BigSkyGuy

42 minutes ago, steveg said:

Let's say you have that "nail/coin" target I mentioned above.  With open screen, and with appropriate limits set, you should hear a mix of non-ferrous and ferrous tones, let's say 50/50 mix.  So, when you discriminate out the iron ID portion (and thus the ferrous tones dissapear), then you SHOULD hear the 50% non-ferrous tones, but since you are only hearing "50%" of the conglomerated target, you are missing the other 50%, and thus is sounds "choppy."

My response above was with regard to this part of Steveg's post. I am still a rookie on naviagating this site!

Could this be due to use of "open gate" on the MC vs "closed gate" on the Equinox? Tom mentions polyphonic audio as a new feature of the MC, which appears to mean that more than one tone can be heard at once. By silencing one tone you enhance the other. On the nox you hear bits and pieces of each tone at different times rather than a blending of tones. Not sure how the target trace works though. It sounds like it may be presenting the audio in a visual form rather than presenting independent information, at least in part.

The concentric coil is also much less sensitive to flat iron (bottle caps, can bits, etc) which can be discriminated out at relatively low disc levels.

The Manticore has lots of adjustability and lots of power. Getting the settings right for a given site is more important than for the Equinox and many other detectors. However, I think once people learn the detector some of these "issues" will go away and it will prove its worth. It also appears as though the settings that work well in mild ground do not work in hot ground. Based on the information that is coming in, it appears as though iron tones (horeshoe on) are of benefit in mild ground but in hot ground the mineralization reports as iron grunts, drowning out the good signals. The 2D screen appears to be a benefit for some but not others. One person's brain processes information differently than another, so some people prefer visual information and others sound. I think this is part of the issue. I have heard that an update is coming to warn users that sensitivity of 25 or above is in the red zone where instability and mineral blow back is a potential issue. As far as the falsing issues that some have had it may be due to ground conditions, running the machine too hot for the conditions, using a less than optimal mode, not circling the target, or not recognizing audio/visual clues. When the ground is hot and/or loaded with nails, getting the settings right for the site is more important than for clean mild ground. People are starting to zero in on the best settings for their sites, but it is definitely not one size fits all. The Manticore appears to me to be for those who are comfortable with experimenting with different settings. I think a beginner might have some struggles with this machine.

Some hunters in the UK have reported that performance in plowed fields is not as good as they expected. It is too early to tell if this can be fixed with the proper settings or if this will be part of a firmware update.

As far as fine gold sensitivity (<0.03 g), it may be improved once the small coil is released. All indications are that larger gold, such as stud earrings and fine gold chains is excellent, better than the Equinox. Still lots of unknowns, so be cautious when drawing conclusions this soon after the release.

How would one go about creaming a possum?

17 hours ago, Chase Goldman said:

Actually, I have heard just the opposite.  Namely, generally Lower detector operating frequencies perform better in mineralized soil.  Similar to reactivity/recovery speed, however, there probably is a sweet spot operating frequency range that works best.

I think the performance of high frequency vs low frequency detectors in mineralized soil depends on the specific type of mineralization present. Some iron minerals, such as maghemite and fine grained magnetite, have what is called frequency-dependent magnetic suspeptibility. Which means the magnetic susceptibility depends on the frequency of the transmitted signal. The information that I have seen seems to indicate that the higher the frequency the lower the ground response, at least for the few soils tested. Minerals that are not frequency dependant tend to produce less ground response at lower frequencies for a given magnetic susceptibility. My ground is mostly moderately mineralized by magnetite-related mineralization. I had an 8kHz Blisstool that did not operate in my soil very well at all compared to my 16kHz Vista X, or Equinox. I get at least one more inch of depth with these detectors compared to the Blisstool. The Blisstool is a very deep machine in some ground. In mild Ohio soil I found a tiny 1 Pfenning coin at 10-inches with the Blisstool. Not saying this will be true for everyone, but higher frequncy detectors work better in my soil and maybe Jeff's as well.

Steve,

I have no doubt that you will find a creative and well designed way to mount your battery. Your detector shafts are top notch.

Kent

I have my Maticore set up so that the right user definable soft key is set as the User Profile. No need to have quick access to the accept/reject key (the default for the right key). However, on the Equinox this cannot be done and I completely agree with Steve that it is useless to have in such an awkard position. I never used this on my 800. Perhaps a software upgrade could swith the accept/reject and user profile keys on the Equinox 900?

That was my initial thought phrunt. When sensitivity is too low deep targets id as iron. Some of your testing has shown that ID is less accurate at high sensitivity. There may very well be a sweet spot sensitivity setting that works the best.

