good target signals . In the field with high iron trash I have noticed during my testing that it is exactly the same , quite frequent false signals that need a second sweep where they most often disappear . I have not this behaviour with a Deus which is almost silent between good targets. Same thing with a Teknetics T2 / FA mode which even more impressive than the Deus in nail beds , very impressive .. The Equinox has also a similar falsing in the irons , but with high pitched signals.

I already had this loss of pairings issue and I found a solution I think. The solution is to use the MS-3 with the bluetooth receiver on the side of the arm that sweeps the detector . For info this receiver is located close to the MS-3 ON/OFF button . Example : If you sweep the Apex with your right arm , then the MS-3 ON/OFF button must be on the right side of your head , as closest as possible from the Apex control box bluetooth transmitter . Since I do this I have never had any more pbs with my MS-3 ...

Looks like there will be an other challenger coming soon ... 🙂 I had a call today with a MD French dealer who told me that XP will release a new SMF detector this autumn , during October or November he said ... I have no more detailed things but this guy is reliable and I am quite confident with this info ... Until then ... do not accept paying more for less ! 🙂🙂 😹✌️

I still have yet not seen the videos I will do it when I have a little time available . Just one thing, I dont want to be negative but I am very careful with these 2D separation tests. The reason is because once I did one at home where I had excellent results ( I dont remember the machine ) . Unfortunately in the field the results were totally opposite and the detector was really poor in the iron trash . Why the results were so different between the home test and the field test? I dont know , may be because the home test is only 2D , while in the field there is a 3D structure with irons at different levels much which is more complex than a 2D device. I prefer testing the machines directly in the field , an area with high iron trash , same conditions for each machine , and simply determine the ratio number of coins found / hour for each detector On the other hand I am much more confident with home depth tests using boxes filled with ground because it is a 3D device and I have always had very good results with it. If a machine goes deep on the box it will go deep in the field. Perhaps we should imagine a 3D separation test using a box filled with a mix ground and irons , I dont know ... Just my opinion , as usual ..

Yes and no , during my testing I noticed that the Apex can pick up tiny targets like a 0.5g coin that a monofreq machine running at a freq like 8 or 10k will miss , even when the target is set down on the surface . Then the Apex Multiflex has at least the advantage to integrate high freqs which were not available in the previous Ace series ( Ace 100 to 400). On the other hand I was less impressed by the Apex depth perfos on big coins which are driven by the lower freqs like 5khz. It looks like the Apex Multiflex lower freqs are not as efficient as they are with the ML MultiIQ . However it is not a pb for me as I am usually more looking for speed/reactivity/iron filtering rather than pure depth perfos.

Yes you are right with videos you can see and hear , and some of them are interesting . But there are so many "marketing" videos that I am not really confident with all of them . For me the best way to seriously evaluate a detector is to spend 20 or 30 hours with it in the field , like I did with the Apex... Probably my dealer will ask me to test the new Nokta SMF when it arrives . I will use for it the same procedure as for the previous ones , bed tests and 20+ hours field testing . Wait and see ...

Yes it took me a long time to grade the Apex , firstly because of a faulty coil that I had to send back to the garrett after service , second because of a random instability bug . Now I have been using it during 30 hours then I understand it better . It is a good detector and I like it . It is fast and reactive on targets , it is a light detector especially with the ripper coil ( 1.1kg) , simple to use , a turn and go machine . It matches my European detecting conditions with high iron trash levels then I am happy with it 🙂 . It is a polyvalent detector that can do almost everything but cannot beat specialized machines on their terrains like the Deus in ultra high iron trash due to its freq limited to 20khz while the Deus goes up to 50 with the HF coils . It is not as deep as the ML Equinox and Vanquish on clean soils . But for its price the Apex does a good job . The most annoying thing for me with the Apex is some bug? emi? which occurs from time to time , but I have a turnaround , see the garrett forum for more details ... btw I dont do videos because they require a second person to film , and they require time to be correcly done . I prefer classical posts with pictures ... More details at the end of the following thread :

3,8 pounds then 1,7kg ... I hope it will be lighter than this because 1,7kg is approx. the weight of the ML Explorer a 20 years old design ... wait and see

