cudamark

4 hours ago, Steve Herschbach said:

When you look at the fully submersible Xterra Pro at $269 then even $299 would be a stretch for a new F19 variant. I honestly don’t see how Fisher or Garrett can sell hardly anything at current prices when caught in the crossfire between Nokta and Minelab. It has to be brand name loyalty or simply not knowing to lay out $759 for a new AT Max, to pick just one of many examples.

Yup, why anyone would buy an AT-anything over a modern Minelab or NoMak machine makes me shake my head.

I still have a Eagle 2 SL 90 like the one on that catalog cover. What a great machine that was when it came out. It's still a great machine for land hunting if the targets are 8" or shallower. It was pretty worthless at a salt water beach in the wet sand or water though. The 6000 DI Pro machine was no slouch either. IMO the best of the analog all-around machines.

I agree with those who love the 12 X 15  Nox coil. In my hunting experience, it's the best coil I've ever used and I rarely take it off. When looking for tiny gold in polluted sites, sure, I go with a smaller coil, but, even in the ocean, I use the big one. I also have the 15" round Coiltek coil. It's deeper by a couple of inches, is heavier, and doesn't pin point as well, but, if you need max depth, it's the one to go to.

P.T.Barnum was right.......

Yeah, I fell for that test too. Sure, you can reproduce it, but, that's not a real world test. Bury those targets deep in wet salt water sand with a bobby pin or RUSTY iron at various depths around the target. Add some black sand to the mix and salt water rushing over the coil. Then see what kind of signal you get. At my beaches, you end up digging everything as the discrimination just isn't reliable.

Some interesting conditions to mull over. I was always curious (and aware) about the different ground mineralization we encounter, and ways of counteracting it. I've also been curious as to how the ground Ph affects our detectors. In a couple of areas I hunt, I don't think it is necessarily mineralized with metals, but, it is definitely alkali. Not sure what is causing it and I haven't had a soil sample analyzed to test the Ph, but, I get a lot less depth there regardless of detecting mode and VLF machine used. I haven't detected an area determined to being acidic, but, would be curious as the what reaction the detector would show with that condition. I would imagine that Ph along with moisture will have an effect on conductivity, but, I'm fairly ignorant in that technical aspect other than the fact that more moisture generally helps us get more depth in most mild soils.

At a salt water beach, who cares about the TID numbers? If it isn't iron (and sometimes even when it is) you're going to dig it anyway, right? As for pure depth in mild sand, my Excal with a 15" NEL Attack coil is still the deepest compared to Explorer and Etrac with 15" WOT and NEL Attack coils, CTX with 17" coil, Nox 800 and Nox 900 with 12 X 15" coil, and Deus 2 with 9" coil. I have the 13" coil coming for the Deus 2, so, that will be my next comparison. Now, you get in black sand, and the Deus 2 and Nox 800/900 do much better than the Excal. If you want to go deeper and/or dig hairpins at 2', get a PI machine.

As mentioned, your particular Indian cent is in decent condition wear-wise, but, not a rare date being the most produced of all Indian cents. If you want to keep the current patina look, use acetone to gently clean off any surface debris/dirt/goo. I then like to use CoinCare or similar to coat copper coins and help prevent any future corrosion. If you want it to look bright and shiny like a new cent, more severe methods will get you there, but, at the expense of less detail and a somewhat artificial look. Your coin, your choice. Either way, the value won't change much being a coin only worth a buck or two.

The 900 comes with both the 11" and 6" coil standard.

22 hours ago, F350Platinum said:

I just started doing this too, same type of charger that automatically shuts the port off when a full charge is reached. I am charging both the D2 and the WS6 Master, along with two MI-6 pinpointers and two pairs of WSA II headphones. 😀 I also periodically charge the 11" coil but I don't use it much, I keep it in the backpack as a backup. I'm pretty sure this charger will protect the LiPo batteries.

I've successfully got the WS6 Master working in shallow water with a couple bucks worth of coax and some zip ties.

Honestly I'm poorer having invested almost $3k in all this gear, but couldn't be more pleased with the stone cold accuracy of this machine, its resistance to EMI and water intrusion. Y'all have seen my posts, I don't think I have had more than half a handful of "skunk" days with this machine. With Chase's suggestions I've even been successful in Culpeper dirt. Gold, silver, 300+ year old relics and coins, you name it.

I'm neither jaded by the past nor afraid of the future. I like the modularity, the lightweight but insanely durable accessories, and the overall ability to use this rig non-stop for an entire day with no muscle cramps at all. The heaviest configuration is lighter than the lightest Equinox configuration. The lightest configuration is a dream for long distance scouting.

