Raphis

36 minutes ago, GB_Amateur said:

But related is my concern (apparently unneeded or you wouldn't have asked) that quiet signals can hide below the threshold.  That's certainly true with some detectors but now that you've brought it up I'm thinking maybe not relevant for the Eqx?

Do you think you’ll be waiting/listening with bated breath for a whisper signal on your Nox that only drops the threshold signal while you’re in all metal mode? How would you even pinpoint a dropout of threshold without any “beep” recognition? No can do, GB. 😬 Maybe you’d prefer hunting in pinpoint mode and only concentrate on digging the whispery targets? (Sorry for my sarcasm 😆)

Remove that threshold, my friend!  You won’t miss it for turf hunting the deepies one bit!!
 

The person who asks and challenges the most questions is the person that will make the most improvement/gains in their endeavors!! 👍🏼👍🏼

1 hour ago, GB_Amateur said:

I run with a soft but discernable threshold.

1 hour ago, GB_Amateur said:

My brain has trouble discerning good from bad hits in my trashy ground and in particular the quiet (typically deep) signals are the ones most likely to get missed in my case.

Hmm, why do you run with a threshold when I remember you stating in a previous discussion that you run the Nox in all metal mode?? That’s just another superfluous audio signal you have in the background.  What purpose does it provide you?  Without any notching out of your TID’s, audio threshold can be silenced.  As I stated above, you want your audio path to your ears to be as unadulterated as possible to be able to concentrate on hearing those very “difficult to discern” deeper targets.

1 hour ago, GB_Amateur said:

but can say without question that the WM08 requires line-of-site conditions.  I put mine in my upper jacket or shirt pocket -- right hand side since I swing left handed.  If my detector is on the ground and I simply turn away from it (e.g. to walk to the car to get a tool I forgot) the headphones go silent. 

So you do use your hardwire audio cable...it’s just not directly connected to your Nox 😂. I would have gladly paid $75 less, or whatever the cost of that WM08 module is, if I could have bought the Nox without that accessory.  I’m perfectly happy with my hardwire connection...it’s one less thing I have to think about when hunting for the deepies.  I want to hear exactly what the output of the Nox processor is producing without any chance of airwave dropouts/EMI fluctuations, distance/line of sight issues, slight audio delays, or extra digital to analog conversions of the audio path.  I have been an audiophile enthusiast for decades, and solid, traditional gold plated shielded hardwire connections suit me fine.

6 hours ago, mn90403 said:

Simon and I would probably like to challenge you to use the 15" coil.  We had many discussions about it and he was more in favor of it than I was.  I considered it a 'finicky' coil until the last software upgrade.  That upgrade made coins in Beach 1 sound like the coins in Park 1 that I use in dry sand.  I can take it out on the beaches and get great coverage and depth and I've found many good targets following other beach diggers.  Simon has perfected it for his silver coin field.

If you don't have access to a 15 you could use mine for a week or so and make a comparison.  Heck, I just let you use my whole detector with the 15 since were're in the same area and I'm on the sidelines for a bit.

Mitchel, thanks for your response and appreciate your accolades of my discussions on this forum.  👍🏼

I’m certain that if I was detecting a beach with my Nox, I’d probably get the 15” coil.  I pretty much only use my PI machine with a 17”x13“ coil when I hunt the beaches as it gives me great coverage and maximum depth, and I nearly dig any smooth sounding targets with that machine in the sand.  
 

As for dirt/turf hunting, I could never see myself using a 15” coil in the local parks here in So Cal...our turf here in most every old, inner city park is just way too trashy to use a coil of that size.  My buddy, years ago, tried using a 15” coil on his Explorer , and after less than an hr, he was walking back to his car to swap it for his stock coil! 😆 Also, years ago, I briefly borrowed a friend’s CTX and tried using the 17” coil at an old park.  I didn’t like it, not only for its weight/drag across the surface, but it was just a poorer separator when multiple targets mixed with an iron target were below the coil.  Target separation becomes just as important, if not more so, than maximum depth for finding old coins in the turf.  Granted, I did use an Ultimate 13” coil on my Explorer years ago, and I did like it before the coil crapped out on me, but if that had been a 15”, I probably wouldn’t have bought it.  As heavy as the Explorer is (especially with the Sunray in-line probe attached), my shoulder/arm wouldn’t have held up very well swinging that large of a coil.  I appreciate your offer to give your coil a try.  My confidence with the stock Nox coil in turf is sky high, and I don’t feel a the 15” would give me any extra edge at local parks here, but for beach use, yes, the 15” would have my approval!!

3 hours ago, cudamark said:

Raphis mentioned hunting 2-4 hours and covering an area maybe 200 X 200 feet. I wouldn't even cover that much in that amount of time, so, I don't think I'm moving too fast..... Maybe half that at most. I like to really analyze every sound in these places. It's just that there are so many, it takes a lot of time.

