Steve Herschbach

If you include gold prospecting as part of the definition of "general purpose" which I do, then 8 kHz won't cut it. If you exclude gold prospecting that's another thing, but is it then truly general purpose?

To me anyway the 14 kHz MXT is kind of the definitive "general purpose" detector by way of that switch in the upper left.....

14 minutes ago, tboykin said:

A little rain can make getting there a lot more fun. Throw it in 4LO and put the hammer down!

I did that the first couple times I got into serious rain out in northern Nevada. Never again! Scared myself silly and really lucky it did not end badly. This desert dirt turns to genuine snot in the rain and will quickly pack any tire tread and have you running on slicks in mud. I told my wife if I get caught in a downpour I will pull over and not be home until things dry out. If that takes days so be it - I have the supplies just I case.

That truly is a first class video you shot Tom. Good going!

The temps sure are on a steep downward trend - got a might bit chilly last night! Currently calling for mid-sixties and lows around 40 on the 23rd. Still a week away though and they really have no idea around here what is going on a week out. Be prepared for the possibility of near freezing temps overnight however so pack your woolies.

I know last year was a huge event but the buzz seems a lot quieter this year.....

On 9/12/2017 at 8:32 PM, OregonGregg said:

Hi Steve,

Ya Monte & I are still beat'n around the old sites trying to scrounge up an old coin or two.

If you ever get tired of finding all that gold, come on up to Eastern OR. we have a few sites we can get knee deep in the iron and rusted tin and have fun. 

Hi Greg,

Sorry I did not respond sooner. That you for the kind offer. It would be an honor to meet you both. I learned a lot years ago reading every Monte post I could find about hunting in dense iron. I have to admit it is hard to tear myself alway from hunting gold to look for a coin in the midst of all the trash. However, I have been telling myself for years that I want to find a gold coin, and hunting those old sites is one of the few ways of boosting the odds of that happening. 

So Paul, if you get the time, how about some final comment or summary of your trip? Happy with results? Tips for others? Going back?

Well 12:45am Saturday here on the west coast of the U.S. actually means the middle of tomorrow (Friday) night. Sounds like go to bed and get up at 12:30 for me. That live feed better be working!

Leaked photo....

In case the first post was too vague for people, the same page in the referenced issue of Discover Magazine has this to say from Ken White....

"Please keep your eyes and ears open for an announcement in the coming months about the newest product from White’s. Until then, happy hunting, and may your days be filled with treasure and good memories this fall."

I will admit at this point it is all a mystery to me. Obviously the issue is limited to certain combinations of coils and particular machines but that is the most I can figure given the reports we have had so far. I am going to fire up my nearly unused small coil just to see what happens since all I ever use normally is the 10" coil. I really am sorry for the problems you have had Chuck. First the MX Sport and now this. The detector gods just seem to be dumping on you 

Here is a thread on deep seeking treasure detectors with a realistic depth chart. As usual the chart and depths quoted are based on optimistic low mineral conditions. Real life results will probably be less impressive.

An updated version of the UFO with a proper mounting point would be sweet. That one sided mount was really odd.

What I really want somebody to do however is make a BigFoot (figure 8 winding) or Cleansweep style (elongated DD) 3" x 18" coil for any super popular VLF detector. I don't care what VLF detector it fits so much as being able to get the coils new. If I was doing it I would make it for whatever the best selling VLF detector is. Something like the Garrett AT series perhaps? Or the Fisher 19 kHz series? Or the new Minelab?

There is another used BigFoot coil for sale on eBay right now for $750 and it is even admitted to perhaps be defective!

I kind of understand the figure 8 winding being hard to make, but an elongated DD should be easy. Regardless, any coil people are buying used for three and four times what they sold for new should get some bodies attention!

Ok, we do live in an age of technological miracles. I am often posting to you guys from the field between detecting sessions. Forums, YouTube, Social Media, etc. have transformed the way we learn and share information.

Live streaming is the other big new thing, giving everyone the ability to be a live newscaster. From the Minelab Facebook page:

FACEBOOK LIVE EVENT!

"It came out of the sky!" - Get ready for Minelab's product announcement at Detectival on September 16th!

The live stream will be broadcasted from Detectival UK Rally 2017. The video will then become available on the Minelab Facebook page. Are you excited?