I only had a coil not charged once, and since then check the detector before going out for the day. Turn it on, wait a few seconds, check the battery levels and turn it off. You turn off the detector and the headphones and pinpointer shut down.

What could be better? Seriously? Do I want to struggle with EMI, water intrusion, broken coil ears, and literally no depth advantage?

Nah. I'm on the dark side now.

 

With me and my hunting sites so far, the Equinox 900 has addressed all those issues to a great degree. EMI rejection is better than the 800 (not totally cured I admit and the D2 is better at it), watertight so far, re-enforced coil ears, and better depth IMO. I have the 9" on the D2 and use the 12 X 15" on the 900, so, that's probably a bit of an unfair comparison, but, maybe if I can actually get my hands on a 13" D2 coil (been waiting forever!), I might have comparable fruit to test. I did do a real life field test on depth, signal strength, and target I.D. and this is what I found. Working a vacant lot with fairly soft and mild dirt. Started with the Equinox 800 with the 12X 15" coil and was finding some early wheat cents at 8-10" depths....along with assorted copper rivets and other scrap metals, including a few deep rusty nails that didn't quite sound bad enough to ignore. After gridding the area to the point of not finding anymore targets, I switched to the D2 and re-gridded the same area. Except for one more 8" copper rivet, no other targets. Then switched to the Equinox 900 with the same 12 X 15" coil I used on the 800, and with the same mode and settings (Park 1, 50 tone, horseshoe on, Iron bias F2@0, Recovery speed 4, 22 sensitivity) I had on the 800, except I was able to run  sensitivity up to 24 instead of the 22 I was using on the 800. I found several more copper rivets and a nice Barber dime all at about a foot down. Solid, (albeit weak) no doubt signals. The 800 and D2 are now dust collectors unless I need them for specific tasks or backup. I didn't mention the D2 settings, but, I tried all sorts of combinations after getting a good signal with the 900 and seeing whether the D2 would hear that same signal.....nada.....even with sensitivity up to 98. The 800 didn't hear them either I might add unless I cranked the sensitivity up to the point of making it unstable and unusable to hunt with.

23 hours ago, fogrider said:

I like the idea of the vest. I might give it a try this Spring.

I once had a city worker walk up to me and start bawling me out for digging in a public park. I showed him my hinged-plug digging method and explained how the grass would be fine. He was impressed and wished me a good day.

Some folks will just rage on you no matter what, but most have no problem if you have permission, are polite, and dig properly. Often they hang around to chat, and may be a valuable source of historical information.

Stay safe, and happy hunting.

Agreed, except for the permission part.....at least here in the U.S. The rules for any particular plot of public land are available to view, either at the county courthouse or online. If it's not written down as being forbidden, then it's legal to do. Asking some bureaucrat for permission just adds their personal bias to the equation and pumps up their self importance. Most of these folks don't know what the actual law is anyway, so, why not just look it up for yourself?  We seem to becoming a country where our thinking is that we need governmental approval to do anything on public land. Not true, and in many cases, asking permission can counter-productive. I realize that some areas a permit is needed, along with it's requirements. So be it.....just read and follow the rules. As always, even with or without permission, use discretion in the tools you use, recovery method, and the time/place you use them. The quickest way to lose a permit (and everyone else's) is to have careless methods and habits.

My buddies and I were detecting an old park, when a police car roared up to us and the officer started reading us the riot act about damaging the grass (although he couldn't see any evidence of it, as we were very careful). When we pointed that out to him that we didn't do any damage since he couldn't even tell where we had been, he calmed down a bit and explained that he had to respond to a complaint. We then asked if we could also file a complaint, seeing as he left 6" deep ruts in the grass from the tires on his police car. He grumbled a bit and drove away with a rather sheepish look on his face.

3 hours ago, Steve Herschbach said:

Yeah well this is the Minelab Manticore Forum, not the Comparisons Forum, or the Nokta Forum. People here are supposed to be fan boys, and nobody will score many points coming to the club house and disparaging the fans. I do love the spin that Nokta planned a screwed up release though. If it was Minelab the Legend would have been a disaster and nobody would let them forget it. Nokta it was all planned for the good of all to jump the gun and ship unfinished product. Uh huh, sure. Who is the fan boy now?  Oh wait, that was me, first Nokta Fan Boy, swinging one before most people ever heard of them. I have to admit their ability to communicate with customers leaves Minelab in shame by comparison.