CudaMark,

I revisited my statement about how much ground I cover in a given period of time, and I corrected my estimates to roughly 100’x100’ area in a 2-4 hr hunt....This is a rough estimate, because if I’m finding oldies in the area I’m hunting, and the site is trashy, I’m staying put in a small area for quite a lengthy time, swinging my coil from many different directions, zigzagging thru the region, until I feel it’s time to move on....and if I’m still at the same site, I may move back to that hot zone again and test my luck....I’ll most certainly go back again on another day.  Trust me, I hunt very slowly and patiently....sorry for my earlier, inflated estimates of the area I cover.. 🤓

As for your issues with cut coins, I’m assuming you’re getting pestered by newer, clipped clad coinage (as opposed to older clipped/chopped coinage).  I don’t typically find pieces of clad coinage, but I do find badly mangled/chewed clad quarters, along with a few bent clad dimes from time to time, but I’ve never really been pestered by them at any of the hundreds of sites I have hunted in my area.  I do find chopped silver and wheat penny coins regularly here, and whenever I find those, I feel more of an accomplishment, that I was able to find a piece of a deep old coin, and know I’m not missing whole, deep old coins that often.

i can recall on a couple hunts in the past, where I had found 2 pieces of the same silver coin, within 5 ft from each other.  Another time, I had found 3 pieces of the same silver Washington quarter, all pieces within a 10 ft radius.  After connecting all the pieces together, it looked as if there were still a sliver of the coin still missing 😲

Somtimes, I even find octagon shape and crucifix shaped wheat pennies too! 😹🤣

1 hour ago, GB_Amateur said:

Are you talking about the ML80 wireless headphones (supplied with the Eqx 800), some other Bluetooth headphone, or the WM08 combined with wired headphones?  (This last is what I've used from very early on, swapping out wired earbudes with wired headphones in summer heat, but still attaching to the WM08 module.)

1 hour ago, GB_Amateur said:

Just a couple more questions -- hope you don't mind me pestering:  do you use the 11" coil exclusively and are you running the latest (version 3.x) software?

You can ask me as many questions as you like, GB!  I’ve got all the free time in the world 😅.  I’m retired (in my mid 50’s)....along with all these strict covid measures here in Los Angeles and the skyrocketing new cases/hospitalizations climbing exponentially, I’m at home on my Cell phone and this forum more often than not. 
 

I used the minelab supplied headphones and Bluetooth (not the WM08) for a few months before purchasing a nice audiophile grade pair of Bluetooth (low latency) headphones by Aiwa, called the Arc-1. I used the Bluetooth of my Aiwa’s for a month or so before switching permanently to a hardwire connection on my Aiwa’s.  I tried using the WM08 module, but had terrible results with it...my audio signal was always going in and out...probably a combination of carrying my cellphone around my waste, and attaching the wireless module to my backside on my belt buckle....I actually don’t mind having to use a hardwired connection one bit!  In fact, I believe it gives me an advantage at hearing the deepies, plus I don’t have to worry about charging more batteries, and I can eke out longer operating times with my machine,  since I deactivate the internal Bluetooth circuitry in the Nox (even though I use a power bank to double my operating times before charging).

You commented about my hunting speed, and I gave you an answer of 200’x200’ in a 2-4 hr hunt time, but now that I pictured and reminisced on a few recent hunts I’ve been on, that square footage I quoted earlier is quite large 🤔🤓.  I can remember last week hunting 2-4 hrs in a zone no bigger than 100’x100’.  Trust me, I don’t move that fast, and I do hunt, as you do, where the coil is scrubbing the surface in more straight lines than huge arcs.
 

I am using the latest Nox software....I played around with 4 kHz single freq for a couple hunts, and found a few deep silver dimes and wheats with it, but was frustrated at the lack of more accurate ID’s on targets in 4 kHz.

I always use my 11” coil...no other coils....I remember when I first bought my Explorer SE back in 2007, within a few months, I had purchased 2-3 aftermarket coils (a Sunray 8”, an 8x6, and a 12x8 elliptical).  They were all fun to use, and I used them on and off for a year or two, but always returned to my 11”...years later, I did purchased a 13” coil for my Explorer, and that’s the coil I found my only gold coin with back in 2013.  The coil started to false in wet grass after less than a year of use, so I returned back to the 11” Pro coil, and have never bought another aftermarket coil for my turf machines....I feel very comfortable with my 11” coil, and have even more confidence with it on my Nox, because of the Nox’s fantastic target separation with that stock coil.  I’m finding the tiniest pieces of silver and other trinkets, along with digging silver and other deep, old coinage in holes with other targets in them, so the stock coil is my “go to” all the time. 
 

Look at that piece of Merc I found last week in my photo...

Here’s the pic of the 13 silver day I had a couple weeks back with the Nox from a well hunted park, however, this was my “1st” trip there hunting with my Nox!!

