Steve Herschbach

Many reports on the firmware note that the pinpoint, modulation, VCO and iron grunt controls either do nothing or do not work as people expect that they should. The pinpoint function apparently works at full sensitivity levels, but when you turn the sensitivity down pinpoint mode loses depth faster than the hunt modes - meaning the pinpoint function does not detect as deep as the hunt mode, rendering it somewhat useless. It has been hard to get a definitive answer in whether all these functions have been fixed in the latest firmware version and are working as would be expected by knowledgeable users. The latest reports are not encouraging. http://www.dankowskidetectors.com/discussions/read.php?2,109708 http://www.dankowskidetectors.com/discussions/read.php?2,109780 OFFICIAL WHITE'S RESPONSE TO ISSUES 7/20/16 - http://forums.whiteselectronics.com/showthread.php?76138-MX-Sport-Screen-inspection "If your SAT goes to "EIGHT" and you "DO NOT" have any cracks in the clear part of the display, DO NOT send it in for updating. If your SAT only goes to (6), and/or... you "do have" cracks in your display, DO send it in for updating. As mentioned prior, the serial number sequence will not tell a person if it needs to be updated, nor if display cracks are possible. We are sorry for all this and are working hard to resolve any and all issues as quickly as possible. Again, "EIGHT" SAT, no cracks, NO need for updating. (6) SAT, and/or cracks, DO send it in for updating." ACCORDING TO INFORMATION ON THE THREAD THERE IS NO WAY TO DETERMINE VISUALLY OR VIA SERIAL NUMBER WHETHER THE SCREEN WILL CRACK BEFORE HAND.

On many VLF detectors the highest target id reading is a kind of dumping ground for unknown targets. Large ferrous targets and extreme mineralization can read at the highest end of the scale. Some people like to think of the VDI scale as circular instead on linear, with low end readings "wrapping around" to turn into high end readings. Here is the probable id chart from the Makro Gold Racer owners manual: Notice 90 - 99 can be hot rocks, or intensely mineralized spots. The trick is it is almost impossible to get a gold reading in the 90s. I have a relatively pure 6.5 ounce gold nugget that reads a solid 88. A silver dollar reads 91. Most gold on the Gold Racer is going to read in the 40 - 50 range or 60s and 70s for large nuggets. So assuming you do not have a defective coil or something else going on I am with the others on it being a mineralized hot spot. One thing I tried to get on the Gold Racer was the ability to either notch readings in the 90's, or a second ID Filter that starts at 99 and eliminates items in a downward fashion (99 - 96 or 99 - 93). Allowing extreme high VDI reading to be blocked would eliminate this tendency of some hot rocks and ferrous to bounce super high. The only good items you might miss would be silver bars plus extremely large brass, copper, or aluminum items. As it is you have to eyeball the readings. Again, this is another area where having an on screen target VDI can be very helpful while nugget detecting. On the Gold Racer readings of 95 - 99 can be ignored as being almost certainly not gold. If the area you hunt has a reputation for one pound or larger nuggets it might be another issue so just be aware and play the odds as seems best for your situation.

I would say the last dozen posts about covers it. People keep reporting buying new units from dealers and getting old stock. Here is the latest just posted on White's own forum and Facebook page http://forums.whiteselectronics.com/showthread.php?76067-New-Firmware&p=990769&viewfull=1#post990769 "I called the dealer before my order shipped to verify they would be shipping me one that either already had the firmware update or was a new production unit. Dealer assured me they didn't have any of the old firmware versions in stock. Well they sent me one with the original firmware with the tone smearing issues. I verified this with White's and through testing. Now I have to waste time sending it in for the update which is very frustrating considering I took measures to avoid having to do this." and this http://www.dankowskidetectors.com/discussions/read.php?2,108553

Obviously gold in quartz, but I will put my guess at more like 50% gold by weight

The Deepseeker Package is a standard configuration option. Any dealer can sell them. I got one but ended up selling the large coil and will probably sell the case also. If I lived on the beach I would have kept it, but it was kind of extraneous to my needs given the other detectors I own. It did not appear to me to have any real depth advantage on coin size and smaller targets, but might have an advantage on oversize stuff. What you really get is 20" coverage in a 15" wide coil that is not as bad to swing as I thought it was going to be. It would be great for huge sanded in beaches or for relic hunters. For nearly all the gold nuggets a typical prospector might find I think the stock coil is the better option, with ground coverage being the only real gain. The coil might allow small surface items to be ignored if the coil is held a couple inches off the beach, but still hit deep on coins and rings. A full skid plate cover is recommended for brushy or very uneven ground. It will collect a lot of light debris but beats having the coil hang up on stubble or a rock.

