Steve Herschbach

We do not seem to be getting the same level of failure with the Racer 2. The fact the machines work and then later fail points to a weak component, but then the failures seem to have no clear pattern. High frequency units require higher tolerance components and maybe that explains why it seems the Gold Racer has more issues. Or is it just that we hear about failures more and people with good running units say nothing? I don't know, but NokMak needs to get a handle on it quick. I really like my Gold Racer but right now if a person were looking for a mission critical unit the Gold Bug 2 and GMT appear to be safer alternatives. Both are super proven, and relatively bulletproof.

The only thing that matters is competition. For any Minelab model that is deficient in some way there has to be a credible alternative that addresses the areas where Minelab comes up short. I am less frustrated with Minelab than with the competition. It honestly seems that Minelab competes more with themselves than anyone else at times. Everyone else seems to be focused on the $250 - $700 end of the market while Minelab is left alone in the market for truly high end product. Funny you mention the SDC 2300 batteries as on just our last outing I saw Chris Ralph fiddling with those springs again trying to get a better connection. I try to tell him to just get an ATX or TDI but for some reason he just ignores me! Seriously, where is the First Texas pulse induction machine? Where is the Garrett multi frequency machine? Where is White's alternative to the GPZ? Why is it that in order to get something better than what Minelab already makes we have to wait for the next Minelab?

Old article but every bit as good today as the day it was written. There is a good follow up by Reg at Link deleted since Findmall Forum update broke all old links

Meet The Metal Detectives - Inside Engineering at Minelab Electronics A new video showing Minelabs new engineering facility and meeting some of the people that work there. Check out the blurred portions obscuring secret product developments! Amazing engineering staff at Minelab - I consider myself fortunate to have communicated with and even met a few of the people that work there. A few more details about the making of the video at Minelab's Treasure Talk Blog

It is all relative. After using the sealed lead acid dome top battery on the SD and GP models the GPX battery was a huge step in the right direction. Lighter weight, nearly two days running on a charge, what is still the best amp built in, you can actually tell when it is fully charged, and no worries about overcharging. All qualities the earlier batteries lacked.

You can find horror stories about every brand. Garrett actually has a very good reputation for service. You can't argue with success and the AT Pro right now has legions of happy users. There is a reason every competitor would love to get a piece of that action. White's gave it their shot. I am waiting to see what First Texas and Minelab come up with in the waterproof to 10 feet under $1000 category. NokMak would have a worthy competitor if they stuffed their circuit in a waterproof housing but one of the hardest and most expensive propositions is getting the right housing design. So I doubt we see anything from the Turks in that regard any time soon.

My only comment is that the stock GPX battery is one of the best things going about the machine. I had spares but the reality is as long as I had the ability to charge nightly I just never needed anything but the battery that came with the detector. So much so that were I to get another GPX I would not spend the money on getting a spare.

Lead or aluminum make good gold substitutes, but I have never heard anyone suggest that it would be by equivalent weight. Obviously a piece of gold and a piece of aluminum of the same weight would be different sizes. The idea would be to forget weight and simply use similar size objects. Even then only for rough comparison I can assure you when testing nuggets no two are exactly alike anyway. Two nuggets of exactly the same weight can have dramatically different results based on purity and shape.

Well, after swinging a GPZ all day there is no Deus configuration that would seem heavy to me. A coil prototype I tested for a major manufacturer not so long ago had clearly been made with a 3D printer. You are right - amazing stuff these days.