Manticore will not be remotely as bad as the Legend release though, not even close. It is a follow up second generation detector that builds on the errors made with Equinox. So that part is largely over with Equinox, and like Simon I doubt there will be more than one, or at most a couple, updates to the Manticore.

The reality is Minelab has been driving the cutting edge of the technology now for decades, and people lining up to buy their latest product is based on good sense proven by past history, not blind fan boy loyalty. In the gold prospecting world it’s largely been a case of buy Minelab or be left behind now for going on 30 years.

I actually think the 700/900 is the second generation of the Equinox, and that the Mcore is another step beyond that. To me, the 900 is a nicely refined and improved 800 with the Mcore being more of a hybrid with the CTX and Nox tech mixed together.

On 1/26/2023 at 7:27 AM, GB_Amateur said:

Let's take a look at some considerations:

1) No one that I know likes to have to return a detector (or other device) for a fix/repair.

2) Modern detectors, at least most of the higher end ones, now have the capability of software upgrades available to the user, so no physical return is necessary for a software fix/upgrade.

3) Some modern higher end detectors (e.g. XP Deus 1 and 2, Nokta Legend, Minelab Equinox and Manticore) take considerable time to learn for most people, at least for those who want to optimize settings for the highest performance in their sites.

4) There is no requirement to buy ASAP, even for people who know they want the new model.

So, short of hardware issues that require a return, there is zero downside for those who want the detector ASAP, and those who want to wait for things to settle down have that option.  It's a win-win.  It's an easy choice for me.  Rather than waiting months for the manufacturer to find every bug, small or large (and realistically we all know, or should know that is just about impossible today) I can be using and especially learning this detector on-the-fly.  Will I have to 'unlearn' something because of a future change?  Maybe, but I'll still be months ahead on the learning curve.

P.S. Back when I bought my first new vehicle (1977), there was already a piece of advice tossed about -- wait for the second year of a model before purchasing.  So unless 45 years is like yesterday (and it does seem like that as I've aged ), this isn't a new occurrence and it didn't start with consumer electronics.

For the most part, that's true. There are exceptions though. My wife bought the first Toyota Tacoma pickup and it's been the best, most reliable vehicle we've ever owned. 27 years and a quarter million miles later and it's still the original drivetrain, steering, suspension, etc. that's never been out of the truck. It even has the original clutch in it! 

I never take mine off. I drilled a bunch of holes in mine and just flush it out with a hose when needed.

No problems here so far. Well done Steve!

2 hours ago, Steve Herschbach said:

Maybe I'm an old dog, and some new tricks are getting hard for me. I don't like and will never be a fan of wireless coils. Don't waste your breath or time trying to convince me otherwise. I have my reasons, and nothing anyone is going to say will change my mind. I dream of a Deus 2 with a wide selection of dumb plug in coils for $200 each. That require no silly little wire to work underwater - so much for wireless. Every underwater hunter wants a $400 wired wireless coil with a wire that's as thin and delicate as is possible, right? But that's beside the point.

I know for a fact this detector performs. Saw it with my own eyes, and because of that knowledge I got one last year. But I have been using an Equinox for over four years now, and am really tuned in to it's tones, and yes, it's better coil selection. Where are my 10x5 and 15x12 Deus 2 coils? So the truth is I did not give my new Deus 2 the love it deserved, and tended to grab my Equinox instead. This despite my seeing with my own eyes that it can outperform the Equinox. Talk about stuck in a rut. But it shows the power of knowing a detector well, it's settings, it's tones, etc. The Deus 2 was a foreign object and I was just not getting along too well with it. I was even thinking I would sell it, with only a few hours use on it in the last year.

Well, I'm not ready to admit I'm too old to learn new tricks quite yet. So I resolve in 2023 to give my Deus 2 the love and attention it deserves. I even changed my profile to remind myself not to grab that Equinox, nope, it does not exist, don't go there. It's dumb to have a new toy and already have my eye on other new toys when I have not even played much with the new toy I already have! Only bad part is that having made this decision, I have to wait a couple months yet for the ground to thaw.

While I'm waiting, please XP, give me a New Year's wish, and give us an update that makes the 5x10 coil work on my Deus 2. A 15x12 would honestly just screw the ergonomics, but your small elliptical, now that's a coil a lot of us would like to have, and would seal the deal for me on the Deus 2 and XP fan club membership. 

Yeah, and add my nits about not having the big coil yet, the hokey way the remote is mounted, and the fact that the coils will go dead just sitting for a while, and it makes my decision to sell it much easier.

My wrist and forearm ache just thinking about detecting with my old 77. Upgraded decades ago and never felt nostalgic about ever hunting with that dinosaur again! You have one of the very best detectors in the world today with the Nox800. Use it, learn it, enjoy it.....