2 hours ago, phrunt said:

What the deep coin hunters have done without knowing it is taught themselves how to find gold nuggets!  It sounds like I would not like to go in a nugget hunt competition with Raphis and I myself was surprised how using the Nox for many coin hunts ended up improving my nugget hunting ability with the Nox.

You've given some excellent information there Raphis, thanks for those posts.  The Equinox is currently my favourite detector and it's going to take something pretty special to change that.

Thanks phrunt!  You are actually spot on with regards to deep coin hunter’s abilities in finding gold!  I had a friend who hunted mostly beaches here in So CA, and he told me that with my knowledge I gained from deep coin hunting, I would be “a terror“ on the beach if I hunted them....I was just an occasional beach hunter back in 2007, but since I lived within a few minutes of the beach, I ended up buying a TDI Pro back in 2014.  Granted, a PI machine is completely different technology to the VLF’s, but in the two years that followed my new detector purchase, I ended up finding over 600 silver coins and 40+ gold rings, hunting my beaches at snail pace (which most typical beach hunters don’t do), keeping my coil on the sand at all times, and listening to whisper signals while the TDI Pro was maxed out on sensitivity (No Ground balance).  Most of those finds were crazy deep (15-26”+) with my 17x13 Nugget Finder coil, and it took every muscle in my body to recover those targets 😂.  The beach/dirt combo hunter knows how infinitely harder it is to recover deep beach targets than it is to recover a dirt target. I obviously never hunted in the water with my TDI Pro.  I was hunting the Surfline and dry, hard packed sand.

10 hours ago, GB_Amateur said:

Great post, Raphis!  It's these kinds of details I wish more people would express.  Multiple things you said (I just quoted the sweetspot) are news to me while some confirmed what I've noticed but wasn't 100% convinced from my own observations.

To find these whispers, how slow do you hunt?  Can you give an estimate of how much ground you cover in an hour?

10 hours ago, GB_Amateur said:

I wish you could come detect my parks and schools.  I want to see what you would find and how you'd do it.  It would be worth it to me to have you clean out (relative term even for you) half of my locations just to be able to learn how I can harvest the other half.

Thanks, GB!  Funny you mentioned about wishing I could come to your hunting grounds just to see what I’d find...I had a buddy who used to call me to hunt his sites he hasn’t taken me to before, in hopes that I would start finding oldies, and bring his old sites back to life. 😂. I remember at least 5 sites he told me to go and hunt (sites I hadn’t hunted before), and  within minutes of hunting there, I was finding deep, old coinage at a good rate! He was swinging a Minelab Quattro at the time, and was having difficulty in hearing my deepie signals, but after he purchased a used Explorer II, his oldie finds started to increase.

How slow do I hunt and how much ground do I cover in an hr?  That depends on the trash density of the site I’m hunting, but most of the time, I hunt at “snail pace”.  I have only a few buddies I hunt with nowadays (used to be many more), and most of the time they are first to mention about wanting to move to a new site from our current site.  I usually tell them we’ll give our current spot another 15-20 min....sometimes if I or my buddies find more oldies in that time allotment, we end up staying another hr 😲😅, and sometimes we make our best finds because we stayed in one spot and didn’t move to another place in the day....patience, persistence, perseverance!!!

Most of the sites I hunt are very trashy (both non ferrous and ferrous trash).  In the highest of trash densities I hunt, I could spend 2-4 hrs easy in a 200’x200’ area....and in a high % of these types of sites, I’d go back to that same area more than 20 times over a period of 10 years....and even after a whole decade of pounding these spots, I’ll probably still go back to them and see if conditions have changed and/or if there’s still anything worth finding.  Obscure targets can be missed very easily. Also ground conditions will change over time to help/hinder your oldie finding efforts (wet/dry ground, grass height, decaying iron/aluminum, etc). I typically don’t “strip mine” a site.....I really don’t want to dig pulltabs/ring tabs and other trash targets...however, I will dig a piece of trash that is affecting an obscure deepie, keeper target that I’m hearing next to it.  

I’d also like to mention to you a few of my settings, which can be critical to hearing deep “iffy” targets on your Nox.

Sensitivity— This is a no brainer, but those really “on the fringe of max depth” targets can only be found when your sensitivity is at near max or max...So I hunt mostly in sensitivity 24 or 25...I’ll share with you Something I can’t quite explain about the sensitivity I hunt with on my Nox.  When I first started using my Nox back in June, I could never hunt at near max sensitivity....I was hunting around 20-22.  The machine seemed so unstable at 24-25.  I was mostly hunting in Park 1 at that time, with an iron bias of around FE-4.  All other settings on my machine back then are the same as they are today, except now I hunt in Field 1, and use F2-0 iron bias.  After 6 months have passed, I’m able to hunt at 24-25 in most every site I hunt at now...I ground balance/noise cancel (GB/NC) often throughout the day (maybe this was the difference from what I was doing before), when I feel those settings have digressed from optimum...I occasionally find myself GB/NC’ing immediately after locating a deep, iffy target just to see if the target changes in the way I hear it on my headphones before I dig it up.  Sometimes the GB/NC sequence makes the target sound cleaner, and sometimes it sounds the same as before.

