Jim in Idaho

I had no idea that the TDI had that. The threshold on mine rises as the battery voltage declines, so I have to keep turning it down. But, it's relatively flat other than that. Just never thought about it. Also, the ad I swa for the new Whites TDI showed, and said, it had an 8 x14 DF. Apparently that ad was wrong. Jim

What is the "Auto-tune" Mode, Steve? Never heard of that. Jim

They said the problem was "off site". I assume that means the server they were connected to, or one farther down the line, puked. All the data on Whites was saved. Jim

Bear in mind, Chuck, that the electronics cost is really low. I doubt the components cost Whites more than $100. All you have left is the box, shaft, and labor. The real cost is in the engineering. I imagine they're still making money at the new price, even including the coils. Also, where are you getting your info on how many tan machines have sold? They obviously sold enough to run out of the MJFM coils. Jim

Came up an hour or so ago. http://forums.whiteselectronics.com/ Jim

I'd be really surprised if that coil isn't offered for sale at some point. Jim

Can't upgrade the TDI's via software, like the 'Nox. I don't think they've ever offered changes to the circuitry. Jim

The term 'Q' is an electronics thing. I have some background in that, but that said, I don't have full understanding. I do know you can increase the 'Q' of a coil, which is a good, thing, by increasing the number of turns in the windings. But coming up with a new coil for an existing detector requires all the coil values to match the older coils. So, requires some engineering to get it right. Inductance, DC resistance, etc. IMHO I can't see Whites claiming higher "Q" value if it didn't exist. That would make them outright crooks. I just don't believe that. Without one of the coils to disect, there's no way to know for sure. I imagine we'll find out, in due course. So, to take my mind off detectors, I'm heading for Yellowstone Park Sunday to get in a few days of late season fly fishing for spawning browns. Yee Haa! Jim

Well, they've never before made a DF as an elliptical, nor have they ever had a 14" DF. It's also possible they have modified this particular coil in some way. The thing that bothers me about all this, and I'm not backing Whites here, is why is the "tone" of threads about Whites always so negative? Minelab screws up and everybody makes excuses for them...like leaking, and wobbly shafts, etc. But Whites are jumped on for every little thing. That patent is from 2009....still has almost 10 years to run. The idea was good enough that Reg Sniff came up with the folded mono to try and get around it. Lets give Whites a little credit. And their latest patent is from 2018, though on a different idea. They're still coming up with new ideas.That 2018 patent is for an auto-nulling circuit to improve the balance between the transmit and receive coils in VLF's. I have no idea, but it may be in use in the GM24K. Jim

The patent number is US7994789B1. Look it up on Google Patents. Jim

Don't think so. Whites ad says it is a Dual Field coil. They also say it's patented. The Folded coil idea can't be patented...it's in the public domain. Whites has the patent on the Dual Field design. Jim

Chuck, I have a buddy in Florida who is a tech for the Navy. His wife bought him one of the tan Special Edition models back in June. He took it apart and found that it had the diode mod done to it, but not the SS mod. It was made in 2018. Jim

I know, for a fact, that Whites changed the TDI SL. Probably in 2015, but for sure the Special Edition. They removed C56, and the diodes D20 and D21, and installed a jumper across two of D21's 3 contact locations. I've done the same to my old 2013 unit. They did NOT do the sweep speed mod, which entails changing capacitors C20, and C21, unless they've just started doing that. They hadn't done the SS mod on the 2018 Special Edition. The SS mod mainly benefits nugget hunters. The C56 mod increases the overall sensitivity. Jim

For my NF Sadie coil, I just installed shims. Works fine. Made them sort of longish, so they can't rotate. Jim

They like having control over the content, Steve. They don't allow any posts that might make Whites look anything less than perfect...LOL Jim

You don't need, or want to use, the wireless module if you're using the Minelab headphones. If that is turned on the Nox will not search for the minelab headphones. As soon as it sees that wireless module is "on" it stops searching for the ML phones. The wireless connection with the factory headphones is internal in the detector. The wireless module is for use with other brands, or types of headphones, apparently. Jim

Yeah, Steve, it's been down for a few days. They can't seem to keep it running for more than a few months at a time. Must have been another major crash. I hope this time they had the posts backed-up. Last time, they lost everything. Jim

hahahahahahahaha J

LOL....I'm sticking with my original thought that it is a Dual Field coil. But, you can increase the Q factor of a coil by increasing the number of turns in the windings. Increasing the number of turns will also increase the resistance of the coil, however. Maybe Whites came up with a way to increase the Q, without increasing the resistance. Thus a "Hi-Q" coil. Generally, the higher the Q, the more sensitive the coil. Maybe one way to accomplish this would be two coils in the same housing, that are paralleled electrically. In a typical dual field coil, the large and small coils are in series. Maybe the new coil has 4 windings...in a series/parallel configuration? Jim Maybe Whites has come up with a way to increase the number of windings without increasing the overall resistance of the windings.

I saw an ad, by Whites, that said the coil is an 8 x 14 Dual Field. Whites has the patent on the Dual Field. They also said on another ad that the coil was patented. It can't be a Folded Mono because that design is not patented...it's in the public domain. I'd like to get the 8 x 14 DF, to do a test between it and the 8 x 12 MJ FM. I'm thinking that 8 x 14 might give some added depth, but who knows? Jim

I'm sure Whites will start selling them, once they've milked the market on the detector package deal. It would have to be much better before I'd spend $250 on one. I already got lucky a month ago, and found a new MJ 8 x 12 for $150, shipped. Seriously good coil, too. Jim

Turns out that Reg Sniff publicized the idea on Geotech. Once it was publicized it can't be patented. So anybody can make and sell them. Jim

So, they're just making their own version of the Folded Mono. Interesting. I don't think the Folded idea was ever patented. I'll have to check on that. Or maybe it was and Miner John licensed Whites to make their own, or have another coil maker build them for Whites. Thanks for the info. Jim

Good Luck, Chuck...LOL I'm not holding my breath. Jim

I searched Google Patents, and the last patent issued to Whites, that I could find, was dated July of '18, and had to do with a new automatic induction balance system for coils on IB detectors. I don't think it would pertain to PI's. I'm still betting it's a DF. If it's better than the MJ, it's going to be good. Jim