On 12/15/2022 at 2:59 PM, V3i/MXT Pro said:

I primarily detect on Atlantic beaches in the Eastern US. There is no black sand where I hunt. I use both my Legend and EQ 800 on the wet sand and in the surf up to waist deep. I switch over to my Excal II when I go in further than waist deep.

On my Legend, I can run the sensitivity wide open (in Beach Mode) and it’s very quiet even when the coil sweeps in/out of the saltwater. On my EQ 800, I have to lower the sensitivity (in Beach Mode 1) to achieve stable performance but I still get some noise when the coil sweeps in/out of the saltwater.

They are both great detectors but the Legend is quieter and more stable where I use it.

You should have more stability if you use Beach 2 in the water. My Nox800 is very quiet in the salt water with sensitivity set at 20.....sometimes even 22. That's about what I can get away with in the dry sand here with our degree of black sand. I just got the 900 and took it out for it's maiden voyage yesterday on an inland dry hunt. Very happy with it so far. I love the expanded TID and telescoping shaft (although you need to really tighten the clamps to keep the shaft from rotating with the big coil on it) Pairing of the headphones and restart up procedure is much quicker and easier too. The sensitivity setting now will go to 28, and I was able to hunt in 25, which is rare around here. Not sure if the old 25 is the same as the new 25, or, if the scale has just been recalibrated, but, it seems more sensitive to me. The noise cancel seems slightly better, but, nothing dramatic so far. Bottle cap rejection is enhanced also. It comes with FE4 as default, and it handled bottle caps better than the 800's F2@6, I ran over tons of bottle caps and didn't dig a one, as, none sounded good at all.....even the rusty, totally flat ones. The foil covered ones I'll probably still scoop at the beach, as they still don't sound bad enough to ignore there.  I'll know more about how it handles wet sand and salt water in the next few days if I can get out. Oh, I'm sure many already know this, but, even though the coils interchange between the 600/800 and the 700/900, the shafts do not, so, for quick coil swaps, you'll need to get some extra lower shafts......attn: Steve G!

4 hours ago, phrunt said:

I don't know where people are getting the idea the Nox 900 has better EMI immunity, they in their marketing have not said a thing about the 900 having better EMI handling.

The Manticore has the long press EMI noise cancel feature, and claims in its marketing it is the one with better EMI handling.

BOOSTED EMI IMMUNITY

There may be a storm raging outside but inside MANTICORE it’s quiet and calm. Improved EMI rejection means it’s possible to operate using higher sensitivity whilst isolating target information — even in the most challenging environmental conditions.

The Nox 900 remains unchanged from the 800.

That's why I said "supposedly"

14 hours ago, Steve Herschbach said:

I’ve been incrementally upgrading detectors for 50 years now. Small steps each time that has added up to revolutionary in total. But to answer your question directly, just the expanded target id range alone would be worth the upgrade from 800 to 900 for me. That’s the biggie really, and whether it’s 900 or Manticore I’d be happy either way.

Same here, the expanded I.D. range, better waterproofing, and the fact that I can use all my existing Nox coils, made my decision easy for ordering the 900. The button backlight and supposedly better EMI rejection are nice bonuses.

15 hours ago, midalake said:

If you're a BEACH hunter, then this is an EASY CHOICE. One extra piece of gold alone could make up the $600 dollar difference. This is a no brainer! Wait for that Manticore! 

Except that while I'd be waiting for the Manticore, I'd already have found that gold ring with the 900.....maybe even more so that I can now afford to own both the 900 and the Manticore. By then, one might actually be available to buy.

1 hour ago, PSPR said:

I really would like to see a detector with a circular digger attached to the coil that would take a plug out remove the target and then put the plug back in the hole.  

I'd like one a bit more high tech than that even.....how about a teleporter that would beam that target right out of the ground and into my pouch! No cuts in the ground, muddy knees, sore back, cuts on your fingers......heck, you wouldn't even have to wear gloves! 😄

I find that the Excal with a 15" coil will find dime size and larger targets at a slightly deeper depth than the Nox with the 12 X 15 coil....maybe an inch or two. The Nox will definitely find the tiny targets better than the Excal though. As Joe experienced in Chesapeake Bay, and what I also experience here in SoCal, targets can null out (a good initial signal turns to an iron signal) after the first scoop of overburden. At least here, I attribute that to the black magnetite laden sand and it's encrustation on the target. I actually love it when that happens, as it's usually an older target. I learned early on to just take a couple more scoops to get to the target.