Iron Bias -  I don’t want any chance of my machine to misinterpret a deep, iffy silver coin as iron, so I hunt with 0 IB. I’ll dig an occasional Ferrous object to not miss deep keeper targets. If you’re not digging the occasional Ferrous targets, you are missing some deep, iffy, masked non-ferrous targets.

Recovery speed - This setting can make/break your hunt/quest for the deepies.  I hunt with a speed setting of 4.  If I tried to change to 5 after locating a deep iffy that is difficult to hear on Speed setting of 4, the signal at 5 becomes either completely masked or gets more faint/obscure, causing anybody to pass right over the target. At lower settings, the recovery speed doesn’t give me adequate target separation (hunting in high trash sites) and makes the machine more noisy as you swing over the ground.  So, 4 has been my fav setting for all my sites I hunt at.

All Metal - Hunting in all metal is highly recommended...you don’t want your machine to blank your audio at any time, especially when a deep iffy keeper target is co-located to ferrous/non-ferrous trash that you had notched out. Lower the audio (pitch/volume) on the ferrous ID’s and other trashy ID’s, but don’t notch them out.

Headphones (Hardwired or Wireless ??) - This may be subjective, but my senses (ears) are telling me otherwise.  I had never hunted wireless before, until I started detecting with my Nox...I used the wireless for 3-4 months, and thought it was the cat’s meow.....until one day my headphone batteries died and I went back to the car to grab my audio cable....The difference of audio hardwiring my headphones was more than just subtle...the audio of deeper targets seemed more pronounced (harder hitting)....from that day on, I’m using my audio cable when I hunt.  I have an audio extension cable coming soon, so I can route my audio cable to the back of my Nox (by my elbow), to keep it out of the way when I  kneel down to recover my targets.

BEST OF LUCK TO ALL OUT THERE!!

STAY HEALTHY!! 👍🏼🤙🏻

My only gold coin I ever found was an 1897 S $5 coin in near uncirculated condition.  It was 8-9” deep, and sounded similar to a deep Indian cent on my Explorer SE Pro....this was back in 2013.  The park I found the coin at (yes, an inner city park) produced numerous barber dimes, Barb quarters, and a barber half, along with 4 or 5 seated dimes, a handful of V’s, and 30-40 Indian pennies.  The park has been hunted by a local detecting club for years....I, along with my 15-20 hunt buddies have been detecting this park since 2007.  It’s amazing that this gold coin remained so elusive to all of us for so many years before I found it. And the kicker is the coin was less than 10 ft from an old tree we’ve hunted countless times over the years...the tree was smack in the middle of the oldest area that produced the old coinage.....never give up on a spot that has produced for you in the past....your best find may be just waiting for you to unearth.

11 hours ago, GB_Amateur said:

I found such a target which read VDI in the high 30's in Park 1 but dropped to the teens in Field 2.  If I could eliminate those, that would save digging a large, deep holes (and the time involved).  Then yesterday I got a similar signal (this time varying mid-20's to mid-30's in Park 1 and teens in Field 2) and decided to confirm my 'discovery', expecting a moderate piece of iron.  It was an early Wheat cent (TID low 20's out of the hole)!!

Out of the 30+ years of detecting under my belt, I have never really gone out on a hunt at a park and told myself I was gonna just concentrate on finding nickels and other possible lower conductors (gold).  
 

Sometimes, while at home, I think about how a day will come soon enough where I hunt that will “force” me to have to concentrate more on deeper low conductors because there will be a lack of deep, higher conductors to make my drive/trip worth my efforts.  Maybe I think about it because I’m dreading that day (I hope it never comes)....Our parks, like most heavily populated, older inner city parks, are just loaded with low conductive trash, so “angling for nickels”, or even gold is an arduous task, that will cause one to repeatedly empty out their trash pouches at the nearest trash can!!

I’m an old coin/artifacts hunter, and dig most every deep target >= 20 ID at depth, in addition to any ID >= 27 at any depth. I will concentrate on solid sounding 12-13 ID deeper conductors from time to time (only when the lack of deep high tone targets gets too few and far between for the area I’m detecting.  I’m a very patient hunter (gotta have that trait to be a successful old coin hunter), knowing very well that the older sites are not easily hunted out, so I spend a great deal of time hunting at snail pace, spots I have found “oldies” at countless times over the years.......and still find them with my Nox. 💪🏼👍🏼

Because I prefer to hunt for deep high conductive targets (Indian pennies, wheats, silver, etc), I prefer hunting in Park 1 or Field 1 on my Nox. If I wanted to concentrate on low conductors, including nickels, I’d probably hunt in Park 2 or Field 2.  
 

