Chase Goldman

24 minutes ago, Gerry in Idaho said:

Zip-a-dee-doo-dah zip-a-dee-a.
My oh my, what a wonderful day.

 

https://youtu.be/zDePvXpYhzA?si=1hV5JYM9muHOwM8x

 

 

 

What’s that mean you ask?

 

Gerry is Happy….and most of you should be too.

 

Finally, we have a quality PI detector at an affordable price point.

 

Finally, we have a team of people working for AlgoForce that are listening to the consumer.

 

Finally, we have a PI detector without $500, $1000, $1500 coils, we get to use 100+ different coil options many of us already own.

 

Finally, we don’t have to pay $100, $150 and $200 for a spare battery.

 

Finally, we don’t have to buy brand specific headphones that are overpriced and not even durable for metal detecting needs.

 

Who wants to add some Zip-a-dee-doo-dah zip-a-dee-a? 

 

It’s going to be happy times for so many.

 

It's very promising, Gerry, I'll give you that, but strictly from a technical and performance standpoint.  However, as a pragmatist, I'll refrain from singing zippity-do-dah until it becomes widely available to USA users at the advertised AUS price point.  There are significant hurdles to that still need to be overcome and questions that need answering including inventory, supply chain, and distribution struggles, US regulator certifications, overseas demand and the ever present threat of potential litigation from industry intimidators (whether or not "they" have has a case is immaterial, USA distribution simply opens the door on this possibility (see Quest V60/80 series)), etc.  Until those hurdles are addressed and put aside, then it is basically a very promising unicorn with an uncertain arrival.  Better than the Nokta PI promises at this point, but as the Quest rollout demonstrated, USA distribution is not out of the woods.  Rooting for them, most definitely, but concerned whether they will be able to gain a stable foothold here in the US.  Once that happens, then sure, I'll sing a song.

9 hours ago, George Kinsey said:

No. The raffle started a war with organizer and the diggers. 

Uh oh.

George, did you win the 50-50 raffle?  

The connectors are also completely different between the Nox and Vanquish coils.

2 hours ago, Bill (S. CA) said:

Chase,

Really superb post.  I'm sure it took a lot of time to put together.

One aspect you mention about the Deus II is its "toe-heaviness" if such a work exists.  It is an amazing detector and I hope to own one someday.  However, every time one of my buddies loans me their Deus II to hunt with I can feel the upper forearm strain instantly.  They tell me you get used to it but in my limited experience with the detector it is surprising to me that such a lightweight machine still feels heavy because of the imbalance.  Any thoughts on this?

Also, while I'm commenting on your post, I have had occasion to use a Manticore for several beach hunts and to me it is a heavy detector.  To be very honest, my Legend is easily my favorite detector to swing in terms of balance and weight.  With the new lightweight shaft and arm cuff it is literally feather weight.

Bill

Bill, 

Thanks.

Regarding weight, balance of the Deus 2, let me provide some additional context and perspective on my "toe-heavy" comments.

First of all, setting balance aside, the Deus 2 platform, even with the 13" coil is still the lightest overall detector system out there vs. any other detector rocking a similar-sized coil.  Balance is an issue with the 13" coil, but the light overall weight and "S" handle shaft design mitigate those issues somewhat such that it becomes less noticeable as swing.  I can still swing the 13" XP coil all day.  Furthermore, if I add offsetting weight below the armrest by attaching a pinpointer to my shaft mounted pinpointer holder, I can improve balance.  For beach and water work, I use a dedicated SteveG CF carbon fiber shaft system designed for the Deus.  This system provides more adjustment for balance and optional accessories such as a balance weight and two different remote control mount designs which also help balance as well as also using a similer "S" handle design.  I like the SteveG mount for beach and water for a couple other reasons too - since the entire shaft is CF it can withstand repeated dunking and exposure to water and salt sea environments.  It also enables the waveguide needed to operate the XP coil submerged to be routed internal to the shaft to prevent wire snags and a cleaner looking install.   It can be retracted into a small profile and has the advantage, being a round shaft, to enable the coil to be oriented as needed.  However, the XP shaft system is slightly more compact overall, so I prefer using the XP shaft for field work where I have to lug my detector in with a day pack, etc.  See the extended Deus 2 with the SteveG shaft (and 11" coil), the XP Shaft and the 13" coil, and the Manticore with the M8 below.

