Nokta Legend Needs A UI Makeover

[Bill (S. CA)]

As some of you may know from my infrequent posts, I have a Nokta Legend.

It is an excellent metal detector.

I seldom use it.

When I do, my head hurts.

Watch this video by Loren Lemcke: 

 

He is extremely bright, honest and is an excellent detectorist.  He also has no axe to grind, does not attack companies, and is not a shill.

I have been saying exactly the same things about the Legend with my main pain point being the God awful menu structure and settings.  Like Loren, I must have downloaded the PDF of the manual a hundred times in the field to make a settings change because I just can't remember them all.

Loren suggests a Legend Supreme that would correct this (along with lighter weight components).  I agree.  I suggested the very same thing to Nokta, comparing the Legend to the Minelab Sovereign line.  It started out as the Sovereign, then the XS, the GT, etc.

We all want Nokta to do well.  I hope they watch Loren's video.  

Bill

 

[Ridge Runner]

Bill

I got a Legend in the other room that I’ve had over two years that has never been used but that’s my problem not Nokta . 
When he started off F this and F that in its self for me was a turn off. I’m not saying he’s wrong in what he said but just don’t buy it.

 Be it good bad are indifferent it’s lots of people buying it. For myself I really don’t like it when people rain on my parade and talk about something I love sitting in the other room I’ve never used.

 Chuck 

[Steve Herschbach]

I agree with Loren and Bill. The irony here is I once praised Nokta/Makro for one of the best metal detector interfaces ever designed- the Racer 2. Everything front and center, no hidden functions. Legend is as far from that as you can get.

Loren does some of the best videos around, one of the few people I’d actually watch. His suggestion that they toss the Legend interface out and redesign from the ground up with a new model is an excellent one. He should watch his language as some people do get turned off. I could same the same of myself. I try to be proper online but sometimes my days as a surveyor show up in my real life language. Blue color workers can use colorful language. There is a term in surveying for being really close on a measurement that is not something you want to say in mixed company.  

People buy the Legend because it is an excellent performer at a fabulous price, no argument with that. They generally only find out afterwards about the interface. Especially if people don’t like constructive criticism being aired. Companies can’t improve if we don’t point out when the emperors cloths are missing. Luckily if there was ever a company that listens and acts, it’s Nokta. I’d bet on a Legend Pro someday.

Funny he also mentioned Deus. My last one I was trying to adjust the speaker volume and had no manual at hand. I asked a nearby more experienced Deus owner how to adjust the speaker volume. He also did not know. The machine is designed to be used with headphones and speaker volume is a hidden control. Speaker volume! It takes an unmarked secret button press. Deus missed a big opportunity with Deus 2 not doing a complete UI makeover. Tarsacci also suffers in the UI department. A proper UI does not require an operating manual.

This thread is not a ding on Nokta and the troops need not rally in defense. I was U.S. fanboy number one and in many ways still am. If you read the long review I did in 2014 before anyone here ever heard of this company, you will understand I knew instantly they were special from day one, something proven time and again ever since. They revolutionized bang for the buck in this industry, and set the number one example for how to listen and learn from customers. They like feedback, as long as it leads to a better detector. Bill is a detector  tester from way back and knows this. It’s doing them a favor to point out the Legend UI needs a makeover. I’m pretty sure Nokta already knows they have an issue here but this puts it front and center.

You want to know another irony? It was responding to customer requests for added features that lead to the mess! So in a way not really their fault, people asked for stuff, they added things beyond original scope, but it overwhelmed the original simple design by tacking on things it was never meant to handle. Maybe they should have just logged those suggestions for a future model, but the desire to please in this case backfired a bit.

It can be done with only four or five buttons, via a scrolling menu or a drill down interface, with functions grouped under major headings like Audio, Discrimination, Sensitivity (or Reactivity) etc. Again, the Racer 2 sets a fine example, but there are others. That’s how I’d do it, write down every function grouped by things like that, then rebuild the UI from ground up around the list. And always, in the days of programmable displays and updates, design for change. You can use fully programmable displays now that allow the entire interface to be revamped via a software update, and they are no longer expensive at all. Stuff like this should never be an issue in the future.

Personally, I do not mind the weight as it’s a good, stout detector, and I’ll take that over dainty.

 

[Jeff McClendon]

I am definitely a fan of the Legend. No doubt about it.

Nokta shifted away from language based labeling to mostly icon based labeling with the Simplex and continued that mostly icon based labeling with the Legend, Triple Score, Double Score and Score models.

Whether they did that to "globalize" their detectors so that they weren't totally multi-language dependent for economic reasons or for translation reasons, I don't know. With the Simplex, it actually made that detector a little more complex for those that were used to language based labeling.