Park or Field 1 gives better, more accurate ID’s for higher conductors than Park/Field 2 does.  What I really like about the Nox in Park/Field 1 is that a super deep high conductor will ID higher than it typically would at a shallower depth.  For instance, a wheat penny at 8+ inches will typically ID at a higher value (sometimes in the mid to upper 30’s), as opposed to where it typically ID’s at 24-25 at shallower depths. Similarly, I have dug numerous silver dimes that have ID’d way above a typical US Quarter signal, even as high as 39....it’s this up-converting of the ID for lower frequency weighted Park/Field 1 modes that will never allow me to pass up those targets (since I stated above I never pass up ID’s above 19 in deeper strata).  I can’t think of an instance I will be hunting in Park/Field 2, for my hunting preferences......unless maybe that day will come where I’m only gonna angle for low conductors such as gold and US nickels.

The Nox 800 has been a “BIG” upgrade to my Explorer SE Pro.....I’m finding numerous old coins from areas I had stopped hunting with my Explorer....just the other day, I managed to have a 13 silver coin, 27 wheats day (6 hr hunt) at a park I pretty much gave up on with my Explorer. Many of these targets were in higher mineralized(noisy) ground, with depths the length of my propointer.....this wasn’t an isolated instance with my Nox either....this machine has re-opened up many local sites for me since I purchased it this past June. 

Some may be asking, how can this be possible?  Aren’t the FBS Minelab machines supposed to be superior to the new, Multi-IQ technology in the Nox, with regards to deeper higher conductive targets?  ( I remember even Minelab stating this two years ago when the Equinox first came out).  Had Minelab openly stated 2 years ago that this multi-IQ technology was superior to FBS with respect to “deep high conductors” , I probably would have pre-ordered a Nox before they hit the market.....I was “a holdout”......I waited to buy this machine, and really only purchased it because I was getting older (and more achy) and wanted to swing a lighter machine...I also had a buddy that purchased one early this year, and his finds from areas I hunted started to impress me.  Since purchasing my Nox, I have been so impressed at the depth of the machine along with it’s ability to hit the tiniest of deep high conductive targets...I have found so many “pieces” of chopped wheat pennies and silver coins at depth (yes, lawn-mower clipped old coins) with the Nox, along with tiny copper/silver charms....Sure I found plenty of chopped old coinage with my Explorer, but it has been much more frequent with my Nox.  I’ll be honest, many of the very deep targets, are not your typical “dig me, I’m an oldie” signal....they are very obscure signals, but I guess with all the years of hunting I had with my Explorer, it has helped me to hone in on these obscured, iffy sounding targets better....when I say “Iffy”, I mean the target that can’t be easily construed that one has a bonafide signal under one’s coil....with signals like this, one has to caress or coax the signal by wiggling your coil back and forth at just the right cadence to even get it to repeat enough so one can hear it....wiggle too fast or slow, and you won’t hear a beep/chirp, and that’s with hunting in all-metal, which I always hunt with my Nox.....so the deepest signals are not blanking because there’s a co-located target (i.e. iron) with it that I’ve notched out...these targets are just at the upper limit of detection with the mix of settings I’m using along with the ground I’m hunting at.

On 12/2/2020 at 3:01 PM, EL NINO77 said:

Improvement of ID accuracy in Allmetall : especially for weak signals., Or mineralization difficult terrain  All metall does not have ID quality as Discrimination ON at 0, +1 ID.

Could you elaborate a little more on your statement?  Are you saying that the Equinox ID accuracy in all metal (nothing notched out) is inferior compared to if ID’s 0 and 1 were notched out?  I’ve never heard this Nox limitation/shortcoming from anyone before. 🤔

As Steve, Monte, and others have stated in this thread, I can 100% emphasize how critical a proper ground balance on the Equinox (or any machine with ground balance capabilities) will make on how you hear a deep, masked target.  If your ground balance is not properly set to the ground you’re detecting, a deep target may not even ID (audibly/visually) to a level that would make you aware you even had a target to dig.

I always ground balance my Equinox immediately after power up, and as I detect from one area of my turf location to another, I‘ll repeat the ground balance.  I never leave my GB in auto.  I lock it.  I hunt in very trashy ground, and I feel auto GB would be detrimental to my hunting of deeper targets.  I’ve hunted for over a decade with my ML Explorer, and know quite well how detrimental “auto” sensitivity was on that machine in trashy/noisy ground, thus I always used manual sens.

