Jeff McClendon

Hi JCR,

Thanks for the great video and for the excellent information. Your video iss way better than the ones I make for sure!

What iron filter settings were you using?

A ground balance of 15/00 is not normal unless your coil is over salty ground conditions or in saltwater. That is what showed up on your Axiom in the video before you switched to Normal Mode. Before you made that switch to Normal, I could briefly hear some coil noise from not being ground balanced when you moved the coil away from the target to make the switch to Normal.

I would often get ground balance numbers like 15/00 or some other value/00 with my original 11X7"DD coil using Fine Mode and my Axiom would not be ground balanced. That was not over ground with salt content. The replacement coil does that sometimes too...........

I hadn't noticed it before until I posted my video here but, the sensitivity to both wild targets in my video was substantially lower when my Axiom was in Fine Mode compared to when I swept those targets in a properly ground balanced Normal Mode.

The Manticore definitely has a distinctive US nickel sound at least for me using the Normal audio theme and giving nickels a dedicated tone and fairly tight tone bin (20 to 28). I just make it a point to dig anything in that range if it has that nickel "thud" sound. Sure, I will dig the occasional pull tab, damaged pull tab, detached beaver tail from a ring pull and those aluminum freshness seal off of modern pull tab cans. Why on earth do people remove those. They can seriously cut you. I also get good sounding can slaw sometimes. Otherwise, that percussive well defined nickel thud is either a nickel or something even better especially when the target IDs and 2D pattern is very tight and well defined. The 800 could make a similar percussive sound on US nickels but there were just way too many other targets that shared 12,13,14. I actually appreciate the expanded target ID range of the Manticore for that reason.

Your characterization of the Manticore locking on to high conductor coins and jewelry has also been my experience whether it's a surface or near surface target in a sea of aluminum/steel trash or something deeper. Even on very iffy sounding possible deeper high conductors, there is so much information provided by the Manticore through tone nuances, red and black target ID patterns, the onboard pinpoint function, very accurate depth meter and the 2D screen that I have started to really experience some patterns of behavior that I can depend on as far as "is it a high conductor coin/jewelry/relic or is it an iron target". 

Thanks for posting your experiences.

Thanks Knomad for your posts and your linked video. I can’t explain what is happening in it. All I can say is that I too have experienced some weird stuff using the DD coils in Fine Mode that completely stops being weird when I switch to Normal. Using Fine Mode with Slow or Medium speed while this is happening has no effect from my experience. 
 

Here is the video I sent to Garrett showing another instance of this odd behavior. This video is not showing the only time this has happened. I made the video to demonstrate what I was experiencing during long sessions with the Axiom in Fine Mode using the 11X7" DD coil with sensitivity at 3 or less and then switching to Normal Mode and the coil would behave normally.

The ground conditions for the video were moderate to high iron mineralization and slightly damp ground. EMI levels were very low.

1 hour ago, Steve Herschbach said:

I use my 11x7 DD exclusively in Fine Mode and in the worst of ground with no problem.

Were you able to watch Knomad's video? It is very good and shows exactly what I was experiencing too.

The new coil that Garrett sent me does better than the old one in Fine Mode as far as sometimes ground balancing but sometimes not. Could the post production versions of the Axiom with the software update just be too hot sensitivity wise for some of those coils somehow?

I had similar issues with my first 11X7DD coil. I made a video and sent it to Garrett. They sent me a new coil BUT, I still am not satisfied with using any DD coil in Fine Mode.

Like Knomad, switching the DD coils to Normal makes them operate very well as far as ground balancing and sensitivity at least on my Axiom. It's weird and kind of counter intuitive since the DDs have that small focused core that mimics a mono coil with a DD surrounding it. That small mono core should love Fine Mode.

I just gave up at one site where I had only taken the 11X7" DD. Fine Mode absolutely would not ground balance and the ground at that site is not extreme. I make sure to take my 11X7" Mono coil with me no matter what.

If this iteration of DD coils shouldn't be used in Fine Mode, Garrett needs to let us know or fix the problem.

