LowTide Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 When Minelab offered the statement that the new Equinox would obsolete single frequency VLF detectors there was a hue and cry of disbelief from a group of end users. Yet the manufacturers, even before the first Equinox was available for retail sale confirmed that statement by lowering prices. There were two aspects of the statement issued by Minelab that seems to have been missed by some end users: 1. The statement was 90% aimed at other manufacturers. 2. The statement was forward looking at the economic viability of future production of single frequency VLF’s. Now an end user may think that the Acme 4000 was the greatest relic detector ever made and cannot be displaced by an Equinox. However if the sales numbers fall to a certain point then the Acme 4000 will end up being discontinued. So even if an end user loves and is totally invested in an Acme 4000 there is no guarantee it will survive the sales onslaught of the Equinox. To those who say “hogwash” then may I ask how many new recent model BFO or T/R detectors do you see being for sale by manufacturers? Why aren’t there any? Because Technology moved on, just the same as is occurring with the Equinox. Tough time to be a product or sales manager at a competing metal detector company! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick K - First Member Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Single frequency detectors will continue to sell in vastly greater numbers than multi’s for one simple reason - the vast majority of detectors sold sell for well under $500 - and it will be quite a while before Multifreakers sell at that price level. At some point that will happen however. When a $300 - $400 multifreaker hits the market, with extremely simple controls, perfect ergonomics and good all round performance in any soil, then singlefreakers will be relegated to specialist applications (I’m looking at you Gold Bug 2) - and as entry level machines selling for less than $200. Meanwhile, the market for high-end singlefreakers has a “hard row to hoe” if the Equinox continues to impress the dedicated hobbyists. In the not-too-distant future, even more advances systems of signal production and return signal analysis will emerge. Those in turn may “obsolete” ALL current detectors. The next 5 years should be very interesting. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tnsharpshooter Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Lot of folks still use products although they are deemed obsolete. Not the point of the Op's post I don't think. But with time smaller and smaller use of the obsoletes will take place. A Ford model T will get you places. A 2018 Mustang will get you places faster with more comfort. And if Minelab say comes up with some more new tech (better) then multi IQ tech may be placed inside detector models that do sell for $4-500. Then what? Sounds like some manufacturers better get to trying to crack nuts and find new tech to me. But I could be wrong. We'll see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLOODHOUND1970 Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Dual IQ may be the ticket for Minelab's lower end machines to take over the low price market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
☠ Cipher Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 I don't know that it will hold true for long that single frequency will outsell multi. If you're a manufacturer looking at the market now, in terms of do it all single frequency, where would you see profit incentive in creating any new single frequency platforms? Multifrequency will take over the $649+ market. The multiple single selectable will take over the $259-$600 (X-Terra's with their new aftermarket coils allow frequency change without coil changes. Then there's the impact, Kruzer, and a few overseas manufacturers). Most single frequency machines are going to be pushed down into the low end of the market. But for how long? I doubt everyone is just going to back off and let Minelab have the $649+ market, or Minelab and Nokta have the multiple selectable $259-$600 (it is my belief that Makro/Nokta will have to bring the Impact and multi-Kruzer down to sub $649 in the near future.) They are either going to offer the same for less or more for the same. Either way, more capability will continue to be crammed into more machines for less money. It's not going to be all that long before being able to at least switch frequencies is as common as VDI, or ground balancing. It wasn't that long ago that VDI was a very costly feature. We now see it on $60-$129 machines. Once the R+D phase is done, it's all just flashing software to hardware. The single frequency market is about to become extremely bottom heavy, with an overwhelming number of choices. Market share on the bottom end will be so divided that it's hard to see it being profitable to mass market so many different models. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowTide Posted March 22, 2018 Author Share Posted March 22, 2018 Cipher I agree with your analysis and at the bottom of single freq VLF market lay the Chinese in wait. A $150USD detector is not where you want to go head to head with them. A U.S. company may hold a greater market share against them for a while, but the Chinese may occupy enough of the market to prevent you from going forward. And by that I mean that you can only hold your price point by ordering raw parts in large enough quantities. Yes purchase orders with timed releases are possible, but will that decision be taken with stagnant or declining sales? On the other point of your post, the release of a competing product. Minelab has been busy wallpapering the U.S. patent office with applications concerning PI, multi-freq, and signal processing. Minelab has also made clear that they are willing to defend those patents by forcing White's into a court settlement. And XP Deus last October ended up settling with Minelab in U.S. Federal Court. I would love to have a look at that settlement because I suspect with every Deus sold Minleab will get a percent of the profit. Even if a company thinks they have a clean technology, do they have the financial resources to fight Codan in a multi-year lawsuit where the attorneys are the only real winners? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick K - First Member Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 Chinese products are not inherently cheaper at point of sale than US made competition - plus, in the low-end of the detector market distribution is the key. Go into any big box store and look at the Detectors - pretty much wall-to-wall First Texas - mostly Bounty Hunter teve sell in enormous numbers of units per year. The handwriting is on the wall for those who cannot innovate however. Multifreakers have lots of advantages over singlefreakers. In addition current multifreakers are not the only technologies available - Lots of multifreq possibilities lie outside ML patents. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Herschbach Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 On 3/21/2018 at 6:45 AM, Rick Kempf said: In the not-too-distant future, even more advances systems of signal production and return signal analysis will emerge. And luckily except for those who choose to keep on waiting there is no need to keep on waiting. The future arrived while others were still working in it. Bird in the hand and all that. By the time the wait is over for others to release their first generation products Minelab will be well on the way to the second generation. At some point like the thread title says, facing reality has to take precedence over glowing promises. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auminesweeper Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 It has not made anything obsolete, My machines have not stopped working just because a company uses false claims in order to market a new machine, As nice or lightweight as it may be, It is just another VLF/LF, to the point that someone else here did a little test of a few machines where the GBP which is not known for it's depth managed to hang in there to the end, And I still say the GBP is highly underrated and it does have a few tricks up it's sleeve which not many folks know about, That "obsolete" quote is more about getting people spending the money or to change brands, It has been said a thousand times that the VLF market has not made any progress since 1998/99 and the fact still remains, There are a few videos about showing this and one in particular where the Garrett AT Pro when fitted with a similar coil displayed a big improvement over other detectors young and old including the equinox which displayed just average abilities as did the other machines, So I know the "obsolete" hype is just that. Buying a detector is a very personal thing and it has to be right for you where it ticks the most boxes, Others may hate it others may love it, but what ever you buy it has to be about you and how it's set up works to your way of thinking, Location can have a big effect on what detector works where ?. Sometimes a person might find them selves buying a brand/model that really does not appeal to them for a simple reason it works better where they detect, There is no right or wrong machine, there are just some work better where you detect than others but if you take it 20 or 30 miles away it could become your worst nightmare, Obsolete NO, Useful Yes. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hHjfPMSqFjk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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