Got a photo? Pure pyrite or galena is usually not detectable. However, galena with a very high silver content looks sooty black and will signal on a hot VLF; doubtful a PI would however unless it had native silver content. Cuprite, another copper ore is very conductive. Arsenopyrite is a very common and very conductive ore that signals nicely. Anything with a high graphite content will sing out.

Findmalls reasoning is beside the point really. The trend with Tesoro is plain to anyone who has watched the industry. I was one of Tesoros "Gold Star" dealers for a long time. And reality especially since Jack died is they have done next to nothing to refresh the product lineup. Current speculation on their demise is nothing but that - speculation. They could go on for years continuing to produce the old machines. They are excellent detectors. There is no getting around the fact however that people like detectors with screens and they like detectors with tone options. Tesoro detectors for some time could claim to be less expensive than units with those bells and whistles. But the competition now makes machines fully loaded with the options and for no extra cost. When you line up feature lists these days Tesoro detectors are now actually kind of pricey given the minimal feature sets. Yeah, yeah, I hear all you old pros - you don't need all those bells and whistles! That is fine and I agree to a point, but it is what most buyers are looking for, and Tesoro is fading from relevance by not producing more modern detectors . The stuff NokMak puts out these days could instead be the sort of thing we would be seeing from Tesoro if they were of a mind to stay in the game for the long run. Regardless, great little detectors, great company with deep roots, I wish them well and hope they continue to produce units for now and in the foreseeable future. Guv is shooting himself in the foot really. What drives a forum is users, and the Tesoro Forum was plenty popular. I am sure other people would have been happy to sponsor it if the word had been put out. Instead he is more or less just telling the Tesoro fans to go away. The thing is, nobody needs Findmall. Tesoro could easily just set up their own forum on their own website. You would think electronics companies would have more people on staff with an ounce of web savvy. It is just not that hard to build websites and setup forums, etc. Nobody taught me, I have no schooling in it, the stuff is not rocket science. A bit of Googling teaches you all you need to know. Maybe that is what Tesoro is thinking but I am not holding my breath on that one any more than on the Cazador!

Fabulous find Peg - Congratulations!!!

It is a very common copper ore. I have samples and they do signal on a detector. Great colors - the nice nickname is peacock ore but it also goes by the less attractive horseflesh ore. I have never found it in the field myself but I suspect it gets found commonly in copper country like in Arizona. Sad news is you would need an entire mountain of it to have any value except for minimal value as a mineral specimen.

The default on Gold Racer is "1" and default on Gold Finder is "6". I run both at zero unless absolutely required. Again, however, the effect is quite subtle and so higher levels appear pretty safe. The bottom line is anyone with a machine should experiment with the setting on in ground items. It is very important to have a real feel for what controls and functions actually do as opposed to using settings found in books or on the Internet. I am by no means an expert on these machines and am still learning myself. I actually appreciate questions like this on machines I own as it makes me look deeper into things I need to know myself.

Just another old line company that never understood the internet or social media. Jack also refused to play ball with Kellyco which got him the respect of a lot of dealers, but did nothing to help the company retain mind share. I am sure most potential consumers have never heard of Tesoro, so even the name itself has little value anymore. The company itself can disappear and it would hardly be missed for a long time. Tesoro builds bulletproof little detectors, and there are lots of them out there. They will end up sort of like Compass with a cult following and active sales in used machines long after the company itself is gone.

As posted on the Minelab Facebook page on June 21st....