Here are all my current detectors that see actual field work, fully extended, below.

Here they are, all compacted, below.  I snuck the XP Deus shaft with the OEM remote control mount (vs. the RC Digs cage mount) in there for comparison purposes.

In fact, if a detector manufacturer is not providing a system that enables the detector to be retracted for easier transport these days, then I think that puts them behind the power curve compared to today's detectors.  Even the Axiom can be compacted for daypack use (and comes with its own pack).

Above from top to bottom:

• Nokta Legend with the LG30
• Garrett Axiom with the 11x7 DD
• ML Manticore with the M8
• XP Deus 2 shaft and RC Digs cage with the 13" coil
• XP Deus 2 shaft and traditional RC mount with the 9" coil
• Steve G XP Deus shaft system with the RC Digs angled mount and 11" coil.

Regarding my "toe-heavy" comments when I started swinging the Deus 2 and 13" coil for the trek back to the vehicles, it was more pronounced and noticeable to me at first because I had been swinging the Manticore with its feather light M8 coil all day.  If I had been swinging the 11" coil on the Manticore all day, pulling the D2 out with the 13" coil would have been a whole different experience.  The imbalance of the XP D2 with the 13" coil is something you do get used to only because of the light overall weight and less torsion on the wrist during swinging with the "S" handle stem.  It's a non-issue with the 9" coil and even the 11" coil.

3 hours ago, strick said:

Nice write up. Are you using version 1 or 2? I finally got my hands on a M8 coil yesterday so I'll be trying it out soon....I've not up dated my M-Core as of yet unless someone can convince me otherwise..

strick

I'm on Ver 2.0 on the Deus 2, and the latest release for the M-Core.

It's all anecdotal because it is not documented in the release notes, but both Bob and I have run some comparisons and our general perception is that although the ver 2.0 update of the Deus 2 only explicitly mentioned increasing Goldfield small gold sensitivity and compatibility with the Xtreme Hunter two-box coil, it appears that Goldfield's cousin, Relic Mode was also enhanced and overall TID stability seems even more rock solid and repeatable than in previous iterations.

7 minutes ago, F350Platinum said:

At first I thought the M-core was making you dig more than you wanted to, but the good stuff was a surprise, we both had "find-a-minute" going in that spot. 

Yeah.  I was mostly digging keepers, just that other than the cufflink and the silver plated taco button, there were no real stunner finds for me.  The dug junk was really no different than what we would dig with the Deus 2.  It is great to be in dig a minute mode with those targets.

2 hours ago, Skull diver said:

Regarding the Manticore, I am still strongly accustomed to the Ctx with which I really did record numbers in the past.
The dividing line of the nonferrous really echoes the discrimination pattern of the Ctx, and for now I would rule out buying it because of the limited depth at which to dive it.

Well, the Manticore is rated to 5 meters vs. 3 meters for the CTX.  But neither of those is 20 meters like the Deus 2 or 60+ meters like the Excalibur II.

Have you 

Just now, Skull diver said:

@JCR @EL NINO77

This is what happened today.

I started the session with D2 in a promising area.

About two hours and two medium-sized rings (both under 5 grams).

Tool change and back in the water with the Excalibur.

After two minutes I dig out the third snake-shaped ring, perhaps the thinnest and lightest of the three.

This is overwhelming evidence that a screen and an ID, can make a difference if they respond correctly to the object, but as long as you dig outside the range of interest, you lose useful time for other targets.

I fear I will soon have to fall back on yet another detector and the choice is really narrow.

Have you tried the X-Y display on Deus or the possibly the 2-D display on Manticore?

On 2/11/2024 at 12:58 PM, Skull diver said:

The problem is that it is a mass the size of a washing machine.

I have no words.

