Sirius
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Posts posted by Sirius
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22 minutes ago, Chase Goldman said:
It really makes no financial sense to go through the effort to counterfeit a clad quarter.
What it looks like to me is that the copper core of your quarter has circumferentially receded from the edge of the coin whose diameter is now defined soly by the Cupronickel surface clad layers. This can be explained by the fact that the pure copper is more susceptible to saltwater induced corrosion than the Cu/Ni clad layers, so there is more pure Cu metal lost. The net effect of that is that when you scratch the edge you are deforming the silver-toned Cu/Ni metal into the circumfrential void created from the receding copper core. If you instead took a file and scratched off some of the clad surface layer off the face of the coin, you might then better expose the copper core layer than scratching the edge.
There is very little void, at some points the core is even with the nickel clad on the edge. This is also the one and only example i've seen of a coin with a missing copper core from all the clad quarters i've dug. If there was indeed corrosion then why don't I see the usual suspect of green oxidized copper leeching out of the coin or even the copper itself? I'm not gonna scratch up the coin to go searching for something that's likely not there.
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38 minutes ago, Chase Goldman said:
Not sure what you are asking here (“thin layer of copper”). The two outer clad layers are 75/25 Cu/Ni alloy which has a silver/nickel appearance. There is no thin layer of copper. The core is pure copper.
I was responding to GB. Basically why would I need to scratch deeply when the core is so close to the surface. I took a not so tarnished clad quarter and scratched the rim on a brick and it instantly exposed the copper core, whereas the coin I found yesterday didn't show any signs of having a copper core after scratching the rim on a test surface.
My question now is: could this be a counterfeit quarter?
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22 minutes ago, GB_Amateur said:
2/3 of the thickness is copper core. 1/6 thickness for each of the 75%Cu 25% Ni layer. You'd have to make a very deep scratch to get down to the core.
Since you've decided scratching it is OK, just take a file to the edge, perpendicular to the face, cutting a notch. I would think the original orange color of the core would show up then.
I just scratched it to do an acid test on the rim. But my question is why would it be such a thin layer of copper. These things were made with 75% copper 25% nickel clad in mind, as shown with the other coin of the same year. It's curious so i'm still asking around about what it could be.
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Yeah coin shop said it wasn't anything, I had to check myself and it wasn't silver. Still no copper core though which is very strange. Scratching it produced a silvery core instead of a copper one.
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3 hours ago, schoolofhardNox said:
As Chase has said, it's a clad quarter and is typical of the various damaging stages that a clad coin would go through. Silver will never corrode out on the edge and cause that hollow gap. Color is the least reliable factor in determining coins. Silver usually is black, but I have found gray, milky white, and brown (just like a clad would look). The fact that your quarter lost some "meat" on the edge says it's clad to me as well
Thats the thing though, the nickel clad has been in the water enough to cause it to turn red but there's no copper leeching? I'll need to find a comparable quarter and show the difference.
I guess i'll let the coin shop settle it. I'm probably coping with the fact that it's likely a regular old clad quarter -
3 hours ago, Badger-NH said:
Keep detecting. When you find a silver one, compare it to the clad coins you've found so far.
I have found silver coins. Comparing it with the coin I found yesterday it kinda looks the same. Coin I found yesterday looks less grey black though. SchoolofhardNox is right though it's tough to compare via color as corroded silver can be many colors.
Top coin standing liberty
Bottom coin the quarter I found yesterday
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59 minutes ago, Chase Goldman said:
My assessment: 1966 clad, 1967 clad, 1967 clad
But don’t take my word for it. Showing us edge pics of probable clad coins is not really going to be definitive. Have you looked at what the copper clad cores look like on non-corroded pocket change? It’s pretty highly variable. If you factor in the bi-metallic galvanic effects and other environmental elements that cause corrosion, on clad, the visual results are all over the map. So, if you still really think you have something there, you can:
1) Take to a local coin dealer and have them assess it for free.
2) Purchase a silver acid test kit.
2) Send it off to be assessed and professionally graded (PCGS, etc).
3) Run it through a Coinstar machine. If it gets rejected, it could be silver…
4) Brush the edge as suggested earlier to expose the copper core.
5) Keep it a mystery, create a semi-fictional backstory of its origin and impress your friends and family with the tale of the “rare” 1967 Quarter variant you discovered.
yeah going to a coin shop tomorrow. Also all 1967 quarters I see on google images show the same thing nickel clad with a copper core that is clearly visible with a orange color. This is also seen on the salt water ruined 1967 quarter that I have as well. Something like this, so i'm just not sure about the one I found today as the rim is blackened instead of green/pink.
