EMField

It sounds like the NEL Sharpshooter coil is working out very well for you rled2005.  That seems to be one of NEL's most popular coils, and most comments are very positive.

Personally I feel that in general NEL coils seem well built, perform well, and are are a good value pricewise.

I currently own two, a 6.5x3.5" Snake for my F75, and a 12x13" Tornado for my G2+.  Very happy with the build quality and performance of both.  I am currently considering getting a 5" round Sharp for my G2+ also.

The only NEL coil with quite a few negative comments seems to be the Hunter.

Well, it took a bit of searching, but I found what Whites suggests is the result of the increased voltage to the coil.  It is contained in the introduction page of the user guide. It says:

"The GM24k features a 54% increase in coil voltage over the GMT.  You will see this in increased sensitivity to small nuggets".

That will be interesting since the current GMT is already easily capable of finding sub-grain bits.  How much smaller can you go?

What would be truly noteworthy, is if the 24k can find those tiny bits at demonstrably greater depths than the GMT.

I'd love to see the GM24k/GMT working side by side at Rye Patch, it would be a fun time.  Unfortunately, it would be over 2000 miles for me to travel one way.

Thanks for the reply Steve.

Most of the changes/upgrades on the 24k are pretty clear, or understood with your hands on explanation, e.g. the different threshold system.

I guess I'm trying to wrap my head around the end result, or performance enhancement caused by the increase in voltage to the coil, if any?   Whites has made a point to prominently mention it as an improvement over the GMT, yet with no explanation of any benefits to be derived.

Perhaps tboykin can chime in?

Informative write-up Steve.  Thank you.

Question.  Is there a noticable difference/enhancement in performance with the extra voltage put to the coil with the 24k, compared to the lesser voltage of ther GMT?  

Always nice to find one out of the oridinary GB. Congrats!

So true about the enjoyment in figuring out the why of what we find!

Back in the day we used to pay a nickel for milk in school now that I think about it.  I guess one of the benefits of people cherry picking silver back in the early days with the onset of the ability to discriminate certain conductors, is that they did leave a lot of old nickels for us.  I enjoy finding the old Buffs and V nickels.  Most of the V's I find are pretty toasted.  I would love to find one in good shape!

13 hours ago, Gold Seeker said:

Back on the OP subject of nickels, there's a good reason that most don't find what he would term "old" nickels, Shield nickels were only minted for 17 years (1866-1883), Liberty nickels were minted for 30 years (1883-1913), Buffalo nickels were minted for 25 years (1913-1938), on the other hand Jefferson nickels have been minted for 80 years and still counting (1938-present), more than the other 3 mintings combined, and of course it's easier to find a more or less recently lost nickel than any of the others that were most likely losted up to 80 or more years ago.

I don't know if you've experienced this but, for me, some locations tend to give up certain types of old nickels, even though the location is of a similar age to other search sites.

There are a couple of old school sites that the majority of nickels I find are Buffs, while a couple park locations are generous with an occasional V nickel.   The schools are now closed and all the more modern stuff has been vacuumed up over the yrs., so I guess most of the remaining nickels are the older Buffs as they tend to be deeper?

1 hour ago, Alluminati said:

The very first line the OP posted was about a gold thread was it not?

Do you not see the correlation between skipping prime gold numbers in lieu low hanging high conductors? Isn't the reason most dig silver is because it is easier? Think about it, you dinn't even have zinc pennies until 1983.

I've already explained why there is a surplus of low conductors, that is exactly what the OP is asking for. I at least gave the courtesy to talk about the right metal. You're lack of understanding is why you perceive this is being off track.

YES, the OP's first line referenced a thread by Happa 54 "Chasing Nickels Signals I End Up With Gold".

YES, I fully understand the TID range of gold, in all it's forms, and what can happen if someone ignores  a signal in possible gold TID range. 

YES, many dig silver because it falls in an easy high conductive range, MUCH more easily identified than any type of gold. (see my first post in this thread where i referenced "cherry picking")

I've been doing this a pretty long time.  My first detecting was done with a Jetco BFO around 1969-70.  I got back into detecting about 10 yrs ago.  Honestly, I believe there is very little you could teach me. I fully understand the large conductive range gold items fall within.  My 1/2 Eagle $5 gold coin fell right at 54/55 on my F75 TID, right at the aluminum pull tab mark. Most would have passed on it.  I have found plenty of gold rings, bracelets, pendants etc., that fall in a huge range of TID's.