With my recent use of the Manticore I was concentrating on high conductor targets first, and then, low to mid conductor targets between target IDs 10 and 30 due to the high levels of aluminum trash in my area that has target IDs between 30 and 55. So far, all of the women’s jewelry that I have found and tested which is mostly smaller earrings, smaller chains with pendants, small engagement rings and small bands have all had target IDs between 10 and 30. Larger men’s rings will definitely be between 30 and 60 or so. Modern silver jewelry seems to start around 60 to 65. 

I owned a CTX for a while but only used it on land. It was similar to swinging a heavy double barreled shotgun! I imagine it would be a different story submerged.

The biggest improvements on the Manticore compared to the CTX for me are the much improved response on low/mid conductors, faster target separation, better unmasking in iron, better handling of mineralization, better ergonomics, better user interface, much easier to read screen and the audio enhancements. I do not like the expanded target ID system and the 8 hour max battery life. For you, the vibrating handle for a secondary underwater target alert and the onboard flashlight may be helpful too.

The 2D target trace will display multiple targets immediately and simultaneously which for me has been very helpful. CTX kind of did that but at a much slower rate. The Ferrous limits are somewhat similar to the CTX patterns but there are upper and lower ferrous with non ferrous in the middle.

As far as Deus 2, I really like mine but I don’t have to look at its screen under water. I have a hard enough time seeing it in daylight. I also dont’ like all the extra hassle of setting it up for hunting with it under water or having to charge up more than two things in order to hunt. Yes, the 25 to almost 85 low and mid conductor target ID range is a bit much.

If you want a less expensive option with a good screen, only 50 total non ferrous target IDs and solid underwater performance, the Legend is also a possibility. I have two of them and they are fantastic. Is the Legend as fast as a Deus 2 and equal to it in iron trash and depth……No. The Legend is also not as deep as the Manticore. However, for the money the Legend is still a great bargain and it won’t miss much.

7 hours ago, D&P-OR said:

Jeff-----You mentioned that you used & did well with the Deus 2 with 11X13" coil in Sept. & Oct. 2023.------Do you feel that the Manticore with the 11" coil did better or the same as the D2 with 11X13" coil in this hunt situation?-----Putting it another way---do you feel you could have found these same targets with the Deus 2 with 11" or 11X13" coils?-------Thanks-------Del

Hi Del,

I think so.

I have never used Deus 2's 11" coil however so I can't include it in that answer.

I had lots of success with the 13X11" and basically I can call the Manticore 11" coil and Deus 2 13X11" basically equal with Manticore at sensitivity 22 to 24 and Deus 2 sensitivity at 95 or so.

If everything hit the fan tomorrow and I had to pick between them for deep high conductor hunting in iron and aluminum trash, right now I would pick the Manticore with the 11" stock coil simply because it feels better on my arm than Deus 2 with the stock shaft swinging that 13X11" coil and the Manticore is easier to setup for water hunting (no setup really) and it is just better for gold prospecting even after XP's improvements for Deus 2's Goldfield program.

10 hours ago, GB_Amateur said:

I'm confused with what "iron bias 0" means for the Manticore, though.

I'm confused as to why I wrote that too. I will edit my post.

I was hunting in All Terrain General with the All Metal discrimination pattern and the ATG Preset default upper and lower ferrous limits unchanged.

I have tried All Terrain High Conductor on some of these deeper high conductor targets. The results were not as good with far less "lock on" as far as giving me enough high tone audio responses to make a dig/no dig decision. I had ATHC setup with the same tones, tone pitches, tone volumes and tone breaks as ATG.

I have the same "issue" with Deep HC on Deus 2. Basing my deep coin programs on the Sensitive program has just been better for the soil conditions here.

14 hours ago, RobNC said:

Greetings everyone. I received my new Nokta Legend yesterday. I also purchased the LG24 coil with it. So immediately that coil was the one I installed and used.

I'm having some odd falsing. Any time the coil comes into contact with something (small brush/ tall weeds) or when I sit it down to dig a target it flases/chirps.  Turned the sensitivity all the way down to 10 and this still happens with abrupt movement or any type of bump to the coil.  I have re-wrapped the coil cable on the shaft and checked connection twice now with no change. On a whim I decided to put the coil facing straight into the air and gently pressed around the coil. When I reached the Nokta sticker it did the falsing. So then I gently tapped the bottom of the coil cover with my finger and false again. No ring, watch, or anything else on at the time.