This same logic on GB also holds true with EMI and the Noise Channel setting.  Being on a noise channel that is as EMI-free as possible is critical to the operator in being able to hear those deeper, fainter targets. Most every time I ground balance my machine throughout the day, I will do a noise cancel also.  If you can commit to doing/repeating these two steps if your ground/EMI fluctuate, you will be pocketing more keeper targets that others have passed over.  Even if you’re not 100% certain a change in Noise Channel and/or GB is warranted, do it anyway....you may be pleasantly surprised!  For me, it’s easier to decipher if my Noise Channel is not optimal (if you hear noise in your headphones without moving your coil) but it’s more subtle (for me) when my GB is not optimal...that’s why I GB often throughout the day...another reason I try to do these steps throughout my hunts is I typically hunt turf that has been hunted by myself and quite a few local hunters countless times over the decades, so having that “extra edge” in hearing the few deepies left in the areas I hunt (Needles in the haystack) will make/break my hunts.  Let’s face it...many of us are hunting heavily pillaged ground anyways...unless your ground has been whited-out from the surface to around 5” (which is highly unlikely), you’re gonna have to hunt at snail pace and from every angle possible, and also at different times of the year (when ground is more saturated and/or when the grass is cut low or is dormant/dry) to eek out those remaining, elusive oldies hiding, patiently waiting to see the light of day again! 😃

I also read that someone said Iron Bias affects depth of the machine.  I haven’t noticed that, but definitely sensitivity (Higher value = more depth, obviously) and Recovery Speed (higher value = less depth) are directly proportional to overall depth of your machine.

Lastly, and this could probably be a topic/thread on its own, is the cadence of your swing speed...the proper cadence/swing speed of your coil can definitely influence how well/poor you can hear a very deep target...swinging your coil too slow over the ground could make your machine completely pass over a deeper target without any audible/visual indication.  The same holds true if you swing your coil too fast over the ground while detecting...it’s gonna take time/hrs/days/months of hunting for some of you to realize this.....but you will eventually. Practice proper swing cadence by swinging over a known, whispery deep target, and monitor how the target sounds based on your swing cadence.

On 10/14/2020 at 1:03 PM, dewcon4414 said:

I happened to check those bolt mounts because two friends had they pods break completely off the shaft.  Keith said the after market shafts maybe the issue.  Apparently the OD on some maybe to small.  So people are over tightening them.  Also if its to small it wears the CF enough they get re-tightened.   Keiths word of caution .... take care in tightening those bolts.

Minelab seconds that caution on tightening those pod mount bolts....there’s an instructional on Minelab’s site for replacing the Li-Ion battery in the Equinox, and for the step on mounting the pod back on to the shaft, Minelab states to tighten those mount bolts with a torque no greater than 1 nM (newton meter), which is equivalent to 8.85 inch pounds or about .74 ft lbs of torque....that’s not a lot of torque!  I suspect Nox owners are tightening those bolts 3-4 times the recommended torque.

5 hours ago, Khameleon21 said:

So did you remove the one from your Nox?  I can see not spending extra money on a coil cover and taking a chance.  At least the Nox I got came with one installed.  Just curious of the downside of using one in your opinion. 

Yes, I removed my coil cover...there’s not many downsides...it’s really personal choice...you won’t lose depth if you use your cover....that would be a deal breaker for all....if you opt to use your cover, you’ll need to take it off and clean inside from time to time...Dirt/sand can build up between the coil and the cover...I prefer to wash off my coil after each use, and I’d rather not have to take off my cover every time I want to douse it with water...water will also work it’s way in between the cover and coil, adding unnecessary weight to your coil...Especially when hunting in the wet sand and beach/surf zone....that little bit of extra weight of sand/water (an ounce or two) can wear you out sooner....when the extra weight is further from your swing arm, the resistance on your arm has a greater effect. In other words, you probably won’t feel two extra ounces at your detector’s hand grip than you would if that weight were on the coil or lower shaft.  If you’re “young” and strong, the little bit of extra weight probably won’t affect you...I’m middle aged, and prefer as much weight savings as I can...that’s why I added a 3rd party carbon fiber upper/lower shaft to my Nox...I felt the weight savings immediately after installing those shafts on my Nox.

If I were you, I’d try detecting with and without your cover...then you’ll know, in due time, what “you” prefer...that’s what matters the most!

Forgot to mention a word on pinpointers....If you use one, I’d highly recommend using a pinpointer tip protector/cover....a lot of hunters wear out the tips of their probes by scraping their probe tips inside their hole trying to locate their target....once you wear out your probe’s tip, you’re screwed...there’s 3rd party probe tip covers for most every probe, and some probes come with their own tip covers..

No coil covers for me....I bought a Pro coil for my ML Explorer SE back in ‘08-‘09 when they first became available, so it has been over 10 years.  It still functions perfectly. I hunt mostly turf and beaches and I’m not a weekend warrior...I hunt 3-4 times a week, 4-10 hrs per hunt.  I used to avg 5 hunts a week, but now I have other hobbies I enjoy besides detecting.  I don’t expect my Nox’s coil to have any problems without a cover either. I also have a 13x17” coil for my whites TDI Pro (about 5 yrs now) and haven’t used a cover for that coil either, and it is still in great shape.

2 hours ago, RobNC said:

What exactly does it mean when you are going over an area and the threshold tone disappears or "nulls out to silence" for a second but yet there is no target audio?