I believe Steve made a VERY GOOD post above dealing with all that.

This is the "metal Detecting For Coins & Relics Forum".  The OP said ..."it got me wondering if previous searchers who took most of the old coins were skipping nickels.  Thoughts?  That is the context I took his question. As it relates to coin hunting NOT gold jewelry.

Excellent/useful reminder Steve!

Just now, Alluminati said:

?

He also mentioned dimes.   I took that as a score one for Tesoro kind of thing cuz it found nickels behind the Minelab guys.

My point is that the OP made no association between nickels and gold, other than to reference a different thread.  The nickel thing  in his post is of a totally different context than when you said "I just want to break this association people have with 5-cent coins and gold".  He was looking at nickels from a coinshooting perspective.

I'll  end it here, as I think the original subject of nickels has gotten off track.

CHEERS

6 minutes ago, Alluminati said:

Yes you missed it.

If you read the post directly before mine it may help add some context for you.

 

Still no association between gold and nickels in his post either?  

His post was about his Tesoro finding stuff including a gold bead earring, and a bunch of nickels, behind some guys with minelabs.

I assumed you were addressing the OP's post about nickels since you didn't quote him.  MY mistake.  None of them find it all, even Minelabs!

7 hours ago, Alluminati said:

Can I just clarify that you guys are talking about COPPER coins that the Minelabs hit just fine? 12-14 TID.

Any machine will bang an American nickle, it doesn't make it a gold hound. Minelabs were very low frequency back then which may be why they didn't hit the earring, every machine and setting is a set of chosen compromises. Sure you might have missed some chains, but you will probably find 20-40 deep gold rings in a summer without digging much small foil.

A  nickle machine is one like the Deus in 18kHz and I guess for that reason, the Equinox and other machines on a similar frequency. (Gold alloy response peaks around 18kHz)

Despite being a higher conductivity then iron, nickle is still ferromagnetic. Metal detectors are designed to reject nickle (ferrous) phase shifts while using disc.

So the challenge to finding a real nickle coin is 2-pronged. You need the Freq and a way to decipher ferrous from this pseudo ferrous responses. Gold is way easier to recognize then nickle. Nickle takes a bit of time to recognize the jumpy erratic responses they give.

I just want to break this association people have with 5-cent coins and gold. Sure you can find a gold ring at 12, but there is gold from 1 to 25 TID.

Deep gold sounds similar to deep nickle (Nickle gets more erratic the shallower it is, deep nickle can be almost pleasant at times.), just as small deep square nails are similar to small deep silver responses.

Having a 18kHz machine typically expands the TID range just above iron giving more resolution to work in that range. This gives more accuracy to the ferrous/nonferrous decisions we have to make when presented with very low conductors.

I think if you read the OP's original post, his thoughts were not about a detector that does well on nickels being a "gold hound".

My take was that he was more curious as a coin hunter why so many nickels were left behind by coinshooters back in the day.  Also how it may relate to the use of discrimination.  No mention of gold was made in his original post at all.

I always thought my Minelab CTX was a very solid performer on nickels.  My first time out with my 19KHz G2+  in a location I had gone over quite well with my CTX, I found four nickels in a short time.  I also found 2 nickels within 30ft of the back door of my house, which I had also scoured with my CTX.  Interpret what you will from that.  I was quite surprised!

As to the association between nickels and gold which the OP doesn't necessarily make in this thread.  I think it's generally at that point on the conductive scale where gold jewelry STARTS to appear in it's wide range within the conductive TID scale.  Some micro jewelry, and obviously small nuggets appear in the foil range. So, if people are hunting gold jewlery, the nickel area would be a TID starting point, and a reasonable association as such IMO.  I think you're reading more into the OP's original post than there was, or perhaps I missed it?

phrunt makes a good point about the warranty.

The standard warranty on the G2+ is five years from date of purchase to the original owner.  One of the better warranties among the different brands.  Warranty does not transfer, within the five yr period if sold.

When buying used, even on a machine only a couple months old, you're making a gamble that the money saved buying used will stay in your pocket, and not spent on repairs.