Is this something that is "normal" with these Legend coils? It sure doesn't seem normal to me. I contacted who I purchased it form and he referred me to the Nokta USA support form. I filled it out.

Has anyone else seen this problem? I'd hate to think I just bought this thing and it has a problem. Only 4 hrs use. Dry land, no water, and I'm not a coil scrubber. Not seen this with my other detectors, but did remember some of this in the past with a Teknetics T2 LTD with a Cors Shrew coil, just not this severe.

I have had my LG24 for over a year and it has taken a beating in the goldfields where I have used it the most. This coil has over 200 hours of use.

I started noticing more coil knock recently using the LG24. I checked the connection where the coil cable enters the coil. It was loose and the O ring was only partially held by the nut. I loosened the nut some more, repositioned the O ring and hand tightened the nut. That has helped some but I still get detected target type responses when I tap the strain relief area where the cable enters the coil even at sensitivity levels below 20.

My other Legend coils do not have this issue.

So, you may have a defective brand new LG24 and may have one that is wearing out!

I was less than neutral about Minelab's Manticore when it was introduced. I wasn't negative about it but I certainly did not celebrate its release or the fanfare that went with it. I waited for almost a year before buying one. Thanks Gerry/Gerry's Detectors for making my Manticore purchase happen!!!

I only started using it full time for coin and jewelry hunting around the last week of January 2024 when it warmed up enough here to melt most of the snow. We have had small amounts of snow and cool temperatures since with no hard freezes so hunting for deeper targets in moist soil conditions has been ideal and still is now after the 14" of snow melted from a recent blizzard.

So my Manticore has been doing great (so did my Deus 2 with 13X11" coil during September and October of 2023) as far as detecting these deeper, challenging targets shown in the photo by giving me enough information to choose to recover them. Sure, I am digging some rusted nails too but my US wheat penny count for the last two months is 128 and I haven't dug anywhere close to 128 rusted nails. 

All of these silver, gold and copper target finds have been in public parks. All targets were at least 6" to 12" deep and there were no easy, totally isolated, no brainer finds. All were in high iron mineralized dirt that by itself would mask these targets using single frequency VLF detectors and these parks have plenty of trash to deal with and listen to. Plus, I have hunted these same parks extensively with the Equinox 800 and I did not find those 128 wheat pennies or the targets in the photo. With the Equinox 800, I would average 1 or 2 wheats a week, a silver ring or jewelry find once a week and a silver coin and gold jewelry find once a month at these same parks.

I am using All Terrain General with the All Metal discrimination pattern and the ATG Preset default upper and lower ferrous limits unchanged, Normal audio theme, 5 tones with tone volumes, tone pitches and tone breaks adjusted for my preferred targets, recovery speed 4 or 5, and sensitivity between 22 and 24 with the stock 11" coil.

Basically, I had no idea that this much silver was still left in these parks and I have only hunted 22 times during the last 2 months in parks that are old enough to have these types of targets.

Thanks Minelab for the Manticore!!!

Thanks Chuck, I will give this technique a try.

I am always interested in tips and tricks from people that I trust who would not stick their neck out on a forum with this kind of information unless they had seen some positive results over time using it.

Hopefully, those responding will be Manticore owners who can keep an open mind and heart and be nice.

This thread also supports this concept.......Don't give up on "hunted out" sites.

More silver and gold found by the Manticore at a site that I have hunted at least a dozen times with Deus 1 and the Equinox 800.

The silver plated watch was a full 12" deep. 3 gram 14K gold ring was 8".

Those two targets had excellent target IDs even at those depths=pocket watch was a 93/94 with just a bit of iron audio responses and the ring was a solid 20/21 with a few red numbers.