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25 minutes ago, Chase Goldman said:
Silver coins are solid, homogeneous metal and don't have a core. That coin edge certainly looks like a core is there which is where the term clad comes from. Plus it does not look like silver corrosion but typical of clad which is highly variable because of its bi-metallic galvanic properties. There is a possibility of an issue with the metallic composition of the clad planchet resulting in an error, but unlikely its silver.
One last comparison though. I fished out a 1967 quarter from my clad coin stack and a 1966 one. Both are noticeably different from the one I found today with around the same amount of wear. In order from top to bottom 1966 clad, 1967 clad, 1967 something.
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1 minute ago, Chase Goldman said:
Silver coins are solid, homogeneous metal and don't have a core. That coin edge certainly looks like a core is there which is where the term clad comes from. Plus it does not look like silver corrosion. There is a possibility of an issue with the metallic composition of the clad planchet resulting in an error, but unlikely its silver.
It's certainly a strange coin nonetheless, thanks for the input.
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4 minutes ago, Chase Goldman said:
Which is which in the picture above? I am seeing hints of copper core on both coins' edges. Nothing really unusual that I see from the first picture. Looks like clad to me.
top is copper clad and what I normally find, bottom is what I found today. The core also kinda has a chunk taken out of it, and underneath is still black patina.
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Not sure I should be taking a wire brush to it. Also here's a comparison between the normal stuff I find and the coin I found today.
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I was out and about today detecting my usual spots and I found this strange quarter. Normally when I find coins, I check the rim and give it a good scratch with my nail to expose the copper. This time I found a 1967 quarter that didn't have any of the usual wear and tear found in clad, and it was dark purple sandwiched within, much like the silver coins I've found except this coin has a visible distinguishing line between the clad faces and the inner metal due to beach exposure . Scratching it with my nail did not expose any copper either. Do silver quarters even exist beyond 1964 and if so are they valuable?
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55 minutes ago, D&P-OR said:
Ok, ok---don't keep us in suspense!----What are these "incredible finds" you have been making with it??----Pics would be nice to!
Incredible is subjective. I love silver so it's mostly silver! Some gold if i'm lucky! I'm up like almost 30 rings for the year currently at 29. mostly silver some junkers and like 1 gold ring.
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On 4/24/2023 at 11:43 AM, Bill (S. CA) said:
Yesterday I decided to take my Legend to the beach for a morning low tide hunt. I had not had the opportunity to do this due to work and pet issues for a good month so my Legend had changed a bit. Specifically I was now running the new software V 1.11 and also had replaced the upper shaft, arm cuff and coil with the upgrades now available from Nokta Makro.
After hunting for a good three hours (more on that in a bit) and heading back to the car, something struck me. The Legend, in its new configuration, is a radically different metal detector than the version that was released back in December 2021/January 2022. I field tested that metal detector for Western and Eastern Treasures Magazine for their October 2022 issue. The Legend at that time was an excellent metal detector.
In fact, I think it would be fair to say that Nokta Makro could easily have locked the early version of The Legend and then later this year come out with a new, updated version. I thought back to so many manufacturers over the years who would take a model of detector, sell it a year or two, then make a few changes to it and add on "+," "II," the word "pro," etc.
But Nokta Makro chose not do to do this which is, I think, remarkable. The Legend is faster, has more options, and is noticeably lighter than it was a year ago.
Forgive my soapboxing here, I'm not an advocate for any manufacturer, I just use what works for me. But I thought this aspect of The Legend has been overlooked and deserved to be mentioned. The Legend is not a year old detector. If you have one and update it you have essentially a brand new model Legend. Further, if you are contemplating a Legend, do not assume it is a year old design. It is not.
Now to the beach hunt. The new carbon fiber shaft, lighter arm cuff and LG30 coil make The Legend noticeably lighter and the balance is fine as always. I met up with a buddy who was using a new model detector with a harness and I asked him to check out the weight of my Legend. He did and was genuinely astonished, commenting that it didn't even weigh a pound. Yeah, I know it weighs more that that but you get the idea.