Now the fields are plowed over here ( North of France ) and one of my favorite testing area is available. It is a very old place ,dating from the Roman times and infested with thousands of nails. This field that has been detected since 20 years by dozens of searchers and now only few tiny targets are remaining. The field is quite large , around 800 X 300 yards. The soil is moderately mineralized . I must say that this area is very specific because of its ultra high iron trash that probably can be found only in Europe due to its old and dense history. I decided to do a comparative tests between my 3 detectors ; a Deus HF round 9, an Apex Ripper and a Vanquish 540 V8. Actually I already wanted to do this test last year but could not do it due to lack of time , covid lockdown etc .. I have done 3 outings there with the 3 machines , for a total of around 6 hours detecting. The conditions were exactly the same for the 3 detectors , dry ground . The rule was to determine the ratio : number of coins found per hour , this for each machine. Long story short , here are the figures : 1 - Gold medal XP Deus Lite WS4 HF , 7 coins found during 1h20 ---> 5 coins per hour The XP is the most stable of the 3 machines . No false signals , almost silent between the targets . Very accurate and reactive on targets. Icing on the cake it is the lightest machine . A detector designed in Europe for European conditions ... 🙂 Settings : Deus fast mode , 30khz 2 - Silver medal Garrett Apex Ripper , 6 coins found during 2h ---> 3 coins per hour The Garrett is fast and reactive on targets 🙂, but a little unstable with a few false signals , which means that you have to come back on these "false" signals to recheck them which is time consuming. Apart from this it is a light machine, fun to use especially with this Ripper coil .... Probably the results would have been better if the Apex ran an higher freq like 25 or 30khz so that it could pick up tiny targets more easily. Unfortunately once again I had to disconnect/reconnect the coil connector to fix an EMI? pb. The Apex is a good detector but its reliability is sometimes disappointing .... 🥵 Settings : relics mode , freq MF 3 - Bronze medal Minelab Vanquish 540 V8 , 3 coins during 2h ---> 1,5 coin per hour The Vanquish is a robust and very reliable detector , but clearly has not been designed to work in the high iron trash. It has been very noisy here with continuous high pitched signals and honestly it is difficult to use in such areas 👿. However for some reason I have always been lucky with my Vanquish and I found with it the nicest artefact of this testing session , a fibula ( brooch ) dating from between the 1st and 4th century 🙂 , see pic below. Settings : JEWELRY mode CONCLUSION : At least I have learnt one thing during these tests ; it takes time to correctly assess a detector , especially when it has a new audio. This has been the case for the Apex. Now after 30 hours I think that I have a good idea of its strengths and weaknesses for my local conditions. Anyway I had fun with each of the 3 detectors in this field even if some are more efficient than the others ... Again these conditions are very specific and the results may be different in other areas/countries with less iron trash or more mineralized soil etc ... A few pics of the 3 outings below ...

I have also done more testing with the Apex the last weeks as the fields are plowed over here. I will provide more details in a post in the Garrett forum but I could compare it with a Deus HF and a Vanquish 540 . Up to now I have been detecting around 30 hours with the Apex . It is a good machine , not as good as a Deus and a little unstable in the irons , but faster and more reactive than a Vanquish , at least in my European conditions ( mild soil , high iron trash ). It is also lighter than a Vanquish. The most annoying for me with the Apex is some lack of reliability . I had to send a bad Viper coil to the Garrett after service - I know I am not the only one - and sometimes I have to disconnect/reconnect the coil connector due to erratic signals. I hope that Garrett will definitely solve these issues . I agree with that , SMF is not necessarily the best solution , at least in my European conditions . During my last comparative tests between a Deus , an Apex and a Vanquish 540 in a plowed field , ultra high iron trash , the Deus was the best machine , then the Apex silver medal , and the Vanquish bronze medal. I will add more details in an other post of the MD ADVICE and COMPARISONS forum.