This patent has been updated and new patent US 9,285,496 B1 granted March 15, 2016 TRUNCATED HALF-SINE METHODS FOR METAL DETECTORS Carl Moreland, Corvallis, OR (US) Assigned to White's Electronics, Inc., Sweet Home, OR (US) Abstract This invention relates to a metal detector where a coil is used to transmit a periodic magnetic field to energize metal objects that are concealed and often buried or hidden in a matrix (ground) containing ferromagnetic minerals. There are many difficult and often simultaneous challenges, such as detecting large deep targets, detecting minutely small targets, identifying target properties, ignoring the ferromagnetic matrix, avoiding a net magnetic field which can trigger magnetic sensors in land mines, and ignoring conductive salt responses. Either time-domain or frequency domain methods have been used to address these challenges with mixed levels of success. The ability to simultaneously use time-domain and frequency-domain methods can expand detection capability. Techniques are presented for achieving these goals. moreland-half-sine-patent.pdf

Racer 2 and MX Sport are both recent, though nothing new I think in the sense you mean it. I have been waiting on both First Texas and White's to deliver something really new this year, but maybe now we are looking at next year? We should at least have the Nokta Impact before end of year and the Deus V4 update. Other than that I am not holding my breath.

Excellent Rick, thank you for that feedback! I will round up the GM rod soon - any tips on where to buy? I have an arm strap for my Deus also. No point in leaving it on the rod where it might get beat up.

The last TDI SL that I had I tested against a Gold Bug Pro, X-Terra 705, and MXT. All those units could do as well as the TDI SL in medium mineralized ground when operated in their respective all metal prospect modes. The SPP that I got recently is as you know just a stripped down TDI SL and similar testing against VLF machines at Rye Patch had the same result. My conclusion was that the sole reason to own a TDI SL or SPP would be to handle extreme ground or hot rocks that those machines could not handle. Lacking those conditions a good VLF would be my preference. You could say the same about the Garrett Infinium, but in its case at least it was waterproof and so found its niche more as a beach machine than a prospecting machine. I am sure what most people hoped when White's made the TDI was that it would result in a progression of more powerful detectors that would end up giving Minelab a serious run for the money. Instead White's dumbed down the machine to make it lighter and more affordable. Who knew that for all intents and purposes the original TDI was going to be as good as it got? Not I, that's for sure.

Have you ever tried reversing the coil so it aims back towards you shifting the center of gravity back? It looks funny but might be worth a try. Same story. I have the Deus with 11" coil and controller plus WS5 headphones. When the new coil arrives I will mount it on its own rod and so will in effect have two complete detectors. I am thinking the Golden Mask rod assembly might be just the ticket for the new coil and prospecting.

It is hard to say. They are brilliant folks at XP and as long as the controller was designed to manipulate all the possible parameters in an operational metal detector no reason it should go obsolete per se. The software updates are rewrites of the controller software. And there already are several types of controller available. However, at some point I would expect they release a new controller just to have something else to sell. Maybe one with a color screen?

Apparently my post is being read as critical of XP or their pricing in some way and I did not intend it as such. I never said anything about the pricing being too high or too low. I admire the company and the business model and think the Deus is a ground breaking design in many ways. I have a Deus and am one of the first guys in line waiting for the V4 update.

I guess I am missing the connection since the Minelab coils are just coils. I was using the AT Pro comparison to illustrate that each Deus coil is a metal detector less rod and control interface.

That's true. The prices they charge for coils is absurd. I am not sure what that has to do with XP and the Deus though.

Great post John, lots of info there. I can only comment that I have handled quite a few TDI SL detectors and I do not recall any losing depth with ground balance shut off. It is possible that your machine has an issue there so maybe have somebody else who has one do check the two modes and see what happens. And hopefully report. But in all honesty that was not something I examined a lot as I always used GB on so I could be wrong. If ground is mild enough to run GB off than a good VLF in all metal mode will do as well as the TDI SL and weigh less plus have discrimination available as an option. Hot rocks are the TDI's main reason for existing when it comes to prospecting. Otherwise your MXT makes as much or more sense. In my opinion at least

