Your Pick Of Any Nugget Detector For High Trash Areas?

[goldbrick]

On 3/25/2016 at 8:04 PM, argyle said:

Discounting general un-dug hardened ground, and concentrating on the type of 'pushed material in the form of broken up tailings you mention like Ganes Creek (I've never been there of course) and detecting the big un-pushed high tailing piles (we call them mullock heaps)...

I wouldn't take my PI at all. No advantage over VLF's in these scenarios whatsoever. Simply leave it at home, and take your pick from from any VLF unit that can really punch the gain through tailings, and run an 11" round and up, preferably 13" and larger.

 

I wonder if there is a difference in performance in tailings depending on the type of tailings. Do we need to differentiate between hard rock tailings and placer tailings when talking about the relative merits of PI versus VLF. For instance tailings from ancient river deposits as opposed to a hard rock tailings deposit consisting of iron rich ultra-mafic rocks. Or is it a moot point in all ground types of hard rock tailings due to no electrical conductivity in hard rock tailings because they are busted up? I think quartz tailings can be very benign almost to the point of an inability to GB on them.

In regard to depth on tailings  between PI/VLF being basically equal, is that true in all instances except for say a GPX or GPZ due to the battery power enabling a much higher level of gain? Like VLF = TDI but VLF < GPX?

HH,

Merton

[argyle]

There would have be changes in performance that knock signal response around with different type of matrix on piles. Some would disadvantage VLF's, some would disadvantage PI's.

Only coil size and type being exactly the same I think Merton.

 

And not sure if 'battery power advantages on later units actually place more, or push more gain through broken mild ground than say a Detech Relic Striker with 6 aa's can. Or other types of high gain 8 aa machines.

 

[Roughwater]

Thanks Goldbrick and Argyle,

 

Appreciate you all bringing this post back to top of the heap.  I reread the info you all left and I think it sank in a bit better with the second read and the additional info. 

Much appreciated.

Terry

[auminesweeper]

At gains for me there is only one choice that would be the MXT with the 12" concentric, Because I have someones story somewhere stating that they hit a 1 ozt nugget at 18" with that set up, and I like the sound of that and having access to full Disc when mooching through the junk,, or the 5.3 because it hits the fine stuff and has a bit of depth to it and it's great for between the rock's.

John 

[auminesweeper]

4 hours ago, goldbrick said:

I wonder if there is a difference in performance in tailings depending on the type of tailings. Do we need to differentiate between hard rock tailings and placer tailings when talking about the relative merits of PI versus VLF. For instance tailings from ancient river deposits as opposed to a hard rock tailings deposit consisting of iron rich ultra-mafic rocks. Or is it a moot point in all ground types of hard rock tailings due to no electrical conductivity in hard rock tailings because they are busted up? I think quartz tailings can be very benign almost to the point of an inability to GB on them.

In regard to depth on tailings  between PI/VLF being basically equal, is that true in all instances except for say a GPX or GPZ due to the battery power enabling a much higher level of gain? Like VLF = TDI but VLF < GPX?

HH,

Merton

If you get  a VLF with a big concentric in that mild ground a Good VLF should hang with a PI machine, Not only that because the good VLFs have mix mode Audio they can give an All Metal Sound of up to 50 to 60% of the depth where they Bleep to so an Item that can be seen at 16 inches if you train your Ears you can pick them up at 20 to 24 inches, But sad to say that most people just Bleep and Dig but that's not how you find the good stuff, Anyone can dig a target that blows ya ears off but it is those rises in threshold that can make all the difference and the bigger the nugget the deep you can dig em, Learn these things about VLFs and they can give you a workout just as good as a PI can.

hope this helps,,

John 

[Roughwater]

5 hours ago, auminesweeper said:

good VLFs have mix mode Audio they can give an All Metal Sound of up to 50 to 60% of the depth where they Bleep to so an Item that can be seen at 16 inches if you train your Ears you can pick them up at 20 to 24 inches, But sad to say that most people just Bleep and Dig but that's not how you find the good stuff, Anyone can dig a target that blows ya ears off but it is those rises in threshold that can make all the difference and the bigger the nugget the deep you can dig em, Learn these things about VLFs and they can give you a workout just as good as a PI can.

hope this helps,,

It definitely helps to know and remember such things.  It's things like that I'm sure that can make the difference with being successful or not with any detector.  I will surely be going over tailing piles others have gone over before so one needs any little edge to find that elusive nugget others missed.  