Another thing to consider is coil size. The D2 with 9" coil (I think I have this right Daniel) sees less ground than the MC with 11" coil. Should be interesting to see if the MC with 6x8" coil works any better in hot dirt.

11 hours ago, Daniel Tn said:

Yeah, but I was confused about you saying a Sens of 29.  I never had it that high.  I started out with it at 25.  This place is similar to how it is in Culpeper, VA in that the fields are extremely mineralized but the woods are not as bad.  In the woods I could run 22-25 sensitivity. In the field, I was getting too much mineral blow back so I dropped it into the teens to get rid of that.  

25 it is. You might want to try teens sensitivity in the woods even though you can go up to 25. phrunt had an excellent post regarding lowering sensitivity to improve target IDs, which is worth a look if you have not seen it. Thanks for sharing your results. Excellent post!

Daniel,

Getting back to MC vs D2. Not sure if you saw my earlier post, but did you try lowering the sensitivity on the MC? Thank you!

Daniel,

I know this may seem counter-intuitive, but have you tried lowering the sensitivity on the MC? 29 may be too high for hot dirt. Back in the day, I used to use an old White's when visiting my cousins in Winchester VA. In that red dirt, lowering the sensitivity was key to getting good results. Just a thought.

I have drilled through carbon fiber tubing once. I used a titanium bit, starting with a small size bit and working my way up, being carful no to push too hard. Seemed to work, but like Steve I do not choose to do it very often.

Good to know!

I am not saying everyone needs to rig up a power bank. I justed posted my solution for those who are interested. Thought it might save someone some time or spark some other ideas on how to do it.

I thought I would share my setup in case anyone else is interested in extending the battery life of the Manticore. If all goes well, I may be able to double the battery life. I have added a 10400 mAh power bank using a bicycle phone mount. The power bank that I selected is the size of a cell phone and works perfectly. I purchased the battery and mount on Amazon.

Bicycle Mount

Power Bank

I will not be able to try in the field for a couple of months, but it swings nicely. I hardy notice the weight because it is under my arm. It is very easy to put on and take off quickly and the whole setup cost only $30.

I have noticed on the Tarsacci that the battery lasts longer on 18 kHz than 9 kHz, for whatever reason. I can only guess that the MC AT-HC has a lower frequency weighting than other modes or say Park 1 on the 800. Until someone puts a MC on a spectrum analyzer we will not know for sure. Similar information for the Nox 800 showed that all modes transmitted the same frequencies but the different modes processed the return signals differently.

https://www.detectorprospector.com/forums/topic/5451-multi-iq-spectrum-test/#comment-56908

Just a guess, but maybe MC is actually transmitting different frequencies in different modes. Maybe someone with more experience in this area will chime in, but this is my theory.

Part of a fancy cigarette lighter?

I think the brass item is one of those mystery items. Hopefully someone here will recognize it.

Targets used.

These were measured using All Terrain - General with the default settings. Some of the coins were dug and some were not (no corrosion). This may account for some of the differences. The Indian heads, clad and US silver coins were all dug. The 2-cent piece was undug. The clad was all dug as were the wheat cents. The 1919-S was worn and had the "wood grain toning" that is often seen on the San Francisco mint cents from the teens. The gold coin and nickel 3C VDIs were from Tom D's measurements.

Nice hunt! Looks like you got a broken tent rope tensioner to the right of the oil lamp and below the left harmonica reed. Sometimes you can get a patent date from the oil lamp adjustment wheel. I am envious that you can hunt this time of year. Hard to believe that such big pieces of brass were still in the ground. Thanks for posting.

Here is one that I put together for Manticore. Should be similar for 700/900.

The difference between the 700 and the 900 is mainly in adjustability. The sensitivity, iron bias, and recovery speed, all have a greater range and finer settings than the 700. However, in my ground I have never been able to max out the 800 sensitivity, so I am not concerned that the 700 sensitivity only goes to 25 (vs 28 on the 900). The iron bias I usually use at either 0, or 6 if bottle caps are a problem. Recovery speed on the 800 I never crank up to 7 or 8, so it does not matter that the 700 recovery only goes from 0-3 vs 0-8 on the 900. Note that recovery of 3 on the 700 equals 6 on the 900. Also, with the dP tones and Field 2 mode, the 700 may be an effective nugget machine, even without the Gold modes. However I have not tested this in the field yet (waiting for Spring). The 700 does not have single 20kHz and 40kHz frequencies, but I rarely use single frequencies unless in a high EMI area and 15kHz seems to do the trick. Anyway, I do not see a huge difference between the 700 and the 900. I bought the 700 instead of the Legend because I already have several accessory coils and waterproof phones and I did not want to learn a new platform. So I think either the 700 or the Legend would be excellent choices.