Sun Ray Invader Probe Vs. Standalone Handhelds

[GB_Amateur]

This isn't at all a detailed comparison, but this sub-forum seems to be right place to put it.  I'm pretty sure these devices are no longer made for any detector models, but it might help someone thinking of buying a used one.  I bought a used FX-1 (for Fisher F75) recently.  I did look for reviews and found a few, but unless I read too fast those didn't tell the key features (particularly minuses).  This is not meant to be an overall review like you'd find in a magazine.  The other reviews you can find on the WWW do that.

The main thing to know about this device is that it is effectively a (passive) replacement/substitute coil for your detector.  It has a switch for changing between your main coil and the pinpointer probe -- only one operates at a time.

PLUS:  since it's using the detector electronics as would any coil, you get all the audible and visible readouts that you normally get, thus discrimination.  That sets it apart from every handheld standalone pinpointer I'm aware of.

MINUSES:  two big ones, IMO.  1) For the same reason that you get discrimination (using the detectors capabilities), if your detector is set in motion mode (which is the default and in many cases the only option on modern detectors), you have to be moving the probe to get it to sound off.  2) Ditto the reasoning above, the sensitivity depends upon what gain you've set your detector for your main coil.  In my case I had the F75 gain set to 50 (half scale) and the probe only went off when I got within about 1.5 in (~4 cm) from a piece of metal.  Compare that to the White's Bullseye TRX at 3 in. and the Garrett Carrot at 2.5 in.  The documentation I received (hard/impossible to find online, BTW) claims 3 inch depth.  I can believe that if I crank the F75 gain up to 99.

Sure, I could go to non-motion all-metal and I could crank up the gain.  But that's a lot of changing detector settings every time I want to dig.  I assume the detector's pinpoint mode would also work (it's basically non-motion all-metal) but on the F75 that requires holding down a spring-loaded switch.  That's not at all convenient when you're on the ground trying to probe for a target in a hole.  Further, one of the big reasons detectors went to motion mode in the first place is to be able to cancel/adjust-out electronics drift.  So even if you lock into non-motion all-metal I assume that could have a negative effect since often one can spend non-negligible time finding the target in the hole (uh, especially if you need to get to 1.5 inches to hear anything!).

As a novelty and possibly for special situations I can see using this device.  Unfortunately, unless I'm missing something, mine is going on the shelf and/or auction block.

[Steve Herschbach]

Very interesting! I never thought about the implications of the probe having to use whatever mode the detector is in - or the need to possibly change the mode in use. I know a lot of people swear by the Sun Ray probes (especially Minelab users) and I used to sell them, but never used one myself. It was always just more gear hanging on the detector than I wanted to deal with plus the fact they are only good for use on compatible detectors. The idea of having discrimination while probing is compelling but as you note the need to move the probe to get a disc reading negates that somewhat, especially if used in tight quarters, like a narrow hole.

I was also not aware the probes were not being made anymore, but a look at the Sun Ray website reveals that to be the case. A few dealers do appear to still have them however, which is no surprise since when I sold them they were a slow mover. Probably a victim finally of all the great new pinpointers hitting the market these days. Another good thing to know - thanks for the post!

[GB_Amateur]

1 hour ago, Steve Herschbach said:

I know a lot of people swear by the Sun Ray probes (especially Minelab users)....

Well, I'd like to hear from them.  Maybe I'm doing something sub-optimally = wrong.  I do know that my Minelab X-Terra 705 (which I don't think ever had an Invader made for it) has a lock-on button for the pinpoint mode.  That would make things a bit easier/better.

And thanks for posting the pic!  I assume that one (DX-1) is for the White's DFX.  As you said, they are detector specific.  I also wonder how many of the ones that can be found for sale new online are really there in stock.  The models for the Minelabs sell for way more, used on Ebay, than some of the (new) listed prices I was finding even for the exact same model.

[Tiftaaft]

Great review GB!.   I thought I was the only one that didn't care for the "in line probe". 

When I first bought my etrac I read a lot of the forum posts about it..  the Sun-Ray x-1 probe was a "must have" according to a majority of the etrac users ad well as explorer users.  The X-1 was one of the first to be shelved by the mfg, giving it an almost cult status, and by the time I was convinced I needed one, the old supply and demand market kicked in.  I finally did pony up the market rates and get ine, but having spent most of my learning curve with the carrot,, I noticed the differences you outlined very quickly.  

Once I committed to getting down to the ground, I really didn't care if I dug several pieces of iron to ultimately find my target, so the discrimination you get with an attached probe is cool, but a novelty.  I also found it slowed me down to have to fiddle with my machine once I was digging.... moving it to pin point mode, watching the screen if I was interested in the id readings... and of course.... forgetting to flip the bypass switch to put it back into main coil mode and sweeping across the field in silence until I realized... (ok, maybe that was only me..haha).  Plus, the added weight on the wrong side of the swing weight balance..  It didn't take me long to switch back to the carrot.  Better sensitivity with good feedback (slow beep = far away to solid tone = right on it). 

After reading this thread... now I am thinking it may be time to move it out of the corner of my office, and into someone's hands that might appreciate it more than I do.

Tim.

 

[V3i/MXT Pro]

Sun Rays are great but the extra weight, wires, switch, cost and detector compatibility make it a niche accessory. They competed well against the original White's Bullseye and Kellyco Automax probes but not so much against modern handheld pinpointers. Now if someone would just come out with a waterproof handheld, that has ferrous and non-ferrous tones, at a reasonable price we would be set... Did someone say Minelab Pro Find 35? ?

[Steve Herschbach]

Here is a very new video that shows a Sun-Ray probe in use throughout. The big sell was target id via the detector. And as V3i/MXT Pro note -weight, wires, boxes, etc. were a turnoff for some. They were most popular early on with Minelab DD coil models that challenged lots of people's pinpointing skills.

 

[Goldpick]

This is probably where XP's Mi-6 pinpointer missed the boat with regards to being able to run through one of the Deus programs, hence offering some form of ID or discrimination.  Only problem is the Deus shuts off the coil when the pinpointer is in operation.  

Whether there would be any way in future they could makes this a viable option, especially considering it is completely wireless, it would do away with all the negatives on the Sunray probes.  First XP need to address the reliability of the Mi-6 switching before considering anything else.