I understand the frustration regarding TID scaling in general, and the specifics of the Deus/Deus 2 scaling which indeed compresses the high end of the TID scale (high conductors) while giving a huge range on mid-conductive targets from 20 through 80.  However, this example, which is valid, is also a great reminder that a detectorist should not rely solely on TID to make a decision.  Large steel targets do indeed ring up high, as well as large aluminum targets.  As far as these large targets are concerned, pitch audio or pinpoint help to readily unmask their true nature through elongated audio or huge pinpoint mode footprints so they can be readily bypassed if looking for jewelry or coin-sized targets.  Furthermore, as Jeff McClendon pointed out, target audio quality or purity is also a great "discriminator" between round or symmetric targets vs. junk, irregular targets that sound more distorted.  Of course, damaged jewelry and coins, and non-continuous precious metal loops such as broken rings or earrings can also affect this outcome in both audio and target ID indications.   

It all comes down to the fact that no TID scaling option is necessarily going to be universally acceptable to all detectorists because target objectives vary.  Enabling some end-user customization of TID scaling, as JCR suggested, in certain "regions" of the scale depending on the detectorists needs would be a welcome feature addition.

In the absence of such a feature, and to be frank, no TID scaling scheme is going to be "perfect" regardless how much customization is allowed, then the detectorist who has neither the luxury nor will to "dig it all" will have to "play the odds" as they have had to do forever.  They will need weigh for themselves whether that 80 TID is worth chasing based on the classic risk/reward assessment that accounts for the likelihood of occurrence and the return on "investment" should you chose to chase the targets at either TID extreme.  Is the occasional honker that rings up 80 WORTH digging up thousands of junk or low value coin targets, or is your time best spent simply recovering the bulk of the valuable targets that fall in a narrow range of TIDs, than wasting time on digging potential "white whales".  The math is really not all that hard once you have a sufficient data to understand how valued targets are distributed across the range.  As a "professional" it makes sense to do this kind of data assessment in addition to the hard physical work of dive recovery to make your recovery efforts as efficient and lucrative as possible.

1 hour ago, DSMITH said:

I have tried several times to register on his forum and every time it looks like everything is set up so I can venture into that forum it will not allow me to even log in, I just signed u again recently and it still will not let me log in

Did you receive the activation email?  You can't log on until you activate your account following registration by clicking on the activation link in the email.

1 hour ago, EL NINO77 said:

Also, still...I can't log in..with my password..on the new.. Dankowski forum..

You have to first re-register and then after you have completed re-registration and verification you are not a bot, Activate using the activation link in the email sent to the address you used to register.

Worked just fine for me.

I ventured over there for specific topics but the user community issues coupled with the eye watering layout meant that I had to REALLY be motivated to go there because whatever information I was seeking out was unavailable elsewhere (a rare occurrence).  I re-registered to ensure access to the archived information.

21 minutes ago, HardPack said:

Any British Naval or Royal Marines officers posted in the area. On the hand guards I’m guessing Neptune, trident and seal. Either way, I’d have to start detecting old Spanish Missions after dark to find that kind of history. Thanks for the post,

Many of the Colonists who lived in the area served in various branches of the British military (e.g., George Washington served as a young Britsh Army officer and travelled extensively doing land surveys for England).  So there are some opportunities to recover pre-revolutionary Royal Military uniform accoutrements from Colonial period house sites lost by occupants who were British military veterans, even if a military detachment was not posted in the area or any wartime action occurred.  There was limited War of 1812 military activity in the vicinity and we've recovered verified uniform parts from that era (though not at this particular site and the button Bob recovered seems to be much older than that perod).  And finally, we occasionally recover CW military relics although practically no notable CW activity occurred in the area, and these too, were likely lost by locals who were former CW veterans who returned with their military uniforms, equipment, and firearms.

1 hour ago, rvpopeye said:

Another nice sandbox hunt !👍

🥸 I think I saw a pocket knife on the right side of the junk pic ?

Yep.  You saw that correctly.  We're both getting a less selective as to what ends up in the trash/recycling scrap bucket these days based on the older relics these sites are producing: 19th and 20th century common household stuff (other than precious metal items, coins and jewelry and certain identifiable antique brass items such as thimbles), some brass horse tack stuff, and even old, fired musket balls are going to occasionally end up there, as well.