Time zones:
London, UK: 8:45 AM, Saturday, September 16
Sydney, Australia: 5:45 PM, Saturday, September 16
California, USA (PST): 12:45 AM Saturday, September 16
New York, USA (EST): 3:45 AM Saturday, September 16
South Africa Standard Time: 9:45 AM, Saturday, September 16 
Dubai, UAE: 11:45 AM Saturday, September 16
Istanbul, Turkey: 10:45 AM Saturday, September 16

Please note, we may experience some potential streaming difficulties due to our location. Regardless, all stream footage will be uploaded to Minelab Facebook page when possible!

It is too early to know for sure but I would think it would do as well as most similar general purpose detectors. The 13.6 kHz AT Max is not designed specifically as a gold prospecting detector. Like the 14 kHz White's MXT and others before it the AT Max is a general purpose coin, jewelry, relic, and prospecting detector. I expect some people will use it to find gold nuggets. I also doubt it will have any real influence on the general prospecting market in the long run. Detectors with similar performance have been available for a long time and most serious prospectors like myself use more powerful detectors already.

For instance, I use a Minelab GPZ 7000 for 98% of my prospecting. Many other prospectors use the GPX or even older GP series detectors. What VLF or LF detectors we might use is very much a secondary concern. In Africa and other less exploited goldfields lightweight less expensive detectors like the Teknetics T2 and Fisher Gold Bug Pro have been huge sellers, but Garrett has not been as aggressive it would appear in exploiting those markets.

The reality is the Garrett AT Gold has been on the market for years, yet few prospectors use them by comparison to other models. I see nothing to indicate the AT Max is better or even as good as the AT Gold for prospecting. Otherwise Garrett might as well discontinue the AT Gold and there is no hint yet they will do that.

I respect Garrett a lot and they do make good detectors. I can go find gold with the AT Max I am sure, or the Nokta Impact also. I simply do not believe either machine will have much influence in the prospecting world because they are not designed for or marketed specifically for that purpose. That does mean they are not decent, capable all around detectors. All I can say is I was a very successful metal detector dealer for over three decades and I have rarely been wrong about that sort of thing.

My advice with all new detector models to anybody is to wait six months to a year to see how reports from others play out.

I guess I am getting too old and to jaded to think any new detector that runs at only one frequency at a time is ever going to make a significant difference in my life. The technology is old and relatively simple. Thinking the AT Max is somehow magically much more powerful than the many other similar single frequency machines that already exist is just wishful thinking. The same can honestly be said of the Nokta Impact, which is only significant because it lets you chose between several frequencies. But so does the XP Deus and others before it, like the Eureka Gold. The Nokta Impact is designed to compete with the XP Deus. It was never intended to be a major player in the prospecting world. Expecting it to turn out otherwise again is just wishful thinking in my opinion.

Even new detectors that are made and marketed specifically for gold prospecting, like the new Minelab Gold Monster, are no more powerful than detectors that have existed for many years. The 45 kHz Gold Monster has roughly identical capabilities as the 48 kHz White's GMT and the several 50 kHz White's Goldmasters before that. I can do about as well with an old White's Goldmaster V-SAT as I can the much newer Gold Monster. White's could have repackaged the GMT years ago into a lighter more compact package but did not. Minelab beat them to it and so White's missed the opportunity. That's pretty much what single frequency tech is all about - repackaging existing capability in new a different ways. That in itself can be better even if it does nothing more than improve ergonomics.

One last time before I move on from this subject - single frequency technology in my opinion is old and fully exploited as far as what can be achieved. Expecting new single frequency detectors to be significantly different is not realistic in my opinion. The only thing that is nice is improvements in the overall packaging and feature lists, hopefully at attractive prices. The AT Max scores well in this regard.

Oh yeah, life is good. Hopefully in your world also.

A GP 3000 with Coiltek UFO coil gave me my best week of detecting ever - just shy of two Troy pounds of specimen gold in a week. Story with photos here.

Here is the magic coil with one of the nuggets (0.55 oz) fresh out of the ground...

Welcome to the forum Trevor! It's always great to have company representatives on any of the forums, and doubly so here. Coiltek coils put a lot of gold in my pocket!

