Is The Day Of A Single Frequency Detector Past ?

[Ridge Runner]

I see I need to clarify on what I said .

 If First Texas can come out with a detector equal to the Equinox 800 are better in what it has to offer and weight, I’ll make the trip.

 I just don’t see the need to advance to the rear when what I want is already here in the Equinox 800.

 The trip that I was talking about is six hundred miles but for some that’s on the market now I wouldn’t walk across the street for .

 Minelab has set the level in excellence with the Equinox 800 in capability,weight and price. 

I speak only for myself when I say this. The day of a detectors face covered in knobs is history and I came to that conclusion with my Eagle 2 in 1991.

 That has to be what 27 years back to 91 and yet some still don’t get it . That is anything less is less!

 Chuck 

[LowTide]

3 hours ago, Dubious said:

"obsoletes all single frequency detectors,"

From day one of the promulgation of the above statement I have believed it was 90% aimed at other manufacturers.   And the statement is forward looking to detectors by competitors that are still in the development stage.  So using the Nox 600 street price provides a ceiling price point that they have to butt up against with their single freqs, or if they can come up with a multi-freq a reference point for performance/features.

The latest two Makro-Nok releases have provided somewhat of a barometer to the future of Single Freqs.  In monitoring multiple forums the Multi Kruzer has had some cursory interest and the Anfibio far less.   Am I trying to disparage Makro-Nok?  No, they are simply the first to release single freq(multi-selectable) detectors that are all purpose waterproof detectors.  If they were true mult-freqs then they would be considered the first true Nox competitors.   White's released a gold specialty detector which is a niche product and not meant to be a jack of all trades.

Meanwhile back at the ranch.  Dimitar a former engineer for Fisher has been apparently noodling around in his garage or basement, and has purportedly come up with some new technology(possibly VLF/PI hybrid).  Which begs the question.....if a single guy on a shoestring budget can develop new detector technology, then why can't companies with actual engineering departments do something similar?

And if I were Makro-Nok I would have Dimitar on Speed Dial for a licensing deal.☎️

 

 

[Geotech]

5 hours ago, Dubious said:

 My cynical suspicion is that Minelab probably did try to do five frequencies simultaneously but somewhere during development found there just wasn't going to be enough horsepower under the hood (cpu speed, etc.) to do the processing effectively in anything approaching real-time, and had to reduce the number to two.

Building a 5-frequency metal detector would not be difficult, and there are plenty of processors with more than enough horsepower. But the transmit power gets divided amongst each frequency so you lose depth. There are tangible benefits to 2 frequencies. There are additional tangible benefits to 3 frequencies. There are almost no tangible benefits to more than 3 frequencies.

Quote

The main difference between it and FBS, which also apparently uses two fundamental frequencies at a time, may turn out to be that it just has a few higher fundamental frequencies from which to choose, allowing it to do better on some lower conductors.

That is a correct assumption.

[Geotech]

5 hours ago, Steve Herschbach said:

Start driving Chuck - Carl will be waiting for you along with your new Fisher CZ-3D (Multiple-Frequency transmit, Dual Frequency Processing VLF Search 5 KHz and 15 KHz) 

Aww c'mon, I would never do that. Not even for a steak dinner.

[Dubious]

LowTide, as I said, I took the phrase "obsoletes all single-frequency detectors" to be mere advertising puffery, not a statement of fact.  But if you consider it a statement of fact, you can argue that it is true, in at least one sense.  Even if Minelab deceived us about the Equinox using five frequencies simultaneously, it still selects 2 of 5 frequencies depending on the mode, allowing it to do the jobs of several single-frequency machines--all the way from using its lowest frequency to hunt deep silver to using its highest to find small gold.  In that sense, in terms of flexibility it does "obsolete" a machine with only one frequency at its disposal.  Much the same can be said for the Multi Kruzer with its user-selectable frequencies.

[Ridge Runner]

Geotech

 I’ll take your 3 multifrequency detector if you can give me a better than average ID at 6 to 10 inches .I will need the weight off of it because age has caught up with me .

l have no pride! I’ll take the senior discount.haha

 The Best To You Carl !

 Chuck 

[Dubious]

On 11/19/2018 at 7:12 PM, Geotech said:

Building a 5-frequency metal detector would not be difficult, and there are plenty of processors with more than enough horsepower. But the transmit power gets divided amongst each frequency so you lose depth. There are tangible benefits to 2 frequencies. There are additional tangible benefits to 3 frequencies. There are almost no tangible benefits to more than 3 frequencies.

. . . 

Well, then, we need a detector with multiple frequencies, that uses 3 of them at a time, that has modes that can cover everything from deep silver to the smallest gold :)

As for dividing the power, I had (apparently mistakenly) thought that the Equinox overcame the problem by transmitting bursts of sine waves at each frequency, each burst after the other.  That is, five time slices, one for each frequency, so each burst of sine waves could be at full power, with the sequence repeating. But maybe this "sequential" approach wouldn't give the same multi-frequency effect.

[Alluminati]

27 minutes ago, Dubious said:

Well, then, we need a detector with multiple frequencies, that uses 3 of them at a time, that can cover everything from deep silver to the smallest gold ?

As for dividing the power, I had (apparently mistakenly) thought that the Equinox overcame the problem by transmitting bursts of sine waves at each frequency, each burst after the other.  That is, five time slices, one for each frequency, so each burst of sine waves could be at full power, with the sequence repeating. But maybe this "sequential" approach wouldn't give the same multi-frequency effect.

I guess you didn't read the explanation from Minelab linked a few pages back? Still speculating?

5kHz - fundamental.
10kHz - 2nd harmonic
15kHz - 3rd harmonic
20kHz - 4th harmonic
40kHz - 8th harmonic

Those square waves posted by EL NINO a few pages back look like they were made with more then 2 frequencies. They are too flat on top.

 

[Geotech]

56 minutes ago, Dubious said:

As for dividing the power, I had (apparently mistakenly) thought that the Equinox overcame the problem by transmitting bursts of sine waves at each frequency, each burst after the other.  That is, five time slices, one for each frequency, so each burst of sine waves could be at full power, with the sequence repeating. But maybe this "sequential" approach wouldn't give the same multi-frequency effect.

That's how BBS/FBS works. A single 3.125kHz cycle, followed by a burst of (8) 25kHz cycles. Repeat. Equinox does both frequencies at the same time, same as DFX & V3. Either way, you are dividing the TX power amongst frequencies, whether in amplitude or time.