1961 D Roosevelt silver dime was also about 8" on edge and target IDs were from 68 to 99 with plenty of iron responses.

2 hours ago, longbow62 said:

My 800 was well past it's warranty expiration. I needed to upgrade. I had a D2 on pre-order, but I decided to wait for Minelab and cancelled it. Two buddies did get the D2. I think from what I've seen it's a great detector worthy of all the praise it gets. I got the manticore Jan. 10th 2023. My second hunt with it in a very trashy yard from a recent tear down I got 3 silvers. I took it back to several places my buddies and I had worn out with various detectors including the 800 and I found more silver. I was finding multiple silvers in several of the places we had given up on finding any more. I think the Manticore is kinda tricky to learn. It did take many hunts to feel confident with it. I still don't think I completely know the detector yet.    

Your experience is very similar to mine.

I feel better now since I thought maybe I was the only one finding silver after silver on "hunted out" Deus 1/Equinox 800 pounded sites using Deus 2 and the Manticore.

Glad the Manticore is working well for you too.

6 hours ago, Rrnp said:

I tested 50 gold pieces, rings, pendants and anything gold, with the Equinox 800 and the Deus 2. The Dues 2 numbers were jumpy just by two or three, but it did sound good on most. The Equinox hit strong on everything with a solid number. On odd shaped and small objects of gold even a small gold chain the Equinox sounded much better.  Both were in Park. Why?????

Equinox 800 has two different Park modes. Which one were you using? Park 2 with all targets accepted would be better than Park 1 since Park 2 has a higher frequency weighting close to 39 kHz and would be my choice if I was testing for various gold targets with many different sizes.

Deus 2 FMF Park mode has a maximum frequency of 24 kHz and has target IDs 23 to 35 notched out by default. Smaller gold targets like chains and micro gold jewelry may have some target IDs in that notched out range and 24 kHz max may not be high enough. I would use one of the Sensitive programs for gold jewelry testing and remove any notches, even 00 to 00 before starting the test.

On 3/11/2024 at 2:26 PM, broadfield said:

Deus II WS6 Master and save yourself a grand.

Performance of these two machines is pretty much equal.

I really like my Deus 2 whether it's with the full remote or the WS6 Master. I really like my Manticore too.

No, these detectors do not have equal performance and unless you are hunting only by ear with both detectors, the WS6 as Master even with the big ID numbers just can't come remotely close to giving a similar amount of onscreen information as the Manticore. If a person has poor eyesight.....forget about using the WS6 as Master if you want to use its display for more information than just big target ID numbers.

Manticore with the M8 coil vs Deus 2 with 9" coil for small gold nugget prospecting or micro jewerly on land is not equal. Otherwise Manticore with 11" coil and Deus 2 with 13X11" coil is very close for most other detecting.

I was not an early adopter of the Manticore. In fact, I really didn't think I remotely needed one especially after buying a Nox 900 and really disliking it. 

I got the Manticore itch when I started to see some good reports after the first Manticore software update and M8 coil release. 

Now after owning one for six months, I am really hooked and I have only been using All Terrain General and the Prospecting modes. Multi IQ+ is much better than Multi IQ on the jacked up 900. Depth is fantastic, EMI resistance is really good, I really like the many audio themes and advanced features and the 2D screen is not a gimmick. I'm glad I got mine before the price increase happened.

1 hour ago, Chase Goldman said:

I will make this final observation, it is really easy to throw stones and say something doesn't work because there is no burden of proof for such criticism.  You simply have to show up and proclaim it as fact and state you couldn't find anything.  It's a whole different matter to put yourself out there to be subjected to such criticism by sharing your positive experience with a custom program or group of settings and back it up with actual finds.  

I don't understand the negativity displayed against people trying to share tips with the forum.  I have found that those who consistently criticize such posts, the manufacturers, or specific detectors or who constantly bring negative energy to the forum often have a track record of NOT contributing or sharing useful information to the community.  Just an observation.

First, Gary Blackwell is a member of this forum and even though he does not post a lot, he is still a member and may have time to read comments that are directed at him especially about programs like Tekkna.

I believe his main point was to just try it and see what you think.

1. If you did and you like it great.

2. If you did and you don't care for it and have given constructive criticism, fine.

3. If you haven't tried it and you are negatively speculating .......why?

I have only experimented with it myself indoors so I have no opinion....(making myself learn the Manticore at the moment since I have a good idea about what Deus 2 can and can't do).