Coils have to be designed for specific frequencies and multiples of the main frequency. The current Deus frequencies are specific to the existing coils, not the firmware. It requires a new coil to get a different frequency set. The old coils will continue to run at the old frequencies, and the new coil will only run at the new frequency set. I always chuckle over the Deus and the brilliance of the business model. Company A makes a $1200 detector that consists of $1000 worth of rod, box, and electronics and a $200 coil. You can buy accessory coils for $200. You only pay once for the circuit board and batteries. The coils are just dumb coils. With XP the coil is the detector, and the controller just that - a controller. So you basically buy a $600 controller and rod along with a $600 detector (coil). Now, every time you want an accessory coil you actually buy another $600 detector. Each coil you buy the circuit board and battery over and over again. With the Deus XP has figured out a way to sell people two or even three of what is basically the same $600 metal detector. Every time you think you are buying a Deus coil XP is actually making another detector sale. That is why the "update" is taking so long. XP is not designing a new coil, they are designing a new metal detector. Then they have to upgrade the controllers to be able to work with the old detectors (coils) and the new detector (coil). Then there is the Deepseeker attachment, yet another new detector, and making the controller work with it also. XP charges for each coil (detector) roughly what you would pay to buy an entire Garrett AT Pro. The profit margins have to be astounding. I am a marketing geek of sorts and I stand in awe of what XP is doing.

Good things come to those who wait! Latest rumor is September coinciding with an XP rally in Europe.

XP had the original model Deus in 2009, followed by four updates and another coming this year. 2.0 added features 3.0 added features 3.1 fixed 3.0 3.2 fixed 3.1 4.0 pending Details and links: XP DEUS (2009) V 2.0 (2011) http://www.xpmetaldetectors.com/xpforum/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=72 The behavior of your DEUS remains identical but new functions are added: 4 Non-Motion modes: - PINPOINT - NON MOTION DISC with ACCEPT/REJECT meter - NON MOTION AUDIO DISC with ACCEPT/REJECT meter and audio discrimination - NON MOTION ALL METAL These Non motion modes are useful for example to locate cache inside houses, cellars. For conventional searching on fields Motion programmes are better. On the main menu: - Ground mineralization meter added - Signal strength meter featuring Accept/Reject indicator added Audio Response > Expert - Audio overload menu, to choose an overload sound when a target is close to the coil Program 7 WET BEACH > Deeper on wet areas Program 8 becomes DRY BEACH > Suitable for dry sand. V 3.0 (2013) http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/deus/360409-xp-deus-version-3-now-ready-downloding.html The highlights of the new version include: 01 – New Program N°10 – Gold Field – Gold Prospecting/Nugget Shooting 02 – Better Target Separation And Depth 03 – Finest Adjustment Of Ground Effect 04 – Now 10 Factory Programs + 8 User Programs That You Can Save 05 – Silencer More Efficient 06 – Stronger Audio Response 07 – Two New Audio Modes – 5 Tones and Full Tones 08 – Pitch Mode Adjustable 09 – Id Norm 10 – Non Motion Improved and Easier V 3.1 (2013) http://www.xpmetaldetectors.com/blog-detection/en/update-deus/update-deus-3-1/ – The ground balance adjustment in non-motion mode is faster (the increment or decrement of the setting was a little slow). – The display of the mineralization strength from the main menu has been adjusted. The scale is now more representative of the mineralization level. – The display of the frequencies (4/8/12/18 kHz) on the headphone has been fixed (Previously, in some cases the headphone could display a different frequency while the real frequency was 4 kHz). – The audio volume of the headphone is now saved when you turn the unit off. – The beach mode (GB > BEACH YES) had a malfunction when changing the GB value, it is now fixed. – The SILENCER (REACTIVITY > EXPERT) is adjusted so as to follow the value of the version 2.0 in the factory programs using REACTIVITY 0, 1 or 2. V 3.2 (2013) http://www.xpmetaldetectors.com/blog-detection/en/update-deus/update-deus-3-2/ V3.2 will correct slow mineralization strength reading and also battery charge lever issues that were seen on some V3.1 units, also the Notch Ground function is now off by default. V 4.0 (2017) http://www.xpmetaldetectors.com/metal-detector/deus-update/ The new software version V4 will add include the following: A major reason for V4.0 will be to allow for use of a new 9" round plus 9.5" x 5" elliptical coil running at one of four new frequencies 14, 30, 55, or 80 khz. There is also a new wireless pinpointer for use with the system. • Reactivity 2.5, this new reactivity level is fast and deep, offering a good compromise especially when searching new terrain. • Program No10 GOLD FIELD : Improved Audio Response and reactivity. Goldfield will give excellent results especially when combined with the new HF coils…Now difficult targets can easily be detected in mineralized ground. The Tone menu has been removed. • Lower discrimination range : For those who want more control over ferrous targets. Negative discrimination of 0 to -6.4 makes it possible to locate previously rejected ferrous items, the lower discrimination range can also enhance the signature from deep targets which may have in the past been ignored. These new options also offer a big advantage when searching for specific targets such as ceramics or even meteorites. • Ground Effects: Improved Tracking. • Improved display and signal processing compatible with the new HF 21 frequencies. The display now has the ability to handle detection frequencies up to 81 kHz (18 kHz before), now with 7 frequency offsets (compared to 3 previously). • DEUS is now compatible with a smartphone: Target information and other data can be sent by radio link to a smartphone. An app will soon be available to unlock these features. • New program No 9 "HOT" : "Pro setting" this is a find everything program, based on the Full Tone audio mode with a very low discrimination. Hot is a very interactive program offering excellent feedback and target information. • New program No 6 "DEEP": "Pro setting" for locating deep targets, with moderate discrimination and specific signal processing. • Improved Non motion / static mode: Non motion modes are now more advanced offering better overall performance, with an improved sensitivity to small targets. • New processing : Dual processing power improves navigation and a range of other parameters. remote and headset battery life has slightly decreased to 18 and 20 hours respectively. • Normalization display is now a menu feature on the WS4 and WS5 headphones. • The headset volume is now stored when switched off. • The coil name in the coil menu have gone, the serial number is now used as the coil reference. • Erasing a coil from the list is done by replacing all characters with 0. • Audio tone can now be raised up to 993 hertz • Target Normalization mode is on by default (Normalization is not active with HF coils) • When turning OFF the remote control to use only the wireless headphone, the coil restart