I am sure you know how to detect. The Minelabs are just better. Except for Garrett dealers almost nobody disputes that. However, my ATX ran a very close second to my GPX 5000 so I would agree something was up if the ATX was only getting half the depth of a GP 3500. Like all PI detectors there is gold that will favor some machines over others and perhaps that was the case here. No matter. The reality is that most serious prospectors were already using a Minelab when the ATX came out. Garrett offered them no reason to get an ATX except for being waterproof. If you are a happy GP 3500 owner, why get an ATX that is less powerful and weighs more, has few coil options, and those coils cost as much or more than a Minelab coil?

Hi Neo, Welcome to the forum! I assume you mean the Minelab Go Finds instead of the Go Pro (a camera). Unfortunately I have no 2016 calendar so can't see the detector. With no such machine announced perhaps White's stuck a prototype in the photo, hoping it would be released later in 2016? I was guessing low end detector but not so low as to be a kids detector.

That is not unusual. As a past dealer for many brands of many types of equipment I can report "repair or replace" is pretty much standard operating procedure between dealers and suppliers. It is also fairly standard terminology in warranties for consumers. When I ran the service dept repairs under warranty was job one - replacement a last resort. Outright refunds? Extremely rare.

Tesoro declined to keep sponsoring the Tesoro Forum on Findmall so it has been renamed the Relic & Metal Detecting Forum The explanation was posted here.

No, there is no slot built into the AU Gold Finder that can accept the "dongle". Probably part of the price paid to waterproof it.

There are an amazing number of people who don't know about the continuing issues or do know and don't care. The general mantra is "don't worry, White's will take care of you". And while that may very well be the case, the lack of a coordinated response and continued existence of older units in the pipeline with known problems means this issue will churn for at least the remainder of the year, if not longer. White's will no doubt survive it but not without a cost. I for one if asked a year ago would have chosen White's above all others as the company you could most trust to put out a brand new model that had been thoroughly vetted and likely problem free. You could argue that has not actually been true for some time but it was the way I still felt about it. I also was clearly pumped up over the MX Sport and in many ways the machine was slated to be the machine that I spent a great deal of time using and posting about in 2016. Sometimes I am a "Minelab Guy" (SDC and GPZ) and sometimes I am a "Garrett Guy" (ATX) and sometimes a "Fisher Guy" (F75, Gold Bug Pro) and I even have taken a spin as a "Nokta/Makro Guy" (FORS Gold, Gold Racer). In years past I have been a "White's Guy" (MXT, TDI) but it had been a while. I looked at the MX Sport as bringing it around to White's once again and was all set to ride my "White's Guy" horse this year. Right now I could be out using the MX Sport and posting regularly as a happy user. I might also have been on board as a product tester. Not to toot my own horn too loudly, but there would have been some value for White's should it have worked out that way. Instead, I have moved on with my perception of White's altered as a result, and not in a good way. I can't in good conscience recommend anyone buy a White's MX Sport at this time, and White's has nobody but themselves to blame for that. In no way am I "anti White's" but after 40 long years I for the first time ever am also not in the "pro White's" camp either. Just another sad step on the way to becoming older, more cynical, and less trusting.

I have the original Bluetooth setup for the Racer and mine works just fine. The only issue I had with it was the headphones themselves were a bit muffled sounding compared to the Sun Ray Pro Gold headphones I normally use. The microseconds of delay that seems to have been a huge issue with the few people that ever reported on them was no issue at all in my case. But if success is a product being well received and wanted by all, then they were indeed a failure. Problems with new releases does seem to be industry standard these days and hard to set any one manufacturer above another when it comes to new model teething issues. First Texas blew the last F75 revision and prior releases of several models all had issues. The Garrett AT detectors had numerous hardware issues. Everyone complains about Minelab - their actual problems have been less prominent but they continue to grapple with service issues. I used to put White's on a higher plane than the others but the MX Sport really blew that perception. XP 3.0 was quickly followed by 3.1 and 3.2 as bug fixes - at least you can do those at home! I just do not see any solution for the consumer but to avoid new releases of any sort by any manufacturer for the first 6 months minimum and possibly up to a year. Let others be the guinea pigs and only purchase well tried and proven products. Even that will not avoid a bad apple now and then, but it will avoid the systemic issues that seem to plague so many new releases. I agree that Nokta/Makro as new players, especially as they are based overseas, can less afford this kind of thing as many people are skeptical of newer brands. Perceptions are formed early on and are hard to change later. Nokta/Makro I would guess has people out there who will not consider the brand due to the various issues, fueled by so many new models so quickly. The competition tends to be much slower at model releases, and so the furor dies down and people forget - until the next new model comes along with a new set of issues. No doubt the new headphone issue will get sorted out. In the meantime it is just another thing that will reinforce a reputation for issues and problems that Nokta and Makro can ill afford when trying to make progress in new markets.