Had a blast as usual, Bob.  That old, likely-British military regimental button was amazing to see first hand and the depiction detail in that sword or dagger cross-guard is just amazing and just plain interesting and puzzling to contemplate its purpose.

I'm putting together a separate finds thread for this hunt because, spoiler alert, I pulled out the Manticore for it's maiden voyage in the Relic fields this time out instead of solely using my trusty, tried, and true Deus 2 <gasp>.  So stand by for my first take on Manticore as a relic machine, coming up soon.

14 hours ago, phrunt said:

Nope, not a typo 🙂 Look at this beauty.

So blatantly fake, then.  I know power bank suppliers do a lot of embellishing on mAh numbers but this is ridiculous.  But I guess they get plenty of suckers to fall for this baloney without any consequences to the supplier, so why not.  Same deal on the ridiculous storage capacity claims on counterfeit/fake memory cards.  Although unlike memory card fakes, proving the bogus mAh claims are false are difficult for the average consumer to prove.  Just ridiculous.  SMH.

As far as power banks go, I like Anker and Ugreen products as a good balance of decent cost, performance to claims, features, and quality hardware.  When dealing with power banks exposed to the elements, built-in protective features are very important to ensure you don't end up with a flamethrower under your elbow.  LiIon tech is very unforgiving when not handled properly.

On 2/2/2024 at 3:16 PM, ColonelDan said:

I’m getting a second one for my other Deus II that I use for water hunting with antenna easily installed in the digs mount as soon as they’re available. 

Dan - Is this a special configuration regarding the "easily installed" antenna or are you just saying by having a second dedicated water rig, the antenna just stays installed so it's easier to deal with.

5 hours ago, phrunt said:

Yes, that's true, a lot of the ones coming out of the Chinese marketplaces like Aliexpress say they're 500,000 mAH so would last a week to a month on your Algoforce yet they'll go flat in less than a day 🙂  It's best to stick to the reputable brand names, that's why I went Belkin, I trust their products.  Most computer retailers or mobile phone type stores should sell good quality brand name ones.   

An example of a fake rated one from Aliexpress

14 USD for one that claims 100000mAH 😛 That'd run the detector for months..... or about 3 hours.

Definite typo - I have a similar clone one to that and it's 10000mAH

1 hour ago, Voyager32 said:

I wish there was a product that locked the WS6 master to the shaft, mine has come off a few times, put a short leash on it but still its a poor design, has anyone found an aftermarket solution.

34 minutes ago, F350Platinum said:

Others zip tie the WS6 to the shaft, like around there are posts.

Here's an example of the zip tie approach that F350 mentioned.  This poster is using a modified Anderson XP mount attached to a Nokta Simplex shaft system, but the principle applies to other approaches using the XP WS6 standalone mount, as well.  Just got to use a little imagination.

13 hours ago, steveg said:

fishn...

Minelab will let you know for sure, but unless something has changed, the repair shop was in Pennsylvania.  That said, it's also possible that they may have you ship to Illinois for machines or accessories that can't be repaired (i.e. items that are simply replaced), while machines that are actually worked on/repaired are still sent to PA. 

Bottom line -- I'm not sure on the current state of affairs; I only know that at least for quite awhile in the recent past, Minelab's official "repair center" was in Pennsylvania.

Steve

Steve - all that changed last month.  The Pennsylvania repair center is no longer affiliated with or authorized to do US in-warranty repairs on ML detectors due to a ML Corporate decision.  The Pennsylvania facility is now an independent repair center and will do post-warranty repair work on ML gear, if requested.  US In-Warranty repair autorization is handled now by the ML Illinois factory repair center and you ship your gear to them directly.

Here is a thread that addresses this recent change.

36 minutes ago, F350Platinum said:

Heh, I was hoping you would, I don't have engineering or scientific experience, I just made compudahs work all my career. 🤣 With detectors I just go by "muh feelz".