Since I had used a lot of Minelab VLFs, I was more used to controls that were mostly icons instead of language specific words on the display and keypad. For instance, I didn't need to use the full Equinox 600/800 screen protector with all of the language specific labeling. I just used the clear part of the protector and cut the black part with the button labels OFF. 

But, even for me, the already icon complex Simplex became a super icon complex Legend as far as the UI. The language base abbreviations took some getting used to also.

My biggest complaint with the Legend and even their earlier language based UI like the Racer 2 displayed above, was that I simply had trouble seeing the character size for the icons and letters. Also, as most of us Legend owners found out, the keypad icons on the Legend were impossible to see without users highlighting them with a permanent light colored marker.

My other big complaint is having to hold down the pinpoint button while pinpointing.

For me personally, the addition of the M3 setting and Beast Mode are useless where I detect along with the labyrinthine process of just freaking finding Beast Mode on the Legend. Like Loren said, it's ridiculous to setup even for a guy like me. I simply won't use it even if it did work in high iron mineralization.

Thankfully, Nokta made Beast Mode easy to use on the Triple Score.

After hundreds of hours of use and after doing so many factory resets due to software updates where I had to reload all of my custom settings, I now have a really good grasp of the UI and it doesn't bother me one bit. For those that are new users or rarely use their Legends, it must be tough especially if they are used to English labeling. 

Like others have mentioned, I have to relearn the Deus and Deus 2 UI every time I use them. There is always some short cut or feature bin placement that I forget about and that two different button press to get into and out of pinpoint mode drives my right thumb crazy.

I too hope there will be a Legend 2, Legend Pro, Legend Plus, Legend Ultra or whatever they choose to call it in the near future. I also hope that the next Legend will have a similar hand grip as the original Legend. That grip at least for me, is so comfy!

[Steve Herschbach]

I’m fine with icons. Though with programmable displays language should be nothing more than a menu option that changes all labels to the selected language. What I do not like, plain and simple, are secret button push combos. Hold this for four seconds to get that. Or hold this plus that to get this.

Detectors could be so much more. How about you give me a detector I hook to my PC, then let me decide what things to place on the screen and where they should be, and how large? With all the buttons programmable to do what I want. Tooltips that pop up on screen to explain settings or functions. This is not rocket science stuff and will happen eventually. Only question for me is will it be before or after I croak? 

[GB_Amateur]

Would a bigger screen (like those on multiple recent Garrett detectors) help here, too?  The ML Equinox was a leap forward in many ways but emulating its screen, as Nokta for one has done, wasn't the direction to follow, IMO.  (Hope I'm not off base here -- my comment is more appropriate for the Comparisons forum.)

I'd like to see a 2d menu screen layout where you use arrow keys to select the 'box' of the feature you want to adjust.  (See pigeonhole analogy below.)  Scrolling through in one dimension, or more accurately one dimension at a time until you find what you are looking for, wastes user time.

[Bill (S. CA)]

Just a quick note to Steve H: thank you for reminding us of the Racer 2 interface.  I had totally forgotten it it was so long ago.  You are 100% right, it is the best interface ever.  

[UT Dave]

46 minutes ago, GB_Amateur said:

Would a bigger screen (like those on multiple recent Garrett detectors) help here, too?  The ML Equinox was a leap forward in many ways but emulating its screen, as Nokta for one has done, wasn't the direction to follow, IMO.  (Hope I'm not off base here -- my comment is more appropriate for the Comparisons forum.)

I'd like to see a 2d menu screen layout where you use arrow keys to select the 'box' of the feature you want to adjust.  (See pigeonhole analogy below.)  Scrolling through in one dimension, or more accurately one dimension at a time until you find what you are looking for, wastes user time.

 

One of my current projects at work is a new mobile app that is more or less going to be required for about 40k of our customers to comply with upcoming new Federal requirements for Federally Related Transactions.

This is the paradigm we are going with.

- Dave

[Steve Herschbach]

2 hours ago, GB_Amateur said:

Would a bigger screen (like those on multiple recent Garrett detectors) help here, too?  The ML Equinox was a leap forward in many ways but emulating its screen, as Nokta for one has done, wasn't the direction to follow, IMO.  (Hope I'm not off base here -- my comment is more appropriate for the Comparisons forum.)

I'd like to see a 2d menu screen layout where you use arrow keys to select the 'box' of the feature you want to adjust.  (See pigeonhole analogy below.)  Scrolling through in one dimension, or more accurately one dimension at a time until you find what you are looking for, wastes user time.

 

Yup, I'm a big fan of drill down menus done right if the number of settings justifies it.