I have just about stopped giving tips and tricks on any forums whether they are my own or someone else's. I am tired of having some people try to shoot down, overly critique and interrogate me about things I have offered as possible aids for gaining more information about targets when detecting. Most of those people fall under #3 above.

The heading for the chart says "Enhanced" which to me normally means "made it better". If the heading said "Expanded" I would accept that as factual. For me so far the "enhancement” of adding 50 extra target IDs between the ferrous non ferrous tone break and US dimes compared to the Equinox 600/800 is total overkill and for me anyway overload.

"Enhancing" that target ID area by 10 to 20 target IDs would have been more reasonable in my opinion. That overly expanded range of target IDs is the only thing that I don't particularly like about the Manticore.

3 hours ago, Redneck said:

Nice recoveries Jeff!  Now Im not trying to be a smart axx when I ask this question.  How can you recover targets that deep with a screwdriver?  I personally use a garden trowel to cut out a plug.  I freak out when I see these guys enter a park with a shovel!

If I am in an area with fairly healthy grass and damp dirt conditions it's pretty easy. I just cut a 6” long maybe 3" deep slit with my screwdriver, get under the first three inches or so of grass on either side of the slit, gently spread it back out of the way and start removing material with my 8” bladed screwdriver. I end up with a 6" long by 2 or 3 " wide hole.  If things go well, all the dirt goes back in, I tamp it down with the butt end of my screwdriver and squeeze the two side of the slit turf back together. That’s the plan. Sometimes it’s too dry for that to work very well but I can usually make it look like I wasn’t there. I return to the these parks at least twice a month and I have never seen any lasting damage from my holes. I have seen dead plugs and dead grass in a circle from idiots with shovels. We don't get frost, dew or fog here very often so the ground dries out really fast. Humidity rarely gets above 25%. This time of year is the best time to go deep when the ground is thawing out from snow cover. Another snow storm is on the way so more silver could be found in the next 2 or 3 weeks before this clay ground hardens into cement.

The two silver coins found relating to this topic were found on a SW facing hill under a pine tree so no grass, just pine needles and dried dirt so no issues making it look like I was never there with a screwdriver.

Found four more silver dimes in that area with Manticore during the last two hunts I did on Sunday and today.

13 minutes ago, GB_Amateur said:

Vertically oriented coins seem to be a problem for all detectors due simply to physics.  And the angle of attack is another key which is why swinging from different directions (as you know, and did) can make the difference between picking it up or not.  You've proven that with careful investigation and an open mind, even iron masked vertical coins can be detected.  Nice work, Jeff!  I'm inspired to listen and watch even more carefully now when I encounter such mixed signals with the Manticore.

Yep, the target information coming from the Manticore in this situation could have turned out many ways. Even when I started digging the first hole, I wasn't completely sure that there were co-located ferrous and non-ferrous targets present.

Out here digging in this soil, I have seen an interesting phenomenon on occasion and I definitely experienced it when digging the silver Washington quarter. After removing the first 3 or 4" of dirt plug or in my case cutting a slit and folding two small plugs out of the way, I started smelling a very distinctive organic/metallic odor and saw light grey and white bits of material mixed with the soil almost like fertilizer. That continued down to the quarter which also has some material loss and a whitish to light grey coating. Sometimes I see this when I am about to dig a silver coin out here. I did not see any of that around the Walking Liberty half...........

I just try to tell it like I remember. Its a good mental exercise and hopefully it helps others in some way.

4 hours ago, F350Platinum said:

Very nice finds Jeff, congrats.

I had a very similar experience a few years ago. Got two silver quarters, then some nails, then a '42 Walker, all in the same hole.

The 34 on my Equinox 600 was unmistakeable, so much so I called it before I dug it. Only half I've found so far. Returned to that spot later and dug a silver ring from the same spot with more nails. I think by then I had the Coiltek 10x5.

It's great to go over a place you've been before with a new machine or even different settings, I think I focus more.

I have a buddy that is absolutely killing it with his Nox 600 for silver and wheat pennies at this same park that we and our entire club have been hunting for who knows how long. 

