Bohemia Miner

I spoke with Todd Marshall today and he just picked up ALL the left over parts from White's.  He said to give him about 3 weeks to sort it all out before calling for availability.

I heard from a buddy that Minelab was discontinuing this model.  I hope it's not true!

I also heard from another buddy that they are no longer going to make single frequency Gold Machines.

I know rumors are what they are but wanted to reach out anyway.

Thanks!

Walt

1 hour ago, locator said:

The TRX is a very superb piece of high tech.

Wished I'd have bought about a half dozen at the beginning of the year!

"AT Pro Pointer = TRX"

I did an Air test last night.  The TRX  found a 1 grain piece of gold 1/2" from the tip.  The Carrot wouldn't find it at all!

I would have liked to have seen the TDI in the water-Proof "Sport" platform with a variety of coil sizes.  Whites really missed the boat by just modifying their Beach Machine.

When I first started selling Metal Detectors I was confused by the Infinium's 96 Frequencies.  It's Pulse Induction.  It doesn't operate on a Frequency, right.  Then I realized it was like a cordless phone with 96 "Channel's".  There would have been less confusion if they would have used THAT terminology instead.

Other than the Falcon MD 20 Probe, does anybody make a Prospecting specific Pin Pointer for small gold?

Thanks!

Walt

Can anyone tell me what Frequency the Pro-Find 35 operates at?  I can't find it anywhere.

Is the search field off the tip like the TRX or 360 like the Garrett?

Thanks!

Walt

On 9/25/2020 at 10:07 AM, Steve Herschbach said:

Once I get the detector back I'll do something up. But I have used this detector and coil combo before and there are limits to what a small coil can do as far as enhancing small gold capability. The machine itself has inherent limits. However, nobody has compared the original Gold Bug to the modern digital version. Since I just happen to have a new 19 kHz model on hand, I will test them both on tiny nuggets to see just what the difference is. I believe it will be instructive as people tend to focus just on frequency, but there is more to it than that.

I was selling at the Portland Oregon GPAA show a few years back.  A man came up to me looking for a Gold Bug.  I showed him Fisher’s latest offering to which he replied “No, I’m looking for an Original, without the Screen”.  I explained to him that they were few and far between.  I then inquired as to the reason for his search and dislike for the newer model.  Both were 19kHz.  Both had Ground Balance capabilities with the new “Bug” more user friendly.  He then told me the following story.  He and a Buddy were out Nugget Hunting.  He had the original and his Buddy was using the current model.  He then pulled a good-sized piece of Magnetite out of his pocket with a piece of gold attached.  His Buddy’s detector showed it as being ferrous so he failed to dig the target.   He was following behind and because the “hit” was so solid and with nothing to tell him otherwise, he recovered it!

I had never seen anything like that although I’ve been told that both were created by the same Hydrothermal activity. I wish I had snapped a photo!

23 hours ago, Bohemia Miner said:

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4 hours ago, mn90403 said:

Walt,

I don't know why you haven't gotten a reply sooner but I'll take a stab at it.  I first read about Rye Patch many years ago on Chris Ralph's site here:

http://nevada-outback-gems.com/prospecting_info/majuba_mtns.htm

It is still one of the best ways to learn about Rye Patch.  Now that you know where it is then you can look at many, many other threads and pictures of gold found there by searching Rye Patch on this forum.

I know this will help.

Mitchel

Thanks Mitchel!  Looks live you live in the place of my birth.  I love detecting that beach.  I don't know how long you've been there but I used to visit my Grandmother every summer.  They had an Amusement park on a pier near Venice called Pacific Ocean Park (POP).

I’ve heard of folks hunting the Rye Patch area of Nevada.  How do they gain access?  Do they have their own claim?  Are there Open to the Public areas?  What about Local Prospecting Clubs?

Thanks!

Walt

Great Video Steve,  thanks for sharing!  I never really thought about iron mixed with good targets "Averaging" or lowering the VDI.

I got my first chance to take the Apex out for a test drive in a local park. I chose U.S. Coins mode because the area I was hunting is home to a Carnival with Rides and Game Booths every year. I must say, it ran fairly quiet until it hit a target. I will most likely use Zero in the future as the “Pre-set” modes may have more discrimination than I’m used to.  Or I could “Accept” some of the blocked-out segments to create a “Custom” Program.

Overall impressions: Simple, nice and light weight, well balanced, easy to adjust settings plus the Wireless Audio that you can hear your Pin Pointer through!  However, I watched a You Tube video of a hunt at a Boy Scout Camp.  The videographer mentioned that the Depth Gauge seemed to be “off”.  I experienced the same issue.  One target read 4” when it was right under the surface.  This happened more than once.

My 1.5 hours netted me some Clad coins, a Cinemark Token, a Fleur-de-lis snap or button cover and three strange washers.  I only found one other piece of “junk” which appears to be cast Aluminum.