4 hours ago, Leighton said:

Ok so I’m trying to work a deal on a g2+ but I wanted to know if there was any difference from the g2+ to the g2+Ltd. is it just that Camo color scheme? I think that’s what I once read but I can’t remember or find that article.

Hello Leighton,

Only difference is cosmetic, the electronics/features are the same in all G2+ color options.

Don't know if you're dealing for new or used?  They're going for $449 new direct from Teknetics. 

1 hour ago, phrunt said:

That's what I was indicating a Gold Bug 2 version 2 should have, nobody would take away the option to manually ground balance, but it sure is nice to have Auto when you want it, especially in very variable ground.  There is always room for improvement on any detector which is why I was saying it's nuts they haven't come out with an improved version after all these years.  Fisher added the Ground Grab feature on the Gold Bug Pro, I like it, takes seconds to do but they left the manual controls to manually adjust the ground balance.  I don't think the GBP was meant to be the replacement for the GB2, it was just more stable in a lot of ground with its lower frequency and was capable of more types of detecting so it was there to open up a bigger market than the GB2 had.  I will admit the more I use it the more I like it.  It appears to have a really accurate VDI number system too in discriminate mode.

I understand where you're coming from.  Auto tracking systems can have their advantages for inexperienced operators, or, as you said in"variable ground".  They also had disadvantages, at least in some of the earlier systems.

Around the late 1990's, well known detector designer Dave Johnson designed the Lobo Super Trac for Tesoro, or Lobo ST as it's most widely known.  It had a very good ground tracking/balance system which was great for beginners. It had a shortcoming though. The tracking system could not be locked to the current ground phase when a target was found.  As the user would wiggle the coil back and forth to further analyze the signal, the GB system continued tracking.  At times it could actually track out (eliminate) the target signal as bad ground.  It could/can be mitigated by making wider sweeps of the coil to let the tracking system read the surrounding soil matrix and adjust to that and not read the target as bad ground.

Fast forward a year or two.  Mr. Johnson, now working for Whites Electronics was in the process of designing two widely popular models for them, the GMT and MXT.  He obviously was aware of the shortcomings of the Lobo ST tracking system.  He made one huge addition to the whites models, the ability to lock the current ground phase in the tracking system when the user had a potential target.  Once locked, the operator can move the coil back and forth to analyze the target with no worry of it being "tracked out" as bad ground.  He also added the option to manually ground balance, and the very nice Ground Grab system which at the push of a button adjusts the ground phase of the machine to the ground matrix under the coil, as the computer constantly monitors the ground phase conditions.  A great bunch of options at the time!

Mr. Johnson has gotten away from auto ground tracking/adjusting systems for the most part at First Texas now.  Most of their current machines employ the "Ground Grab" system, or the Ground Grab, plus a manual option most are familiar with.

The newer machines of most other brands employ a variety of the GB options including tracking which is quite common now.  They seem to work well.  I still have a fondness for the GMT's options which are now nearly two decades old.

As to the GB2.  It's another one of Dave Johnson's excellent designs, and an all-time classic.  I don't think I'd change a thing with that one!

Sorry for the long winded post.

18 hours ago, auminesweeper said:

Thanks,  I came to thinking/wishing they would sort out the ground issues when I was testing my coils and someone posted about how far their machine could air test a coke can, Well the coke cans over here are smaller at 330mils and when I did his test I Dare not publish my results because it would of started a war, even more so when I used my favourite coil, But I thought if I could get that depth then I would need a JCB and leave the pick at home, As it is I have a coil that can see Cans at up to 3 feet and maybe a bit more in the ground but it Air Tests at ridiculous distances, I have always thought if I loose 70% of that distance in the ground then I am still going to be digging 2 or 3 feet holes on a coke can,  Perish the thought ?.

Good ground balancing is one thing and the MXT has the best GB ever made but that is only a small part of the story because as we know the ground minerals can just destroy a detectors depth, but regardless of the GB system until a detector can wipe out those mineral then we are not going to see any improvements in depth, Because they have the same effect as Headlights in the Fog and when it gets too bad we have to turn down the gain so it can see, A bit like switching from High beam to low beam in the fog,

We have detectors with multi frequencies that can ID a coin in a bucket of Nails with maga sweep speed and even faster separation speeds yet we still don't have a VLF that can see through the Mineral Soup that we face on a daily bases. We have everything but the Ability to see whats down there.