One thing John that I see in your thread above about all the detectors you owned other than the most useless ones is that you didn't fret so much over their weak areas but found their strengths and put that to good use.

I know I want what we all want, which is that magic detector that can do it all, but as you long time detectorist know, it don't exist yet. If not for limited finances I would just go out and buy the 7000, the 3030, the MXT, the gold Racer, and a couple other of the latest greatest.  But to keep myself in a limited budget and to deal with my spouse I have to limit my choices so I am not wanting to jump at the first detector that seems to shine.  I don't look at the pressures to not buy everything real negatively as I can see that many folks who can are often not all that happy in the long run.  But I don't want to go out and try to do a job with the wrong tool either.  There is much to be said for the confidence one has when they feel they have the right tool in their hand.  I am willing to stretch my budget if I know a product would serve the place of 2 or more detectors.  A detector like the 3030 could serve well my Beach and for the  most part my coin detector and I could actually go in the water without worry of destroying it.  And god knows if I get near the water and think it will give an edge to get in it, I will.   Or the Racer 2 appears to be able to serve as as a great coin, good Relic and good back up gold detector and there are other VLF detectors out there that would maybe serve better as a single purpose detector.  

In trying to be realistic I also see that I am very far from any gold nugget fields and not that far from the beaches so I can't get out but so often to gold prospect but can get to several beaches in 3- 5 hours including all the North Carolina Beaches, the Va beaches and the huge Myrtle beach area in South Carolina.  Also, all kinds of relic hunting to do here in NC and VA not to mention coin hunting locally so that's to consider as well.  But still I don't want to drive 3 to 10,000 miles to the goldfields and feel unarmed detector wise. Also, after pulling up a few nuggets, detecting gold nuggets makes other detecting feel a little more bland to me.  Kinda like being a deer hunter and then taking that first Elk hunt.  You don't want to give up deer hunting but Elk hunting is a bump up in the excitement level and that's what Nugget hunting feels like to me anyway so even though I can't get out to do it as much makes the tools I use no less important to me. 

 So that's some of the things tugging on my mind in making my decisions as what to buy.  

I want to say also that this website and the folks I meet here have all been so hugely helpful in my pursuit of detecting.  In the short couple months I have been mentally hanging out here, though I have met none of you in person, you all feel like friends and I'm grateful to all.

As a side note - Another of the great things about detecting aside from finding things is that it takes me outside and often to such wild places.  There is a lot of value to that.  To be sitting in that spot where the surrounding scenery just makes you wonder now on earth anything could be more beautiful.  

 

 

 

[auminesweeper]

3 hours ago, Roughwater said:

It definitely helps to know and remember such things.  It's things like that I'm sure that can make the difference with being successful or not with any detector.  I will surely be going over tailing piles others have gone over before so one needs any little edge to find that elusive nugget others missed.  

One thing John that I see in your thread above about all the detectors you owned other than the most useless ones is that you didn't fret so much over their weak areas but found their strengths and put that to good use.

I know I want what we all want, which is that magic detector that can do it all, but as you long time detectorist know, it don't exist yet. If not for limited finances I would just go out and buy the 7000, the 3030, the MXT, the gold Racer, and a couple other of the latest greatest.  But to keep myself in a limited budget and to deal with my spouse I have to limit my choices so I am not wanting to jump at the first detector that seems to shine.  I don't look at the pressures to not buy everything real negatively as I can see that many folks who can are often not all that happy in the long run.  But I don't want to go out and try to do a job with the wrong tool either.  There is much to be said for the confidence one has when they feel they have the right tool in their hand.  I am willing to stretch my budget if I know a product would serve the place of 2 or more detectors.  A detector like the 3030 could serve well my Beach and for the  most part my coin detector and I could actually go in the water without worry of destroying it.  And god knows if I get near the water and think it will give an edge to get in it, I will.   Or the Racer 2 appears to be able to serve as as a great coin, good Relic and good back up gold detector and there are other VLF detectors out there that would maybe serve better as a single purpose detector.  