It means your coil swung over an object (ferrous or non-ferrous) that you have rejected on your machine’s discrimination pattern......a threshold that goes silent momentarily is called audio blanking.  For instance, if you reject the ID’s between 14-18, and your coil passes over a square tab or any metal object that’s within the rejected range I just described above, your threshold will blank (become silent) momentarily. 
 

Back when I detected with a Minelab Explorer, I used an audio threshold,  because I had a small amount of discrimination set (for small iron objects).  I could tell when I passed over iron when my threshold went silent....Now, I hunt with my Equinox and use no threshold.  That’s because I have no ID’s rejected on my Nox.  I hunt in all metal, and utilize the machine’s Target Tone, Tone Pitch, and Tone Break settings to adjust typical iron and small foil target ID’s to have lower volumes/pitches than the the non-ferrous objects I want to hunt for. That gives me the delineation I need without the use of a threshold.   I now prefer hunting with no threshold...it’s one less parameter your brain has to account for. 🤓

2 hours ago, EL NINO77 said:

After these 3 tests I can state ... is Iron Bias F2 is the second and strongly improved generation of Iron Bias settings at Equinox .

Very good write up/tests! 👍🏼  Could you also conclude after doing your tests that FE-0 and F2-0 are pretty much identical, meaning a 0 value for either iron bias filter setting is as close to “Off” as one can achieve, or will you still give a slight  advantage to F2-0 with regards to non-ferrous unmasking and deeper iffy targets??

7 hours ago, cudamark said:

I've used the F2 setting pegged at 9 quite a bit and haven't seen any down side to doing it......yet anyway. I'm still getting tiny foil non-ferrous readings of 1 in modes Park 1 and 2; Field 2, and Beach 1 and 2. I'll try to remember to experiment with Field 1 (which I almost never use) and the Gold modes. My only concern might be what effect it would have at depth.....or maybe in depth would be a better term. In using F2 @9 I don't "feel" it's detrimental, but, maybe it is and I haven't noticed it.

I would consider an F2-9 IB setting detrimental to my type of hunting, which is trashy parks.....I wouldn’t feel comfortable with that high of a setting because I have tested the F2 IB on deeper targets (6-10”) in trashy, iron infested turf, and have noticed a difference between an  F2-4 and an F2-0 on real iffy targets... F2-0 IB hangs on to the non-ferrous signal “longer” than F2-4 (while doing the Minelab wiggle on your coil)....so I’d imagine F2-9 would be even more obscure on the non-ferrous response than F2-4 would be.

Higher iron bias settings favor the ferrous response of the target more than the non-ferrous response. 

11 hours ago, Steve Herschbach said:

The part I do not show? There are good items that will do the same, and I need to try and find one. In theory there is a good item that will give a false ferrous if this setting is too high.

some examples:

A US dime placed on a US nickel...or a dime placed on top of an aluminum square tab.

In other words, 2 non-ferrous targets which will read as ferrous if you increase the iron bias...it’s been quite some time since I ran this test (and I only did it with FE IB), but I think the Nox 800 only registers a ferrous response on the above two scenarios at the max setting of FE 09.

Maybe someone can try this with F2 IB also...I’ll run a test tomorrow, if nobody reports back before I do.

I’ve only been using my 800 for a few months now, and originally started using a low FE bias at 2 or 3, then switched over to F2-4, and felt I could just set F2 to 0 a few hunts later with no extra/excessive digging of ferrous targets, and in return gain an improved response of deeper non-ferrous targets next to ferrous targets. (Before my 800 purchase, I was using an FBS machine (Explorer SE) for 13 years in conductive tones with just a smidgeon of Iron discriminated out, and so I feel very comfortable at being able to ascertain ferrous from non-ferrous at the F2-0 setting on my 800).  I hunt mostly old, trashy parks, with quite a bit of deep iron (Mostly rusty nails/bolts (i.e. “chicken bone“ type iron in them)).

Steve, I remember you, some months ago, uploading an image comprised of FE and F2 Iron Biases, where you had stated that FE-0  was equivalent to F2-4, and the entire FE Iron Bias range (0-9) falls within an F2 Iron Bias range between 4 and 6, inclusive.  Does this pic still have meaning after your tests you ran today??  ....  F2-4 in your test above didn’t produce the same result as FE-0 did.....Also, along those same lines of questioning, is F2-0  still considered “less” Iron bias than FE-0 ??? 🤔

There’s just a plethora of Nox videos on YouTube today... Back in 2007, when I started using a Minelab detector (Explorer), there were very few good YouTube videos available to watch.....I learned all the nuances of how to hunt with my FBS machine thru trial and error, and countless hours of digging “iffy” signals...the Minelab “wiggle” became a mainstay in my detecting, and it was a very critical aspect to the success of my hunting. Checking/identifying questionable/partially masked targets 360 degrees (from all directions) in order to arrive at a dig/no dig conclusion should be incorporated by every hunter, including every Multi-IQ hunter.