I sure agree with you on the GB system on the MXT auminesweeper! 

I've got the GMT, same system.  The ability to run in autotrack, yet lock it at any time, manually GB if you choose, or do an auto Ground Grab at the press of a button is an incredible system!   That system on the MXT/GMT has been around for going on two decades, but, it's timeless, and the best of all worlds ground balance wise!

At only 1/2 the price of a NOX 800, the G2+ would definitely get you gold, plus general use capability.

You said, you are in the hunt for gold. I'm assuming you mean primarily nugget hunting?

If nugget hunting is your primary use/goal, the 20 & 40 KHZ prospecting ability of the NOX 800 would serve you VERY well.  If buying used to save $$ just be careful of where and from whom you purchase a used machine.

As to what you can afford and when, it's always advisable to consider/maintain domestic tranquility when making those decisions.?

Nice Rr!!

I put a 12"x13" NEL Tornado on my G2+ and love it.  It still retains very good sensitivity to tiny targets, yet gives really good coverage when you need it.

I'm sure you'll be liking that Ultimate 13.

16 minutes ago, GB_Amateur said:

Now I have a new thought to contemplate:  if one is wanting to capitalize on nickel cherry picking, is there an obvious detector that hits hard on nickels and separates their TID's from nearby junk targets?  If not an obvious choice, please name some candidates.

I admit this might be a lost cause, given that a lot of cupro-nickel alloyed coins suffer badly from being in the ground a long time.  However, three of my 'old' coin finds this year include two Warnicks and a (unfortunately dateless) Buffalo nickel, all of which are in otherwise excellent condition considering how long they've been in the ground.

I would think the GB/GB pro/GB DP, F19, or G2/G2+ would all be good candidates.  At 19KHz they all hit hard on low conductors like nickels.  I was amazed how many I found in locations that I had thought were pretty picked over.

Thanks for the welcome phrunt!

I get a kick out of your and kiwijw's stories and adventures.

The G2 is definately a decent nugget and all around machine.

There's so many good nugget machines available right now.  If someone is looking for a detector with gold nugget ability, they should surley put some serious thought into just what they want.

My GMT found incredibly tiny pieces when I went nugget hunting.  Not living near gold hunting areas it just sits, because it's high 48KHz frequency, and only very basic iron ID capability just isn't of any use for general detecting.  The G2+ is great for all around detecting.

I think a lot, if not most, of the early detectorists were cherry picking only silver.

Back as a kid with my Father, using only BFO machines with no discriminator, silver was usually the prize, as at that time it had been out of circulation for a while.  When I got back into detecting about 10 yrs ago, a lot of the longtime detectorists I met had said they did exactly that.  When the discrimination circuits were incorporated in detectors, it made cherry picking high conductive silver very easy.

Hello Leighton,

I'm a new member too.

The latest of my metal detectors happens to be a Tek G2+. 

I have a Whites GMT that I bought for a trip out west detecting nuggets, along with several other general purpose detectors.  Since Michigan isn't a state for nugget shooting,  my GMT pretty much goes unused, but I still hope for another trip or two out west to give nugget hunting another go.

That's why I got my G2+.  I figured since the GMT as great a nugget hunting detector as it, doesn't do me much good in Michigan, I'd probably sell it, and get a duel purpose detector that's useful in Michigan and for nugget hunting out west.  That's when the G2+ came into my posession.

It's a great multi-use machine, with definite gold capabilities, as has been said by many others.

Greetings to all.

New member here from Michigan.

I've been detecting for about the last 10 yrs.  I did my very first detecting as a kid with my father many yrs ago, 1969-70 ish with an old BFO machine.  Lots of silver in those days!

I wish Michigan was a state where nugget hunting was a possibility!  I went out west and hunted tailings on Patented land as a guest, through a friend, and had a great time. I even bought a used GMT for the trip, with the intent of future trips west.  A couple Grandchildren later, and those intended nugget hunting trips may now be more of a hope than reality?

I've been popping in for the last couple yrs and enjoyed reading about members nugget hunting adventures, and general information on gold detecting.  I figured it was time to join Steve's Forums.