In my reports/posts about the Vanquish I have always said that it is noisy on iron trashed areas , this even for experienced users , and I understand that a beginner could find this difficult , this is normal ... There are more stable machines like some tesoros/teknetics , the Xps , etc My advice would be to continue to learn the Vanquish , firstly by ear and not to focus on the target screen ids . The ear is a very accurate instrument , much more accurate than a digit on a screen ... My second advice would be to use the All Metal button when the signal is doubtful . If you ear a vey low tone , then it is a ferrous ... Hope that helps ... HH

Yes I noticed that the Apex stability is area dependant . Sometimes it is quiet and sometimes it is a little more tricky . Weird ... On the other hand my Deus is very stable almost everywhere using the factory modes , this without changing any settings . I hunt on moderately mineralized soils but often very trashy (irons ). Perhaps that Garrett will improve this stability in a future update as it looks like they already did with the 1.28.1 May update. I say "it looks like" because when I installed this 1.28.1 version in May I was not experienced enough with the Apex to distinguish a stability difference vs the prev. version. Again it is not dramatic, the Apex works very well for me and has a lot of interesting features that compensate for this little downside ...😀

kac , did you notice these little false signals between targets with the Apex? From my standpoint I am now used to this audio behaviour after 25 hours with the Apex but there are more stable detectors like the Tesoros and the XPs for example. I could not find a way to totally solve the issue , either reducing the sens , or switching the freq from MF to mono etc ... For an experienced user it is ok but a beginner could find this audio a little tricky ... However the Apex is still a great detector even with this downside , this because it is very fast and accurate on targets , also because it is a light machine etc ... Then may be not the gold medal for the Apex but the silver for sure ... 🙂

Hi Simon , Yes this was strange this EMI pb it just occured once with the Ripper. Now I never unplug the coil connector , it is always connected to the control box, even when I dont use the Apex . With no more risk to damage either the connectors or the CB when connecting / disconnecting the coil ... Concerning the Apex , may be you could be disappointed with it in NZ because for me it is more a machine for iron infested sites and it is not the deepest machine . The Vanquish or the Equinox go deeper on clean soils , but for me they are more difficult to use in the iron trash of European soils ...

As the fields are plowed now , I have been able to do a few more outings with my Apex. The last one was in a field near a small village in an area where I had already found small copper medieval coins . Curious to see if the Apex could find other coins ... Now I almost only use the Apex with the Ripper coil because this coil is very light and accurate . No time lost to locate the targets with a pinpointer , the Ripper does the job itself 🙂... Btw I wonder why Garrett has not proposed the Ripper as stock coil , for me the Ripper is the best coil of the Garrett coil set .. After 10 minutes of detecting , I was lucky enough to find a medieval coin , it was near the surface and the Apex did not miss it with a low tone ( VDI 43 ) .. Could not id the coin up to now , it is a feodal coin weighing 0.8g and dating from between the 10 to 12th centuries . I initially thought it was a silver but it looks like there is just a thin layer of silver on it, may be a fake one ... Anyway very happy with this find , the Apex has done the (right 🙂) job again .. Now after around 23 hours I better know the Apex. It is a little less stable than a Deus/Orx in high iron trash areas with a few false signals , but still excellent and accurate with short signals on targets . It is very easy to id high conductivity targets with their high tones. Definitely a very nice machine which however needs some time to get used to its audio as it is the case for all detectors ... and the trash , mainly 1st WW trash , casings bullets shrappnels etc ...

The same for me , I only hunt by ear with the Deus , no screen at all , just by ear. However I know very well the Deus audio as I have been using it since 2013 , and a Goldmaxx ( the Deus father 🙂 ) between 2007 and 2013 ... For example it is easy to recognize 1st ww casings with their medium tone and their little fuzzy sound ... Coins and relatively thin targets can be id with a clean sound but with a little reverberation ..

A little more infos concerning the detectors weights , as it is my speciality 🙂: - Deus / Orx 9HF detector total weight 750g ( coil weight 320g + 30g battery ) - Deus / Orx 11 X35 " " 800g ( coil weight 400g ) - Equinox 11 " " 1260g ( coil weight 420g ) Weights measured without coil cover

As it seems that lightness is important for you , the 9 HF is significantly lighter than the 11 X35 : - 9HF coil weight 320g + battery 30g - 11 X35 400g Then I would rather suggest the HF coil , which is for me the best of the XP coils . It has good depth performances on medium/big coins using the 14khz freq , and is excellent on small targets like small jewellery using higher freqs like 30khz. The 11 X35 coil will be deeper on big coins at depth using a low freq like 5khz , so it can be an interesting coil . However a little heavier , more iron masking , and the targets are more difficult to center ( a pinpointer is required ) .