Ironically,  this NW Detector sales Video (above), along with other vids by this person, started showing up in my YT suggested viewing list a couple weeks ago...This guy seems to have figured out on his own what I had learned 13 years ago also.

With regards to single/multi-frequency modes on the Nox, I have learned (out in the field and from the Nox manual) that multi-freq will produce more accurate target id’s than single frequency will.  Also larger coils, like the one the guy in the video above was using will make separating co-located targets more difficult than smaller coils..I think most hunters know this already though.....Also, on the Nox, the recovery speed setting greatly affects how you hear closely located targets, so be aware of that (higher recovery speed=better target separation, but sacrifices overall depth)....I’ve watched that NW Detector Sales guy in a few of his videos use very low recovery speed settings on his Nox, which allows the machine to hear deeper targets, but also prevents separation of co-located targets.

Congratulations on a spectacular find, Mitchell!👍🏼  

Over the many years that I posted my finds (beach and turf) across 4 different detecting forums, in addition to viewing thousands of other posters’ pics of their finds, I have developed a “sixth” sense, if you will, of being able to tell  whether a piece of gold/silver looks to be a counterfeit, regardless of its karat stamping...granted, the pic(s) have to be detailed/high quality to be able to tell this, and yours have the “detail”.

I’m praying your necklace is the real McCoy...🙏, but I think you should test its metal content..but only if “you” care to.....I never trust a marking on a piece of jewelry anymore, because I’ve been burned royally by even my own finds...

I have found more than I want to admit, pieces of gold jewelry that were stamped with a karat value, only to test the metal, and it turns out to be a fake piece.  😌  Some details I see on your necklace make me hesitant to immediately want to accept it’s 18k stamping...also a 24” solid 18kt chain of the width of yours would/should be 2-4 times your measured weight...

I’d first hit it with a magnet, then if there’s no magnetism, test it with 18 kt gold acid..Whenever I find a gold piece on a hunt, I usually can’t wait to get home and do a scratch/acid test on my find.

Cheers, Mitchell!

HH,

Dan (Raphis)

On 8/12/2020 at 9:04 AM, GB_Amateur said:

 

On 8/11/2020 at 9:12 PM, nickeldNdimed said:

I think they are all recovery speed 3 by default.

No -- see the tables Chase posted right below your recent post, or look in the manual = User Guide (that's where he got them).

 

Chuck,

Chase was referencing an older copy of the Equinox manual in his post yesterday...In the latest manual, the default Nox 600 recovery speed for all its available modes is in fact 3.

The latest Nox manual, AFAIK, is 4901-0249-6-EN.

24 minutes ago, Tom_in_CA said:

BUT, there's more to it :  1)  Doesn't allow for the inline  sunray probe 😞  (that was deal-killer on the CTX for me, for instance).   2) I have yet to  see that it outperforms the Exp II in the turf (but am willing to be shown).

I really thought I was gonna miss my Sunray probe too....I was like you...a staunch inline probe or nothing hunter.....but since I can actually detect deeper with my Garrett carrot than I could with my inline probe, I’m not missing the inline probe anymore....angling for what you think is a deep coin/relic only to find that it’s actually deep iron with a stand-alone probe does effectively slow oneself down over a day’s hunt, but not as bad as I thought!  A failing inline probe can be a nuisance also...with the added falsing from a partially broken or exposed shielded wire.

The Nox is very appealing with its minimalist, lightweight design on the outside, but under the hood is a high tech, firmware upgradeable, digitally sophisticated, able to do-it-well in most TH’ing situations machine with new enhancements/niceties to earlier multi-freq machines...

Tom, I didn’t purchase a Nox because I thought I could spank myself when I used my Explorer all these years! 🤣. I purchased it because I wanted a machine that was 2 lbs lighter, with every bit of capability as my old machine, in addition to some newer technologies incorporated by Minelab! I really wanted a new machine, and I’m content (more than I thought I’d be) about my  decision because it has performed above my expectations at many of my sites I’ve hunted with it so far.

28 minutes ago, Tom_in_CA said:

I'd be willing to simply get one *only*  for relicky sites .  Except that there's probably matching ability in several other machines.  Like the Deus, the Racer, etc....   And it's also tempting to make  the plunge for no-other-reason than it's waterproof.   But seeing as how we've  had 3 lame winters in a row (no storm erosion), I rarely hunt the beach  anymore.  Nor is angling for micro-jewelry an interest for me. 

Tom, If I could (you’re pretty set in your ways), I would tell you to purchase a Nox....even if you will use it only at your Relic’y sites...it’s def worth the purchase...you’ve been a Minelab guy for many years now (and a Whites guy for many years before that).  No need to purchase a machine from s different company!
 

Nobody is gonna spank you these days like what happened to you many yeArs ago when you went on a hunt with Ron for a duel between a whites guy and a Minelab guy! 😂. Multi-frequency machines (especially from the same company) will be closely matched against each other!