EL NINO77 Posted December 28, 2024 Share Posted December 28, 2024 6 hours ago, detectorist said: My point really was I expected the Vortex would out perform the AT Series or at least be better than the Apex. It appears to be neither. To be a success in the UK the Vortex on needs to be able unmask to the gold and hammered coins on iron contaminated fields. This it seems to struggle with. It seems I am not the only person who thinks we have purchased prototypes of what may become a decent machine one day. Sorry if I am being over critical on my first post. Regards Brian I'll start like this... The first detector I had in my hands was the Garrett GTI 2500 that my colleagues had.. here in Spain.... The detector detected some nice coins... Now I have it in my detector collection... and my colleague has another GTI 2500.. Clearly development continues... and modern multi-frequency detectors provide a certain advantage.. especially when detecting in difficult terrain.. It is clear that Garrett is going this way and Vortex may have good predispositions to be a good detector... and I believe that Garrett will manage to optimize Vortex... but it needs to be given some time.. Brian ... The problem of detecting small minted coins... is a bit of my hobby... as well as their unmasking in iron.. so I know what you are talking about..The detector needs a certain degree of 2D and 3D separation capabilities... 3 Link to comment https://www.detectorprospector.com/topic/27336-vortex-vx9-should-be-garretts-flagship-but-its-sunk-unless-drastic-improvements-are-made-quickly/page/3/#findComment-287342 Share on other sites More sharing options...
broadfield Posted December 28, 2024 Share Posted December 28, 2024 15 hours ago, Ridge Runner said: For what it’s worth White’s was the first to offer a update to your detector. If you had the Eagle they would update it to a Eagle 11 for 125.00 .They just changed the chip out. The V3i was the same I think 2 1 Link to comment https://www.detectorprospector.com/topic/27336-vortex-vx9-should-be-garretts-flagship-but-its-sunk-unless-drastic-improvements-are-made-quickly/page/3/#findComment-287346 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Steve Herschbach Posted December 28, 2024 Popular Post Share Posted December 28, 2024 2 hours ago, Chase Goldman said: The strategy to initially release only the VX9 was also a mistake IMO. Huge mistake. The feature limited VX5 should have come first, giving Garrett more time to work on the advanced features. They could blame any perceived lack on it being the bottom dollar model. Then VX7 incorporating feedback from VX5, then finally VX9. All VX5 and VX7 owners could buy comfortably knowing they could upgrade to the more expensive versions when the time came, incurring no penalty other than the price difference. It would have really leveraged the unique ability to upgrade. The one big innovation here is at this point in time absent as a selling point. 10 Link to comment https://www.detectorprospector.com/topic/27336-vortex-vx9-should-be-garretts-flagship-but-its-sunk-unless-drastic-improvements-are-made-quickly/page/3/#findComment-287347 Share on other sites More sharing options...
broadfield Posted December 28, 2024 Share Posted December 28, 2024 Garrett are not alone. The Deus II was terrible when first released, it wasn't until v0.71 that it started to shine, v1.0 then completely broke it for most users and needed v1.1 to fix it. Rufus were the same with the Versa, multiple updates to fix problems. Let's not even mention C-scope and the Evo 6000. A good company will listen to feedback and make things right, give them time and I'm sure it will come good. 2 Link to comment https://www.detectorprospector.com/topic/27336-vortex-vx9-should-be-garretts-flagship-but-its-sunk-unless-drastic-improvements-are-made-quickly/page/3/#findComment-287348 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Herschbach Posted December 28, 2024 Share Posted December 28, 2024 1 hour ago, broadfield said: Garrett are not alone. The Deus II was terrible when first released, it wasn't until v0.71 that it started to shine, v1.0 then completely broke it for most users and needed v1.1 to fix it. Rufus were the same with the Versa, multiple updates to fix problems. Let's not even mention C-scope and the Evo 6000. A good company will listen to feedback and make things right, give them time and I'm sure it will come good. The goal is to be better than the ones that are screwing up, not to be one with them. That alone might have set Garrett apart. My business partner and I used to joke about an advertisement we imagined " Alaska Mining & Diving Supply - less crappy than the competition" I substituted crappy here for the word we really used. It's a sad situation for metal detector companies to be competing for who sucks less. 6 1 1 Link to comment https://www.detectorprospector.com/topic/27336-vortex-vx9-should-be-garretts-flagship-but-its-sunk-unless-drastic-improvements-are-made-quickly/page/3/#findComment-287355 Share on other sites More sharing options...
