mh9162013

On 3/10/2022 at 2:39 PM, phrunt said:

A new CTX might be in the GPX 6000 housing

I had a similar thought last night: a new Equinox could follow the GPX 6000 form factor, ie the battery and at least some of the electronics are in the back of the metal detector for better balance.

On 3/10/2022 at 2:18 PM, Cal_Cobra said:

Does a new CTX make sense?   I suppose we won't know until if and when one surfaces.

I suspect the Equinox was far more successful than Minelab anticipated, it had to erode CTX sales.   In light of the success of the Equinox, what's the market for a new CTX (especially if it retains a similar list price to the current unit)?  If they don't go the same ergo/weight direction the Equinox took, I think they'll have a hard time selling heavy $2500 detectors that's cannot outperform an Equinox, unless they truly are a magnitude better than the Equinox, which I doubt will be the case. 

Time will tell, all eyes will be on Detectival this fall 🙂

Imagine a CTX 3030 in the Equinox's form factor and weight. That alone would make the CTX a pretty big seller among the serious detectorisrs, don't you think? Heck, I'd ditch my Equinox for this hypothetical device...assuming I had the money to afford this machine. 

My gut says that Minelab has 3 options right now:

1. Put a CTX 3030 (or E-Trac) in the Equinox's housing.

2. Release a machine that uses a newer version of FBS (imagine going from FBS2 to FBS3 being equivalent to going from BBS to FBS2) but maintaining the CTX's weight and size.

3. Releasing an Equinox 1000, which is an Equinox 800, but provides better waterproofing, the same (if not lower) weight, and a much improved ability to properly ID iron.

Assuming these are 3 options Minelab is considering, I'm guessing they're going with option #3. If for no other reason, the marketing would be easier. I imagine it would be easier to ride the coat tails of the Equinox as opposed to the E-Trac or CTX 3030.

5 hours ago, GB_Amateur said:

I actually wrote up my impressions here (it's still around if someone wants to search)

Oh, I found it and came across it a few months ago when I was trying to figure out my Sun Ray Probe for the E-Trac. I remember using it and being like, "that's it? What am I missing?"

Then I found your thread and started messing with the sensitivity, using pin point mode, etc. Nope, still didn't think it was more efficient than my F-Pulse.

And here's another issue: it's got some notable weight. And the E-Trac is already too heavy. Then combine the two? The Sun Ray needs to be A-M-A-Z-I-N-G, and it's not even close.

This isn't to say it's bad or doesn't work. It's definitely a useful and a worthy device for pinpointing. But only a slight improvement in pinpointing ability over the F-Pulse? Sorry, I have to pass.

Seems like he's supertuning the pinpointer.

42 minutes ago, NCtoad said:

Me too. If the legend ends up performing  as good as the nox I may just get one just for the build quality and selection of coils.  

Oh, I already expect the Legend to be as good as the Equinox...or be close enough such that personal preferences will be the deciding factor.

8 hours ago, NCtoad said:

Paystreak (Jeremy) responded to my comment on his youtube channel.  

“I always run 0 Iron bias on nox. Bump it up to 3 in my hot soil and you will miss many deep targets. The Nox high tones on nails like the Simplex. Legend gives very few high tones on nails.”

 

It will be interesting to see how the Legend responds after it gets the new iron bias update.  You got to like Paystreak’s videos.  The guy puts out an honest video.  I’m 

The Legend had my curiosity, but now it has my attention...

19 hours ago, kac said:

Coil loading?

Is this the same thing as "super tuning" a pinpointer?

46 minutes ago, schoolofhardNox said:

The Sunray probe was awesome for the E Trac. I wish I never sold mine.

And I'm trying to sell mine and would have preferred if I never bought it. 

I was never impressed with the Sun Ray on the E-Trac. The discriminating is neat, but its poor ability to "home" in on a target and how it constantly has to be moving never really caught on to me.

Different strokes for different folks!

Steve (of this site) discussed this idea and if I recall what he said correctly, he pushed one or more detecting companies hard as to the need for such a device, but had no such success.

I've thought about shortening down a Vanquish 340 with the V8 coil to make an "MIQ Pinpointer." It might work better with an Equinox 600 and 6" coil, but that'd be a bit too expensive for me to mess around with.