This was probably not a great attempt to illustrate my epiphany regarding using the Deus the way it was intended, not by bashing it into another mold. I appreciate the additional info. 👍

You did great.  Those two pseudo All Metal modes are strange in the way they behave and process target signals.  Those who don't have a Deus or who do but have not experimented with those modes are probably lost with either explanation.  It's something you have to use to appreciate but it can also be a little overwhelming unless you have options to tame it (e.g., Notch 00, IAR, Max FMF Frequency, High Square audio, and periodic ground grabs).  I just like Relic's reactivity to what's in the ground.  I use other modes for interrogating targets or for cherry picking.  But if I use them for general searching instead of Relic, I feel like I'm operating a little partially blind to what might be under the coil and, like you, I like how non-ferrous audibly pops out at you when in thick iron.  And you can't argue with the results.

Great hunt my friend.  Congrats on yet another Spanish silver.  It was a joy to get out even though I got to the field 2 hours later than planned.  Nevertheless I was happy with my finds in quality, quantity, and variety, though I did break my silver streak.  Oh well.  I didn't exactly sob uncontrollably on my 2 hour trek home.  Glad you are really liking Relic, Bob and tweaking it to suit your detecting style.   It's easy to like it seeing how successful you have been with it of late.  You're killing it!

Anyway, I hope you don't mind me injecting some additional detector tech nerd commentary and clarifications on D2's Relic mode based on my experience using Relic almost exclusively for more than a year and loving it even more since the Deus 2 Version 2.0 update was released.  Though the update only officially addressed improvements to the Goldfield program processing and sensitivity to small gold, I have noticed what seems to be greater TID stability on all programs and greater sensitivity with  Relic, as well.

19 hours ago, F350Platinum said:

I use Relic relatively unmodified, the main thing is to set one notch at 00-00, which essentially will make iron blank out. You cannot set discrimination in Relic, but you can crank Disc IAR to 5 which forces most iron to blank.

First some context - Relic and Golfield's lack of discrimination that is otherwise present on all the other stock programs also means that those two programs lack the ability to process and display negative TIDs. 

Notching 00 will blank weak, small iron and ferrous mineralization related ground noise not cancelled by ground grab that occasionally show up as TID 0.  But not all iron is TID 0, so notch 00 does not blank all iron.  Also, for some strange reason, TID 0 is audibly heard as pitch vs. Iron audio, which is very confusing, so 00 notch gets rid of that anomaly as well.  If you run with a reference threshold, anything detected that is notched out will blank the threshold.

Iron Amplitude Rejection (IAR), the Relic/Goldfield form of discrimination despite its name  doesn't actually blank or reject iron, per se.  It works more like an iron bias, suppressing the tendency of small and/or large iron (depending on the IAR level applied) to false outright or false off the edge of the coil.  If it detects iron, it processes and displays a corresponding ferrous ID and iron audio for anything below TID about 10 (not adjustable).  Increasing IAR has no impact on the breakpoint TID that results in iron audio being applied. I run with an aggressive IAR of 5 in mild soil as even deep non-ferrous tends not to indicate ferrous at the edge of detection.  In hotter soils I back off on IAR.  In the hottest of soils, I back all the way off IAR to 0 because IAR will aggressively break up any target signal in such ground.

IAR is far from foolproof.  I haven't actually observed it provide a false positive signal on a non-ferrous target (I periodically dig high probability ferrous targets just to make sure the detector is not fooling me).  As Bob mentioned, IAR does get consistently fooled by certain common ferrous targets including: big, deep flat iron; iron hooks and bent nails; and by iron rings and nut fasteners.  There are telltale clues to ferret out falsing:  typically falsing is also accompanied by a simultaneous ferrous grunt and corresponding simultaneous indications of a ferrous and non-ferrous target on the horseshoe display, falsing often manifests as TID 85 or occaisonally TID 75 that devolves into single digit ferrous IDs when you turn on the target.  If you can isolate and turn on the target and maintain the non-ferrous ID, there's a good chance the target is non-ferrous or there are co-located ferrous and non-ferrous targets.  If you are digging a deep hole and getting a progressively strong pinpointer response indicating a large target, you are probably digging to iron.  My Nokta discriminating pinpointer helps to keep me from having to completely extract many of these big pieces of leverite.