Comparing it to the Minelab Equinox Series would be a bit unfair.  While they share similarities like Simultaneous MF, GB, Noise Cancel (Frequency Shift) and Preset Programs including Beach Mode, that’s where it ends.  The Nox has way more Features and Adjustments putting in a completely different league altogether!  The APEX is simply an entry level Multi-Frequency Metal Detector for those starting out or an upgrade for the many Ace Enthusiasts.

I’ve mostly worked with the White’s TRX which reads off the tip.  It will take some time getting used to the 360 degrees of the Garrett and Nokta Pin Pointers.

My only real concern other than the Depth issue is what problems, if any, may occur due to them being put together so quickly to fill the many preorders and back orders.

"What I'm wondering is if the standalone Z-lynk receiver is compatible with their detectors that have the built-in transmitters."

My answer would be yes.  It would allow you to use what ever wired headphones you're fond of instead of the MS-3.

1 hour ago, Chase Goldman said:

Speaking only of the Equinox to Apex comparisons I’ve seen,  Park mode does not mean that the Equinox was not run in zero disc mode. FYI.  Park mode simply establishes the MF profile used.  The user can then adjust disc as they see fit.  From what I’ve seen in the Apex to Equinox comparisons it was indeed apples to apples with disc turned off on the Equinox while running zero mode on the Apex.

I was under the impression that those "Pre-set" modes come with a certain amount of disc.  Am I wrong?

I’ve seen two comparison videos recently; this one with the Nox and the other was a Simplex.  The problem with these guys is they’re comparing apples to oranges.  They’re running these machines in one of the preset programs like “Park” and comparing them to the Apex with zero discrimination.  Not a very fair test if you ask me.  They should at least have put it in Coin mode or run both in “All Metal”.

At first I'm thinking, no threshold, no small gold.  I did an air test (@  20 kHz) and it found a 1.5 grain nugget at 1 inch !  I was glad to see that as the launch video indicated it would find "small gold nuggets".

I had been a multi-line dealer since 2005.  I moved back to Oregon in 2011 and continued to do so.  75% of the people in my Prospecting club owned Metal Detectors.  Of those, at least 75% were White’s.  I was living and selling in White’s Country!  As a result, I concentrated on that brand.  I didn’t give up my other dealerships.  I just didn’t order unless somebody needed something.  I stocked White’s only.

Garrett is a family owned US company with a reputation of excellent Customer Service.  Not only that, they’re solid financially.  I recently learned that they purchase all the parts in January that they need to manufacture all the detectors for the entire year!  That can’t happen unless you have the funds to do so.

When I first started in this business, the Ace series was already in place.  At the end of the last decade they introduced the AT Series; first the Pro, then the Gold, followed by the PI X and then finally, the Max.  Within the past five years they revamped the Ace Series.  Not by adding a newly designed coil and changing the rod colors like Tesoro did.  We’re talking about REAL improvements.  They introduced the new 400 and finally the Apex.  They also came up with the Z-Lynk Wireless technology.  Needless to say, they do not lack Innovation!

If your looking for a great American company to represent, I’d look no farther than Garrett Electronics!

ps:  I know this is the White’s forum but didn’t know where else to put it so those that may need or want the information could get it.

Back around 2009 or 10, Fisher reintroduced the Gold Bug.  Then came the Pro model.  After that was the F-Series.  Other than their Pulse Pin Pointer, they haven’t released anything new in quite a while.

On 8/14/2020 at 7:22 PM, bigtim1973 said:

It will come down to what your coil goes over and sounds off on. Not if one vlf freq vs multi vlf freq is better than the other. I found using multi freq on an equinox would false quite a bit in iron contaminated trashy areas swinging the coil near the iron trash before canceling it out while swinging over the iron trash. 

In single freq mode the equinox I had would do better in iron infested sites. 

So with this being said....maybe try using just single frequency mode for a bit and see what happens. I would go ahead and dig all of those iron targets out anyway to see what is beneath them. 

If you missed a target while swinging over a spot in multi freq mode then switched to single frequency mode and actually swung over the target while going back over the same area.....how would you know what mode would be better??? 

There is no way to know for sure unless one was to grid off an area and dig every thing in that spot until you heard no more targets at all then change frequencies or put it in multi frequency and do the exact same thing to see if anything was left. 

I had similar problems in parks with the 6" coil.  Not so much with the 11".  I did run it in 10 kHz to see if I could duplicate the results I had with a borrowed Simplex.  They were similar.

I'm thinking of doing just that but was waiting for the grass to die.  Anybody else not water their grass in the summer to avoid a bigger water bill?  lol

Has any one tested the Makro Gold Kruzer against one or the other of the White's detectors listed in the topic?

Thanks!