50 minutes ago, phrunt said:

It's hard to know, they're always doing a new Facebook live post "clearing things up" They added the iron bias setting though, so Iffy won 🙂

The reason I ask is b/c I got the idea he was a beta tester or something and for a while, was under an NDA. So he had an opportunity to find problems and give suggestions to N/M. But when he had this opportunity, for w/e reason, N/M didn't make a decision to add an adjustable iron bias. I have 2 theories as to what happened here.

First, he asked for adjustable iron bias from day 1 (while he was under an NDA), but N/M refused to go along with his suggestion.

Second, he never asked for adustable iron bias and/or he didn't tell N/M about potential masking issues b/c of a fixed iron bias until AFTER his NDA was lifted.

If my second theory is correct, I can see why N/M would be upset with him. But Iffy seems like a decent guy, who's smart. So I'm going with my first theory. And if that theory is true, more power to him! 

2 hours ago, phrunt said:

caused a lot of backlash, including from the company

Was N/M upset with the criticism or how the critism was conveyed? 

6 minutes ago, CPT_GhostLight said:

The best way to see objective reviews is to watch customer videos who paid for their product.

I'd take it a step further and say the most objective reviews are from people who have no affiliation with a metal detecting company or bias (for or against) a metal detecting company.

Too many "influencers" try to convince us that because they paid for the item they're reviewing, they're not biased. Or because they're not being paid by XYZ Corp., XYZ Corp. has zero influence over their reviews.

I love how some people show up on a company's promotional materials and at their events, yet still say they can give an unbiased review of that company's products. 🙄

12 minutes ago, longbow62 said:

What I am saying is at the one site the coins happen to be much more shallow than normal. That's where small coils shine if I understand it correctly. Shallow good targets in amongst trash. Small coils didn't help there even though theoretically the trash and the coins were on the same plane.  

Here's a question: let's say you have a location (we'll call it Location A) that has silver coins. And the silver coins are on the same plane as older trash (more likely to be iron and less likely to be aluminum). Then above the iron-and-silver-coin layer (and closer to the surface), we have the more modern trash, which is more likely to have a higher percentage of aluminum.

Now we have a different location (Location B) that's exactly like the first one, except the silver coins are situated above the iron trash and amongst the more shallow aluminum trash. 

Which location do you think is better suited for the 11" coil on your Equinox? And which would you think is better suited for your 6" or 10x5 coil? Assume both Locations A and B are very trashy.

10 minutes ago, longbow62 said:

I'd like mention I've read where the 6" and the 10x5 are deep for there size. One of the places I re-hunted with them the coins were shallow to begin with. Like 3" deep. Very shallow for my area. It made no difference. The Barber dime I found with the 11" had it's I.D. pulled down by something near it because it was reading 18-19 in the ground, but the correct I.D. in a clear spot on top of the ground. That's what made me want to try the smaller coils there. Shallow coins plus some obvious trash that I had actually saw affect the I.D. of a good find. What better place to use them. I came up empty for my efforts. No biggie, and believe me I'm not basing my view of the smaller coils just on these last three places I've used them. I'm basing it on my continued bad luck with them trying to find something the 11" missed. 

Maybe I'm misreading you, but it sounds like my 3 hypotheses could be supported by your observations. Remember, one of my hypotheses says that the higher the high conductor is in relation to the iron, the less of an advantage a small coil will have. And if your coins are that shallow, I think it's fair to assume that many of those shallow coins are above much of the potential trash there. So your 11" coil may have been the ideal coil choice for many of your hunting conditions...or at least no worse than a 6" or 10x5.

Another variable which I haven't gotten into yet is what's potentially masking the high conducting target. MIQ struggles to properly ID large pieces of iron, so I wonder if my 3 hypotheses can be thrown out the window if one replaces the pieces of iron with aluminum pull tabs or foil.

Ok, so I have an Equinox 600, but don't have the 6" or 10x5 coils for it. But I do have the V8 for the Vanquish 340.

When a clad dime was on the same plane as the steel/iron nails on my Modified Monte's Nail Board (and in Coin Position 1), the Vanquish 340 with the V8 performed slightly better than the Equinox 600 with the 11" coil (F2 = 0 and maxed out recovery speed).