First person fires up. Next person nearby fires up, aims coil at other person, does auto tune routine.

A third person or more might be added to the chain, but at that point the group might have to do manual tweaking of the frequency to be sure everyone is offset. 

I should point out that many detectors have depth meters. They are really just a signal intensity trick. They calibrate the detector to what a coin, usually a dime, will have for signal strength at various depths. Something larger than a dime but deeper will mimic the same signal. However, a good target id detector can help there. If the detector says dime at 3" and you have dug 5", something is amiss.

The depth calibration for something like a dime is also matched to a particular coil size, normally the one that comes with the coil. Changing coil sizes will throw the depth reading off. A few detectors, like the White's V3i allow you to tell the detector what coil is on the machine to compensate. A few newer detectors also have chips in the coil which tell the machine what coil is on it, again to compensate for this difference.

A shallow small item can sound a lot like a deep large item. About all you have to go on is how sharp or how broad the target sounds. A small sharp "zip-zip" is a tiny surface target. A duller broader signal is something larger and deeper. But how large and deep is hard to gauge before you dig it. I have started with soft signals at the surface that prove to be a can a foot and a half down.

And welcome to the forum! 

The GPZ is far too sensitive to small stuff Rod. I have used it on the beach and running it some more up at Lake Tahoe is on my to-do list. I am sure I could run in some of the much less sensitive modes and go find a coin in a park with it, but there really is a point where things make no sense. I think the GPX series is far better for things like relic hunting than the GPZ for the same reason. The GPZ is going to hit every flake of ferrous trash and bits of foil and can slaw.... all better than anything else made. And it weighs over seven pounds. Nope, I will stick to my ATX for fun stuff like coin hunting with a PI. The TDI detectors are better yet due to the ability to manually adjust the ground balance to play target id tricks.

Beaches though are another thing. I will be reporting on the GPZ with 19" coil at the beach sometime in the next 30 days.

I got an Optima 420 in 2014 and have been very happy with it. My wife was even happier - she uses it more than I do to clean her jewelry. But still there when I need it. There are smaller, cheaper ones but I sometimes need to clean some fairly large specimen gold.

Or maybe a Blisstool. Or a Nautilus. VLF machines that push the limits tend to get unstable and hard to use.

I can't help it - I just do not associate single frequency VLF with depth. When I want depth I use a PI or GPZ. The only reason to use a VLF in my opinion is for discrimination, not depth. 

An ultrasonic cleaner does wonders for gold nuggets and jewelry. Anything that might have dirt lodged deep in crevices.

I am sure the AT Max and Nokta Impact are very good detectors, as are dozens of other detectors on the market. Single frequency technology hit maximum depth over 20 years ago. There are improvements in packaging and options, but I do not think the AT Max or Impact get depth performance that is really much different than older machines on the market, like the Fisher F75, Tesoro Tejon, or White's MXT for example. I have not used any VLF metal detector since 1990 that got more depth on coins than my 13 kHz Compass Gold Scanner Pro. VLF Detectors And Depth

Comparing to a GPX on unknown targets? Just sounds like he wished he got a PI. No matter that you can change frequencies, the Impact is still a single frequency detector and when you mix salt water and mineralized Oz soil it will suffer compared to a multifrequency and especially a PI. It should however do as well as a single frequency machine can do but without comparing to another VLF no way to know what's going on.

COG (COnductive Ground) is the go to salt water wet beach or in water mode. A related thread at Findmall Link deleted since Findmall Forum update broke all old links

From the Impact User Manual page 14:

I used to have as much trouble as any pinpointing small targets once out of the hole and into the pile with the GPZ14. I guess you dig enough of them though and it does make a difference as I usually get them in the scoop first or second try now. As long as I make the effort to nose around properly first. Sometimes I just dive in with the scoop and then it does turn into a chase.

There are two hot spots fore and aft (four total), where the red outer windings cross the black inner winding in the diagram below. I use the front two to pinpoint small nuggets in the pile. You might think the nugget is under one hot spot when it is under the other so it takes some nosing around from multiple angles to sort out where it really is - and then scoop.

Once in the scoop I do the divide and conquer routine over the left rear hot spot. Other people like to wave over the nose of the coil. Whatever works I guess.