That's the weight part of the new Legend. As to hunting at the beach, I was able to hunt the wet sand at full sensitivity (30) with only minor chirping. And I did not have to use the beach stability to calm the detector down. Like in my field test last year, The Legend provided excellent depth on coins and low conductors. However there was one noticeable change. Another buddy had found a very small junk chain with a different brand detector and asked me to try to read it with my Legend. At the time I was running the sensitivity at 28 and when I swept the coil over the chain I got only a small chirp. Frankly, I would have walked right over it. I decided to bump the sensitivity up to 30 and try again. To my surprise, the chain hit hard, even when I raised the coil a couple of inches. From that point on I ran The Legend at 30. For those of you who are beach hunting with The Legend, I would recommend trying to run at 30 if you can. I did not expect this much of a performance increase going from 28 to 30 and it may impact your ability to find fine chains.
For the day I had a pouch full of clad, a light suntan and a smile on face. The Legend and I will be back out there again soon.
Alright alright I might have to increase the sensitivity on my Legend. Been keeping it at 26-27 and it's been doing alright for me. No chains yet though, so hopefully this change will make a difference!
The legend has been quite an amazing beginners first detector for me. It's simple enough to learn and operate and the finds have been incredible! It's an adventure every time I'm out there detecting, as you never know what you might find! -
1 minute ago, Bill (S. CA) said:
That and the fact that there are so many more guys hunting and everyone has multi-frequency detectors. Where years ago we used to be able to always pick up some coins here and there that has really changed. The lowest tech I ever see at the beach anymore is an Equinox. Deus II's have really taken over out here. I've seen one PI in the last two years, same guy using an old White's Surfmaster and he swears it will beat anything. Funny thing is he never has anything to show but who knows, right? I'd rather be lucky than good when it comes to beach hunting!
You'd also have to keep your hunting locations secret until it gives up all of it's treasures! Some places are less hunted than others and there's probably a number of reasons why, but ultimately it all depends on where the ocean starts depositing stuff. Even if a cut exists, it never guarantees finds from my experience.
Most people don't have the time or energy to scout out multiple beaches, but I think it's important to do so. Moving quickly from one beach to another if the targets are slim to none, is probably the best plan.
If you do end up finding coin lines/ cuts with alot of targets, it's probably best to clean out the location and mark it for next time. The ocean will always keep washing stuff in. Even if you go back the next day you're sure to find stuff unless the ocean washes in sand instead of treasures! -
Nice turkey! Thanksgiving came early this year!
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1 hour ago, Bill (S. CA) said:
Great post and it looks like you had fun. Isn't it amazing how the beach can love you and then break your heart the next day? Or vice versa? Hitting a cut like that after finding sanded in conditions is major good luck. Here in S. CA it seems like the entire coast is sanded in right now. Everyone is fighting over zinc pennies it is so bad!
Bill
And here I thought you guys weren't sanded in! My location is central valley and it's still sanded in here for the most part. It takes a lot of searching around to hit the jackpot!
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1 hour ago, Dave johnson said:
That’s a lot of coins, the salt water sure turns them crusty. I’ve never found any silver coins that weren’t either black or dark grey at the beach.
it's pretty clear they've been out there for a while. Still haven't beaten my record for more than 3 silver coins, but it has beaten the record for the most silver coinage (in terms of coin size) found in a single day!
Also sometimes the patina comes out easily and reveals the silver underneath if you accidentally rub it too hard. -
As you may know, I've been complaining about beaches being super sanded in lately, and I've been searching for beaches not so affected by this seasonal cycle. Mainly I've discovered that hunting places where bulldozers have stirred up the sand helps alleviate some of the sanding in problems, but the tide will bring the sand back fairly quickly, so there's a short time frame of when the dozers leave and when sand fills the cavities they've left behind. I will also correct myself, from what I said earlier about how I thought beaches where you have to pay to get in are not great hunting spots. They are absolutely great places to hunt; as long as there are swimmers, there's treasures.