Walt

5 hours ago, King-Of-Bling said:

Very interesting topic and I don't know if I'm off base here but will compare a MF against a PI on a beach. Granted , a PI is a completely different animal. What I do know is a MF can have great discrimination but in heavy black sand it can overload. Basically rendering it useless ! It won't work. Depth is also an issue. Under these same conditions , my PI can struggle as well. I may have to raise the coil 6" off the sand and go very slow. But it works ! Of course discrimination is an issue compared to a MF. A MF machine does not "reign supreme" on all beaches. In fact , it may not operate at all. What many don't realize is that we have different styles of hunting , which can change based on conditions. And that should be in direct correlation to what detector you choose for the job.

I used to like in Southern California.  A couple times we went down Beach Detecting after a storm.  You could see thick concentrations of Black Sand laying on the surface.  A SF VLF machine just wouldn’t work.  It would overload as soon as the coil got close to the ground. 

At that time, Minelab’s FBS and BBS technology (Explorer & Excalibur) was the only game in town.  That type of MF worked very well as did the PI’s like White’s Surfmaster, Garrett's Infinium LS and Sea Hunter.  If you didn’t have one of those, you didn’t hunt!  I’ve never tried anything like a Spectra or Equinox Series detector under those conditions.

1 hour ago, phrunt said:

Sounds like your yard just needs small coils, ideally small elliptical coils, I believe that would benefit you more than the frequency of the detector, multi frequency or not.   By noise now I see what you mean is the noise of targets in the ground.

Everyone's opinion maybe different but that is mine, I'm sure some of the more experienced people could express their opinions on the subject and they may differ to mine.

The 6" coil was even worse.  I had to lower the sensitivity down to 10.  Yes, that's what I was talking about.  All those marginal "Rusty" targets.  I once had a pipe cap read as a 50 cent piece.

Whether you believe your knowledgeable or not, I've enjoyed your input the short time I've been on the forum.

Interesting!  How well do they work?

3 hours ago, phrunt said:

In what was was the Simplex quieter than the Nox? this puzzles me as the Nox has so many ways to ensure it runs silent, you've got the noise cancel, along with all the modes and frequencies to choose from and it has manual ground balance, multi frequency which tends to handle bad ground better than single frequencies do and last but not least you can lower your sensitivity a touch,  a Nox with lower sensitivity still out performs my maxed out Teknetics T2 I believe.  I'm always confused when people say some single frequency detector runs quieter than a Nox as you can virtually emulate that detector on the Nox. 

Saying it found more treasure and trash means very little, that comes down to operator / location more than detector more often than not on a bulk of targets.

I'm yet to find a single frequency detector I'd use over my Nox.  I have tried hard.

My home was built in 1900.  My backyard is polluted with rusty iron in different sizes and stages of deterioration.  When iron becomes rusty, the metal detector no longer sees it as such.  So, Iron Mask and Discrimination can’t do their job.  It reads anywhere from foil to gold to silver. 

My thought and the reason for the thread in the first place is that I’m guessing that because it’s all over the VDI Spectrum, each frequency that excels on the numbers that they react to best, are seeing it (rusty iron) as targets.  As a result, all I’m getting is a lot of noise. 

I ran the single frequency Simplex and that noise was GREALTY reduced.  Having said that, I set my Equinox at 10 kHz only with far better results than Multi.

The whole point of Multi-Frequency is so that targets aren’t missed.  The biggest complaint I received from customers who purchased the 14kHz Whites MXT was that they weren’t finding any deep copper or silver coins.  However, I had a friend who declared that his MXT would spank his Minelab Explorer on gold rings every time.

So that brings me back to my original question, is there a “trade off” in performance between single frequency and multi?

6 hours ago, crow said:

What evidence is there that a MF loses depth in MF mode?

What do you mean by a MF machine will be 'noisier'?

I'm looking at getting a MF detector, currently have the Nokta Simplex but don't like it as there is too much chatter even with low sensitivity and ground balance.

The MF machines I'm looking at are the Minelab Vanquish 540, Minelab Equinox 600 or 800, or the new Garrett Ace Apex. There is unclear information about what frequencies they use then in multi-frequency mode, and what difference it makes. The Apex doesn't have 40khz for example. 

I recently took a Simplex for a test drive and it ran quieter then my Nox 800.  Found more treasure and less trash also. 

I have Apexes on order.*  I'll let you know what I link after I take one out a few times.  The highest frequency is 20.  I believe this is more of a Coin, Relic and Jewelry machine with no prospecting mode as it operates in Silent Search (no Threshold) only.

*  I talked to my Distributor and he couldn't tell me when the Apex will be released.  It keeps going back to the Field Testers who give suggestions.  Garrett tweaks the machines and sends them back out.  According to him, the AT Max's software was completely redesigned as a result of such.  Nice to know Garrett isn't going to sell something that's not ready for market.  They surely have and deserve my respect!