But when the clad dime was a few inches below the nails (but still in Coin Position 1), the Equinox 600 with the 11" coil did a bit better than the Vanquish 340 with the V8 (going 1 for 4 while the Vanquish went 0-4).

1 hour ago, longbow62 said:

I have a thread going on another forum I started the other day about how the small coils have done nothing for me. I have the 6" and 10x5. I have been back over three places I have recently got silver and all were pretty trashy. One basically iron only. the other two a mix of iron and modern. I found nothing more going back over these spots. I have never even found a silver with either of the smaller coils that I can remember. The crazy thing is I also never seem to hear anything very deep with them. I'm talking 4" maybe 5" max. I hunt pretty slow to begin with. I'm not going to fast. I've tried jacking the sensitivity and lowering recovery a tad. I've kept all settings the same too. Unless your working around obstacles I've yet to find a good use for them.

I saw that thread and I've been reading it with great interest; thanks for starting it. 

Here are my hypotheses (for the Equinox) in regards to vertical placement of the high conducting target (let's assume a clad or silver dime) between 2 peices of iron (where the 2 pieces of iron are always on the same plane as each other).

1. If the dime is b/w two pieces of iron, but above the peices of iron, both big and small coils will be better able to pick up on the dime (compared to a situation where the dime is below the plane the iron pieces are on), but the smaller coil will have an advantage (from a target separation perspective). However, the higher the dime is in relation to the 2 pieces of iron, the less of an advantage a smaller coil will have over the bigger coil.

2. If the dime is b/w two pieces of iron, but on the same plane as both pieces of iron, the smaller coil will have an easier time picking up on the dime (from a target separation perspective).

3. If the dime is b/w the pieces of iron, but is below the plane where the 2 pieces of iron are located, both coils may or may not be able to pick up on the dime. But the further down the dime goes in relation to the 2 pieces of iron, the less of an advantage the smaller coil will have.

If my 3 hypotheses are correct, then that might explain why some people don't see what the big deal is with smaller coils on the Equinox. For example, imagine an old house with silver coins in the yard. But the silver is located 5-9 inches down. But from the surface down to 5 inches, there's nothing but a dense blanket of iron trash. The stock 11" Equinox coil might be more capable of sniffing out the silver coins compared to the 10x5 or 6" coil. Or, it's ability to pick up on those silver coins is at least comparable to the 10x5 or 6". But since you get more coverage and depth with the stock 11" coil, that ends up being the preferred coil.

I think I'm oversimplifying. But I'm trying to get a general principle down, because I worry about the caveats. Kind of like how, when it comes to coils, as a general rule, the bigger the coil, the deeper is can detect. It's not 100% true in 100% of situations, but it's a solid rule of thumb to start a "which coil should I use" analysis.

4 hours ago, klunker said:

That was left by  biology students collecting specimens for class.

What kind of specimens were they collecting? 🤪

7 minutes ago, phrunt said:

I'd expect a new CTX from the discontinuation of an E-Trac, not a new E-trac, I've been expecting one for a while now, I ended up giving in and buying one after waiting for some time for a new one to come out, I'm glad I did give in, I love my CTX, if a new one comes out great! I'd love a new improved CTX even more I'm sure.

I assume that any replacement for the E-Trac would also be a replacement for the CTX and vice versa. 

4 hours ago, Steve Herschbach said:

When old models are discontinued, that’s also a fairly large clue about what’s coming next.

And the E-Trac was recently discontinued, right? 😁

2 hours ago, khouse said:

I know this is an old thread but - The RNB was the best accessory I've ever purchased for my etrac.  I could leave my etrac in my truck for months in the cold of winter.  Then pull it out on a decent day to hunt and the RNB battery was always full.  Plus it was lighter making the etrac weigh under 4lbs.  I bought the RNB for my Vanquish for the same reasons.  Plus taking the rechargeable AA batteries out to charge will soon be a pita.  Now all you have to do is leave the RNB in place and plug it in. 

Or, just get some high quality LSD NiMH cells like Eneloops and put them in the alkaline battery holder/pack. Save a ton of money with comparable long-term performance (in the field and in storage) and you can always use the AA cells for other applications around the house.

Also, keeping lithium cells stored in very cold conditions is not good for their long-term health. NiMH cells? They're more tolerant of being stored in the cold.