That being said the area that was bulldozed over had been sanded in again, so I had to look elsewhere to hunt for treasures. Thus, I went an 45 mins south, to a place where I had previous found a coin line before, and had consistently found to have coin lines whenever I went. When I arrived and started detecting, the coins started popping out left and right. That's when I noticed the elevation of the sand was much much lower in some places compared to when I hunted the same area previously. A cut had formed! I feverishly moved along the cut as it rose higher and higher, finding all sorts of quarters, dime, nickels and pennies. The tide was against me this time, as I planned to hunt this area last and it was rising fast! (I was at the concrete ship beach early that morning and found some coins, but not a whole lot) Luckily most of the finds were up against the cut so All I had to do was move along the cut and hit every target I could hit. Eventually I came across a target that I thought was a nickel, oh it was a nickel alright, but not your standard nickel! It was a buffalo nickel, which told me that old stuff was washing up! (or at least being washed out from the cut) "I had to continue quickly, there could be silver coins here!" I thought to myself. So I did, and eventually came across another target with the TID of 44. I was busy pinpointing another target I had pulled up and planned to pull the higher TID target, second. When I finally got around to it, I pulled out a silver ring. Color looked a bit off, and I thought perhaps it wasn't silver, but hey a ring is a ring. (later on I checked and it's marked 925 though it's been pretty worn away) Continuing down the cut, I kept pulling more and more coins. Eventually I pulled up a silver quarter and a silver dime close to each other, as they tend to be. By the end of the cut the targets were few and far between. Satisfied with the finds for the day I turned around and started walking back, while looking for any targets I missed. By this time, it was high tide, and the water was close if not already at the cut, so I had to move quickly. One of the last targets was a high tone and I dug it up, I discovered that I had found another silver quarter! I knew this cause I checked the edge, and even scratched at it with my fingernail to try to expose any copper that may be covered up with patina. Also checked the date and it was from 1964.
Overall it was a great haul, and much needed one at that! I will be back down again this week .Hopefully there will still be more treasures to find!
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The metal detecting vids I watch seem to be on par with what I expect to find out on the field myself. Especially if the locations are near where I live and also hunt! (mainly local beaches) I'm not in any social media groups regarding metal detecting except this one so i'm not seeing any fake stuff. If I do see fake stuff it blatantly obvious and I avoid it all together.
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15 hours ago, StarVatrex said:
I live in a costal town on the shores of the Mediterranean Sea. I do Wet sand, wade, surf and snorkel.
How often?...Depends, detecting in winter is not the same as in summer.
The last ring, last night.
I have three gold pieces since 3/27 with X-Terra Pro...😁
Too lucky, I mostly only find silver here and stuff is sanded in so it doesn't help. Did go out today and found a chunk of change and more silver in a new spot! So i'm excited to get out again.
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1 hour ago, StarVatrex said:
Hi, two things:
- Why low recovery speed? Because in the water your swing is going to be lower than in dry sand and you need more deep.
- Iron sounds like iron, but in the end of your SMF (more 12' inches deep) your detector can't know what is...
You can see negative ID's and that sound that you know in 90 degree...just dig It.
Positive attitude!!!
One more tip:
- Threshold, this was taught to me by an old man... I use in 9-12 in Minelab detectors (Legend it,s bullshit). When the sound stops, dig a couple of scoops. Probably you got it a good target under your coil...
Another day, we talk about gold chains...
yeah when I lose a target I dig a few more scoops just to check if I buried it. I exclusively use the legend as it's the only one I have.
Are you out in the wet often? I can't go too far out because all I have are knee high boots. How often do you find good stuff if you are searching in the surf? -
9 hours ago, StarVatrex said:
Exactly.
Learn to use your detector. Listen to their language. Low tones, all metal, threshold...
Low recovery speed, no iron filters, no bottle cup reject, go down your break tone...a world of things! Take your time.
Deep old gold sounds like iron, you can see negative ID's ... don't worry.
Trust your ear!!!
Your Items: old/green coins, fisher weight, iron, perhaps silver...
Easy.
😉
Why low recovery speed, Also i guess i better turn some things off and try it out. The beaches have been terribly sanded in and it's really difficult to find much of anything really.
For me gold always rings up the same as nickels, and most if not all the time they were quite clear. Never really found any deep gold yet, and all iron sounds i've dug have been just that: iron.
I dig everything that sounds good so i'm definitely not missing much tbh, just poor luck of the draw on gold! -
8 hours ago, StarVatrex said:
...Gold is everywhere! Just, go out and dig.
There's no pattern to follow. Specific weight is high, that the only guide.
Study your beach, winds, tides, bathing areas. And a little luck!...
The rocks really do trap gold near the surf, but there are times when the rocks get washed up and the heavy gold with it. It also doesn't help when things get sanded in; rocks and gold just get buried beyond the range of my detector.
Weird 1967 Quarter Found.
in Metal Detecting For Coins & Relics
Posted
I'll admit being wrong now, additional scratching at the edge with a pen knife revealed the copper at last. I didn't want to damage the coin in the way you suggested, so I did it my way by picking at it. Consider me humbled.