 

Because my sites are EXTREMELY filled with junk I moved away from multi-frequency machines because the recovery is too slow and I was loosing too many Targets, Plus a friend showed me exactly what the MXT could do and he whooped my Etrac and my Sovereign GT and no matter what coil I used they would not see the Targets laying on the ground, So I would be forgetting the 3030 unless it was a Winchester or a Marlin, lol

It's been a long while since the first model MXT came out but the new models are the same machine with a few nice bits added, I have never found an Area where the machine was lacking, Not once have I ever gone out and found nothing of interest, I never worry because someone near by is using an XP or an F75 or what ever, The only difference is I can just twist a knob to adjust something and keep going and using Duracells I get about 60 hours of Battery time I normally change them around 57 hours just so I don't get caught out,

Without making me sound like a Whites sales Rep, If money was no object and you took me to the biggest detector store on the planet and they had everything from a Realistic 3001 to the GPZ 7000, and you told me to pick one as a Gift, I would pick the MXT A/P over all others, for a simple reason, It has never sent me home empty handed, I have found some natural Gold with them and I hit the jackpot finding gold jewellery with one, and to this day some folks never let me live it down,

Is it the Best machine? NO

Is it the Deepest machine? NO

So what does it have, It has 15/16 years of Proven track record, as Steve said it has found more Gold in ALASKA that any other machine in history, And by knowing just some of these things you just know you are going to find something, I see the MXT as the Perfect Exploration Tool into unknown Areas, It will do the Job and won't complain there are at leased 30 or 40 coils made for them, They are like the Wheel once invented it's hard to come up with a better Idea, Minelab were so impressed that they reverse engineered the MXT to find what made it Tick when they were Building the Xterra range of machines So that is a huge compliment in it's self, 

Read This Review By Steve, http://www.detectorprospector.com/gold-prospecting-equipment/whites-electronics-mxt-metal-detector.htm

But you should Also seriously consider the Nokta/Makro Range of machines too, Because this young whipper snapper of a company is kicking butt and taking names, Including mine but at present I am staying with the MXT because I am waiting for one of their machine to hit the shops.

Hope this helps..  John 

[OregonGregg]

To quote Steve :

" but the only VLF I am inclined to use is my Makro Gold Racer. The Noktas though have better balance running a large coil and so if I was doing a lot of tailings again I would be tempted to get another Nokta. "

I agree but with different reasons, I wouldn't know a gold nugget if it hit me up side the head. But for iron infested sites I hunt for coins etc, I really like the newer features that was added to the Racer 2 ( Iron Audio Volume, Tone Break) but I really like swinging the Fors CoRe much better. I was hoping that Nokta would update the original Fors CoRe as they did the Racer to Racer 2. Give the updated Fors CoRe the same features that were added to the R2. Have it share the same coils and at that point they could drop the "CoRe" name and simply call it the " Fors Coin" to go with the Fors Relic and Fors Gold machines. Would make a nice trio of machines. I just like the Nokta physical package better, hand grip , balance etc etc. However, isn't that big of a deal. I have the R2 w/ oor coil, and use that in the worst of the iron and utilize the added features and the Nokta with the 5.5 x 10 coil for areas with less trash. 

 

[Roughwater]

That does help, That's one huge vote for the MXT.  Sounds like it's a Rock solid machine and for sure and not the most expensive VlF machine out there.  As to the 3030 I wasn't planning on using it for Gold prospecting if I were to get one.  A big negative feature of the 3030 is cost, so if I got one to satisfy beach and coin use I still have to fork out some more money for a VlF gold machine If I want to do it right.  I talked to Gerry McMullen last night on the phone and he's been finding a lot of gold rings on the beach with the 3030 and feels like it's the best beach machine there is at present and agrees also that it is not a great prospecting tool.  He regards the Racer highly but says he hasn't checked out the Racer 2 yet as it's so new.  As to beach machines he rates the 3030 tops, with the Excal 2nd and the CZ21 third.  For non wading machines he likes the Safari and the Etrack and feels it best to consider one of those over the older slow response of the Quattro.  He says the Quattro was only sold for a short period of time for a reason.  

I think I will check out the MXT further since it's been given so many rave reviews.

Hope my old pics aren't adding too many Mbits to the website.  Just trying to add a bit of scenery to the black and white.

Oh yea, I made it to the North Pole in O6.  I didn't get to meet Santa though, Guess he was still in bed as it was 3:30 in the morning! I stopped at the mailbox in the pic and mailed a letter to my wife so she would have a letter from the north pole.