The lithium cells do have the benefit of being lighter, though, so there is that. But then again, there are recharegable lithium AA cells on the market that work pretty well. These would give plenty of run time...probably the equivalent of a brand new 1800 Minelab pack, but the rough weight of the RnB pack. However, it wouldn't have the RnB's capacity. So I suppose there are some situations where the RnB pack is "worth" it.

17 minutes ago, nickeldNdimed said:

I used the same on both shaft. Steve can probably confirm but I believe they are the same as stock on the carbon shaft. I use the 2nd from front or 3rd from back of the 4 holes. Otherwise if I use furthest back the cuff would be right on my elbow

Thanks!

Since I know your height and what your "arm cuff position settings" are, I now have a good idea of how I want my customization to work on the S-shaft if I finally get down to ordering it.

8 minutes ago, F350Platinum said:

I have the 10x5 on my 600 all the time. Recently I dug a small silver ring that was 8-10" deep in a hole with a few iron bits, probably old nails. Had to use the Quest pinpointer to find it. It was the 27 in one direction that clued it was there. I did not find this with the 11". I also find I have better "lock on" capability over multiple targets, probably due to learned coordination using it. These are areas I went over with the 11". I have found every silver item with the 10x5 in this place. 3 silver quarters, a Walker Half, two rings. There is a lot of iron and aluminum trash.

Hopefully the D2 and the Legend will get a similar coil. 🙂 Until then the Equinox and the 10x5 will do fine for me!

So that's 6 silver targets found with your 10x5. Had you been using your 11" stock coil instead, how many of those 6 targets do you think you would have found?

1 minute ago, Tometusns said:

I think there’s a lot more to that than we know.

I agree, but maybe we can get a better understanding? Because spending another $100-$250 on a coil for target separation that's only better "most" of the time is a bit unnerving.

I know I'm not the only one with limited funds and if I had $150 or w/e to spend and I'm trying to decide b/w Steve's S-shaft or a 6" coil, I'd like to better understand what sort of benefit I'm getting with the smaller coil.

This is all very intriguing. I have a proposition:

If someone in the USA has a 6" and/or 10x5 coil they can send me, I'll run them (along with my 11" stock coil) on my Modified Monte's Nail Board and report back with results. Then when testing is done, I'll return the coils on my dime (hahaha, punny).

22 minutes ago, Tometusns said:

  Could be. I’ve sure been thinking a lot about it.🤔

   I think what EL NINO77 said about the nine inch coil makes sense. The larger coils have space between the center bar and the outside of the coil that the smaller coils don’t have. That’s the difference I can see. The nail would be in between the outer and center bar of the coil verses the outer part of the coil directly over the nail when the center passes over the dime.  Perhaps that’s why the larger coils could see the dime and the smaller ones couldn’t. Who knows? 

This might explain why some people who use the 6" on the Equinox don't notice much of an improvement. 

Imagine we have 3 potential targets:

Target 1 is b/w 2 iron nails, but below the plane the nails are on.

Target 2 is b/w 2 iron nails, but on the same plane as the nails.

Target 3 is b/w 2 iron nails, but above the plane the nails are on.

Presumably:

Target 3 can be hit with any of the Equinox's coils.

Target 1 can only be hit with the larger Equinox coils.

Target 2 can only be hit with the smaller Equinox coils.

If my presumptions are correct (they're probably not), then the smaller coil will offer no benefit in target separation over the larger coils assuming targets are equally distributed amongst the iron trash.

So, how do we explain why smaller coils have better target separation? Maybe it's b/c the above observations are most evident when the trash target is iron and not say...aluminum? Or maybe it's b/c the above results depend on how big the coils is, how small the coil is, how far apart the iron nails are and how far above or below the nails are. So in the end, the small coils perform better than the larger coils in more potential scenarios.

In other words, if you took my above hypothetical "mind experiment," but you expanded it to 100 different possibilities (in regards to how far apart the nails are, how far below or above the dime is, how fast the coils is swung, the size of the coils, etc.), perhaps the smaller coils will come out ahead 55% of the time (or more)? 

It's kind of like how wearing a seatbelt, overall, improves your chances of avoiding serious injury in a car crash. But there are still narrow situations where having a seatbelt in a crash will increase your chances of injury.

TL;DR - a smaller coil helps improve target separation...MOST of the time.