The ergonomics of the TDI SL are the best thing going in a ground balancing PI. It is a pleasure to swing and does not fall over when placed on the ground like nearly all other machines made these days. I sure would like to have the SDC 2300 guts stuffed in the TDI SL box!

The TDI Pro of course has a more powerful battery than a stock TDI SL and this matters a great deal with ground balance off. People do need to be aware ground balance exists for a reason. If you have a Pro and can get it to operate smoothly with ground balance off it is an extremely powerful unit second perhaps to only the Eric Foster Deepstar as a beach detector. However, if the ground is severely mineralized or hot rocks abound, there comes a point where the ground balance on mode provides better depth and smooth operation. So the big question John - does running a TDI SL with a battery as powerful as that in the TDI Pro bring back the missing depth in ground balance off mode? Except for not being submersible the original TDI and TDI Pro variant are very powerful beach machines and with the old Eric Foster units facing issues that come with age probably the best option currently available for those wanting to hunt the beach with a PI. It is truly a shame that White's never got it into a waterproof submersible design despite that being requested from day one by users - my very first TDI review asked for it! I waited and waited and waited - and now I have a Garrett ATX. You can't just turn the ground balance off with it as you can the TDI but you can get close as this video by the same guy illustrate. The TDI is shown again in this one also.

If White's had included these two features in the MX Sport it would have saved them a lot of grief. The current headphone connection location is terrible. However, if the unit also had wireless capability then the only people that would have to use the hard wired connection would be people wanting to use the unit underwater. The more obvious problem has been the inability to update the firmware without returning the unit to the factory, for some people multiple times. It would have taken the issue from being a real mess to being a minor annoyance at worst. Sadly for White's the MX Sport is a textbook example of why these two features should be standard on new models or at least those selling for over $500 All the more puzzling when White's was at the forefront when they included wireless headphone capability in the V3i. And ignored it ever since?