7 hours ago, F350Platinum said:

Thanks Mark,

I often wonder whether a PI would make any difference here, but we've tried the Axiom, and while it is awesome it's still pretty much a dig it all proposition. Like the D2 it's not perfect on iron.

In the mild, sandy soil of the Northern Neck, there is little if any depth advantage to be gained by going with a PI unless the coil size available to you is much greater than the maximum coil size for the preferred vlf detector.  Regarding "dig it all", yes that pretty much applies, but the Axiom "on demand" ferrous check should work better at greater depths than would be expected in a hot dirt location.  But if PI is not really detecting much deeper than the D2, in mild soil, there is no compelling reason to fly partially blind by running the Axiom vice the D2 in the mild soils.

Anyway, I still need to clean up and examine my finds closer but here's a look at my keepers.  Many of which were plucked out of machine gun iron while running IAR at 5.  No silver this time out for me other than a hint of some silver plating on one of the brass items.  But I did manage an IHP, several buttons,  a thimble as well as several fancy colonial buckle pieces and saddle adornments.  And a rarity for this neck of the woods, a fired CW era minie ball.  On the way back to my vehicle I got a sweet 93 and thought my silver streak was going to be saved.  Turned out to be a '65 clad quarter.  Couldn't even eek out a '64 to save me.  SMH. 

Thanks again for the opportunity to dig with ya, Bob.  It was yet another killer outing.

2 hours ago, detector said:

can this detector detect great quantity of Gold dust (1kg for example)

Probably not.  It’s designed for large, deep contiguous cache’s of metal. Preferably high conductors.  It would be harder for it to detect metal caches where the individual items are not fused together.  Gold alloy’s would also be harder for it because gold conductivity drops significantly when alloyed with other metals and impurities.  Furthermore, this type of target would never occur naturally, so it would be in some sort of container, correct.  Unless that container is non-metallic, you would probably be more likely to detect the container rather than the contents.

The types of questions you keep asking the forum revolve around non-natural targets, very deep buried caches, perhaps under rock, perhaps in non- metallic containers etc that push beyond the technical limits of the consumer grade detectors you keep asking about, including even the XP Xtreme hunter.  You would probably be much better off investing in professional industrial/archeological equipment like ground penetrating radar that can reveal subterranean voids rather than consumer metal detectors for whatever it is you are trying to find.  Just a suggestion.

So it looks like Breeze Airlines is restricting recreational items that contain LiIon Batteries above and beyond the TSA restrictions which is certainly within their right to do so to further limit the hazard risk this technology presents to just personal electronics like phones, headphones, tablets, and laptops.  Anyway, without knowing what detector rental models or rates will be available to you in the immediate area you are visiting, I can't advise you on that.  I've never rented a detector and would be most comfortable with one that I was already familiar with.  Another option to consider would be to arrange to ship your detector to your destination in advance and then ship it back home at the end of your trip.  It might be more cost effective than renting and you'll have the detector you know you'll like.  HTH.

25 minutes ago, DigInTheSand said:

Hello - I have a Minelab Eq800 which uses a sealed lithium-ion battery.  As far as I know, having checked TSA and FAA websites, a Li-ion battery cannot exceed 100 watts if you are travelling by plane.  Q: can you please tell me how many watts this battery is?  TSA is also vague about even flying with one that is less than 100 watts and says one should check the airline's website.  Q: what do you do when there are restrictions like this?  When flying to France, I was able to take my Vanquish 540, but that uses AA batteries and I would really prefer to use the EQ800.  I would really appreciate any suggestions about flying with metal detectors and how you deal with the security issues.  Thanks a lot, Jane

Jane -

First a carification.  The battery parameter the FAA/TSA is concerned about is actually "Watt-Hours" or "W-H" which is a measure of the energy stored in the battery and the potential for how much "fuel" is available to feed a fire vesus "Watts" which is a measure of the maximum product of volts times current that a battery can supply at any instant in time.

The Nox 800 uses a battery rated at 3.7 v at 5000mAH which is equivalent to 18.5 W-H which is well below the 100 W-H limit. 

More info in my post linked below regarding requirements for checked baggage vs. a carry on bag etc.