Wireless headphone and dongle set for the Racer 2 and Gold Racer is now shipping, but early reports note some volume control issues. http://www.metaldetectingforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=259&t=85902&start=20 Just a reminder - these work with the Makro Racer 2 and Gold Racer but not original Red Racer.

OK, I almost forgot about this thread but finally got back to it. First off, my apologies, because I am going to first give you exactly what you asked not to get - owners manual excerpts. The Nokta AU Gold Finder is basically a Makro Gold Racer in a different box, the main difference being a lack of LCD screen. Both machines have the iMask function. However, the Gold Racer manual goes into detail about how the iMask control and ID Filter interact specifically, and so provides a missing piece of the puzzle. The key passage in the Gold Racer manual makes clear that iMask interacts with the other settings and that it is also a setting of last resort. Ground balance, sensitivity, and ID Filter should all be adjusted first. If that does not work, put them at back at initial settings and then try iMask. I do not know this for a fact but it appears to me that iMask simply attenuates or suppresses extraneous ground noise. It may therefore also suppress weak target signals. In my use of both the AU Gold Finder and Makro Gold Racer I have found the effect to be very subtle and not anything near like the magic bullet implied by "increase the iMask level until the false signals are eliminated". My experience is that iMask does help eliminate weak chatter in bad ground but that the majority of the chatter in the worst ground remains if the other settings are too high. It is probable that even at the max iMask settings sensitivity will have to be reduced and ID Filter possibly increased to deal with the worst ground. The good news is I also note minimal loss of depth or sensitivity running at high iMask settings - again, the effect is quite subtle.

They are as different as GM and Chevy

Running a shovel fed sluice box rarely removes material from a stream. Nearly all material fed into hand sluices is excavated bank run material, though that material may once have been underwater.

65F100GUY - welcome to the forum! The Nokta AU Gold Finder is essentially just a Makro Gold Racer in a different package. They share coils, except coils for the Gold Finder do have longer cables in case you want to hip or chest mount the detector. The only two coils made specifically for the AU Gold Finder both come with it. To get a concentric you would have to get the Gold Racer coil with standard length (3') cable. Gold Racer coils (short cable) GR26 DD Search Coil 26 cm x 14 cm (10" x 5.5") Sensitive to both larger and smaller gold nuggets, it provides convenient use in all kinds of terrains. GR19 DD Search Coil 19 cm x 10 cm (7.5" x 4") Excellent on exposed bedrock or hunting around rocky areas or tight spaces. GR13 DD Search Coil 13 cm (5’’) More sentitive to smaller and shallow metals, it also provides convenient use in heavy trash areas. GR40 DD Search Coil 40 cm x 33.5 cm (15.5'' x 13'') (Optional) This waterproof search coil provides more depth and offers greater coverage enabling you to find targets faster. GR26C Concentric Search Coil 26 cm x 14 cm (10" x 5.5") (Optional) Especially in low mineralization, it may be more sensitive to small gold nuggets and may provide more depth compared to DD search coils. It also provides a cleaner target response and better discrimination on shallow targets. However, it gets more affected by the ground compared to DD search coils in highly mineralized areas.

No doubt you scoff. But did you know that stream fed sluice boxes and even a gold pan can be considered a pollutant "point source" under the Clean Water Act? Which can lead to this.... http://vtdigger.org/2016/06/27/state-reminds-gold-prospectors-to-obtain-permits-for-sluice-boxes/ http://www.rutlandherald.com/article/20160628/THISJUSTIN/306289995