UT Dave Posted December 28, 2024 Share Posted December 28, 2024 1 hour ago, Steve Herschbach said: Huge mistake. The feature limited VX5 should have come first, giving Garrett more time to work on the advanced features. They could blame any perceived lack on it being the bottom dollar model. Then VX7 incorporating feedback from VX5, then finally VX9. All VX5 and VX7 owners could buy comfortably knowing they could upgrade to the more expensive versions when the time came, incurring no penalty other than the price difference. It would have really leveraged the unique ability to upgrade. The one big innovation here is at this point in time absent as a selling point. Of all the aspects of the Vortex launch one might look at and wonder, this is the one that has puzzled me most. The VDI situation, is also a big surprise. But from my view in the cheap seats, why they apparently rushed to get the "high end" out in front, from a basic software release/marketing approach standpoint, is what has struck me as the hardest to explain to your boss. I'm not in the marketing/business side of anything. Not an engineer either, but in the engineering side of the enterprise. And my software engineers, who work well with the marketing/business folks, but never really trust them, would have been hitting the Andon cord/Big Red Stop Button on shipping this release as the All You Can Eat Buffet version. When the option to ship it as the Sampler version was right there to be utilized. And in our business unit, the engineers would not have been ignored. They tend to look for other jobs when you ignore their good ideas. So they don't get ignored. I can't make any sense of it. - Dave 4 Link to comment https://www.detectorprospector.com/topic/27336-vortex-vx9-should-be-garretts-flagship-but-its-sunk-unless-drastic-improvements-are-made-quickly/page/3/#findComment-287361 Share on other sites More sharing options...
strick Posted December 29, 2024 Share Posted December 29, 2024 3 hours ago, Steve Herschbach said: My business partner and I used to joke about an advertisement we imagined " Alaska Mining & Diving Supply - less crappy than the competition" I substituted crappy here for the word we really used. It's a sad situation for metal detector companies to be competing for who sucks less. One of my favorite business slogans a buddy of mine used to say.. "We may be slow...But we ain't no good either" 😊 Strick 2 Link to comment https://www.detectorprospector.com/topic/27336-vortex-vx9-should-be-garretts-flagship-but-its-sunk-unless-drastic-improvements-are-made-quickly/page/3/#findComment-287369 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RONS DETECTORS MINELAB Posted December 29, 2024 Share Posted December 29, 2024 Marketing and engineering always seem to not talk much together in most businesses. Kinda like a bunch of introverts hanging around with a bunch of extroverts, eventually they end up in two different groups on the opposite sides of the room. Just need to hire a liaison officer like the military uses in incident management to bring peoples ideas together. 3 1 Link to comment https://www.detectorprospector.com/topic/27336-vortex-vx9-should-be-garretts-flagship-but-its-sunk-unless-drastic-improvements-are-made-quickly/page/3/#findComment-287381 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chase Goldman Posted December 29, 2024 Share Posted December 29, 2024 Though it was a bad strategy to lead with the VX9 release, as I posted earlier and as others have agreed, I suspect Garrett’s hand was forced by the pre-orders and also their hubris and willingness to go for the VX9 money grab. Specifically, the tendency for the “early adopters” to go for and pre-order the higher end variant, the VX9, which tends to bring the most value (I.e., capability vs. cost) as it was only $150 to $65 more than the VX5 and VX7, respectively. Garrett had a golden opportunity to control all this on Vortex announcement day because the virtual upgrade platform they created could have allowed them to forcibly steer folks to the VX5/7 units initially by announcing that those units would be the first released with the carrot of the promised online upgrade to the VX9 once those advanced capabilities were ready to be released. This may have resulted in some upfront grumbling but I think Garrett would have had less egg on their face. Although, it is also not clear how much of the current issues with the VX9 could be masked in this manner as a lot of the current issues have to do with basic Multi F TID issues. However, prioritizing an incremental VX5, VX7, VX9 release strategy from the beginning would have allowed them to have engineering focus on getting the Multi F basics right first before moving on to refine the VX9 advanced features such as the multi-level ferrous and iron boundary features. But that’s all water under the bridge at this point and it’s easy for us now to do Monday morning quarterback critiques of how this debacle played out. Oh well. We’ll see where this goes now. Hope Garrett can turn this lemon of a release eventually into lemonade. 2 Link to comment https://www.detectorprospector.com/topic/27336-vortex-vx9-should-be-garretts-flagship-but-its-sunk-unless-drastic-improvements-are-made-quickly/page/3/#findComment-287391 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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