I personally don't remember finding anything of interest or removing a lot of surface trash at the exact spot where this spill was recovered, but another hunter may have removed something recently that changed the combination of targets just enough to make this find scenario happen.......or the Manticore with 11" coil really is that good. Had I gone over it with Deus 2 using my 13X11" coil, I think I would have heard these targets. Equinox 900 or Legend with 11"......maybe.

11 minutes ago, mn90403 said:

What a great piece of detective work there!  WTG

I think you've got a love affair going on with that Manticore now.  I'll be really interested in how you do with nuggets this summer when you get a few more hours under your belt.

I know I should have one on my beaches but the 800 gets me pretty deep with the 15 and we've had crappy wave energy for months.

We have not had any super cold weather hear since early February. We have had some snow each week but the ground for the most part has stayed thawed out. So, moist to damp soil conditions even deep have made deep target hunting conditions just about perfect. This usually only happens for a little while in early April and then the soil dries out fast and hardens and digging gets really tough. My silver coin and wheat penny count is absolutely off the charts for 2024 using Deus 2 and the Manticore in these ideal soil conditions. Unbelievable.

I was hunting one of the original Denver area parks that was built in the late 1880s. Shovel digging is not allowed at these parks so recovery is with a screw driver or probe. I have found plenty of wheat pennies, a couple of Indian head pennies, several Barber, Mercury and Roosevelt silver dimes and two silver Washington quarters at this park in the last four years after first getting the Equinox 600 and 800.

I was deliberately hunting an area that I knew would not be too wet or frozen under some trees at the edge of a popular sledding hill. I have hunted this exact spot many times with the Nox 600/800 with 11" coil and Deus 1 and Deus 2 with their 9" coils. I am guessing I have hunted this area at least 10 times since it is near the top of the sledding hill and fresh dropped jewelry and coins happen in that area every year. I was actually looking for gold jewelry but I was also interested in deep high conductors. I had my Manticore in All Terrain General Multi, sensitivity 23, recovery speed 5, iron bias 0, and I had the horseshoe button engaged so that I would hear all target responses including iron. Ground balance was 4. This ground has plenty of magnetite, square nails, modern nails and is loaded with many years of aluminum and steel trash. There are very few places to ground balance.

I heard a deep iron signal, saw red numbers and decided to turn on it and I was able to hear some faint, very short intermittent high conductor tones along with lots of iron tones. I pinpointed the target area with the Manticore's onboard pinpoint function and was able to isolate two separate targets and saw them clearly on the 2D screen with one upper area iron and the other at the high conductor far right edge of the non ferrous line. Depth was 8" on the depth meter. I dug the high conductor farthest right target first and it turned out to be the silver Washington quarter laying half way on edge at the center of the dig hole about 7" deep. My handheld pinpointer was still picking up a target on the left edge of the hole which turned out to be the business end of that iron skeleton key in the photo. It was laying horizontally. I recovered it, filled the hole and rescanned. I got a coin sized high conductor target response plain as day with target IDs ranging from 90 to 99 with very few intermittent iron responses about 6" to the left of the hole that contained the Washington quarter and skeleton key. Depth was again 8" on the depth meter and only one solid target trace was at the far right of the non-ferrous line on the 2D screen. Basically, I was starting to freak out. I certainly had not heard any target responses like that with the other detectors that I had used at this spot. The Walking Liberty half dollar was about 8" deep standing straight up on edge at the center of the dig hole.

Basically, the Walking Liberty half and the silver Washington quarter were in a spill at the same depth with the skeleton key laying roughly horizontally between them and they were all under the Manticore's 11" coil at the same time. They were situated sort of like this but buried under about 7" of iron mineralized dirt.

33 minutes ago, OrBrad said:

I have not had a chance yet, but plan to try my luck prospecting (Nugget hunting mainly) with my Legend since I live in a gold producing area.  Do you have any thoughts on how the NEL Snake might perform for this task compared to the LG15? 

I have not used a Nel Snake coil. 
 

I have used the Legend LG15 and LG24 coils for gold prospecting. Both work really well. My only complaint with the LG15 is I wish the coil ears were more center mounted.