Deus 2, Nokta Multi, Equinox 1000, All In 2022!

[☠ Cipher]

3 hours ago, abenson said:

Yea I think NM made a big mistake offering the Simplex with all its features at such a low price. I've seen it cannibalize its upper end models since it's release. Having owned both Racer models, the Inpact and the Multi Kruzer. After getting a Simplex I personally see no reason the buy their upper end machines. The Simplex offers everything I'm interested in as far as the current single frequency NM models go. The SMF may change that.

The SMF machine should change that. Dilek has said it will be nothing like the Simplex in terms of how it operates/performance. They will share only the shaft. Other than that we are promised an entirely different animal that will become it’s new flagship. 

[☠ Cipher]

5 hours ago, mh9162013 said:

Perhaps it's because the Deus, despite it's age, is still considered a high-end machine.

When N/M is mentioned on message boards, it's likely most often with respect to the Simplex. The Simplex's greatest strength isn't its technology, but the value of what you get for each unit of currency you spend.

So no, you're not the only one who assumes the Deus II will outperform the N/M SMF offering.

I’m assuming this too, rightly or wrongly, and I think XP has the best chance of equaling or even pulling an upset on the equinox. I don’t currently own a Deus because I put a priority on other machines and sold mine early on for reasons not necessarily related to performance. I know what a sophisticated tool the Deus is, and I’m not even referring to the wireless innovation. It’s an incredibly versatile tool with incredible depth and separation. It took single and selectable frequency to another level Nokta has not quite been able to replicate. Even equinox could not replicate its performance among commingled items. So I’m expecting a lot from the guys at XP on this release. But I’m hoping to be surprised (again) by Nokta Makro. They’ve surprised me before with max depth, which is incredibly hard to come by these days. 

[mh9162013]

8 hours ago, abenson said:

Yea I think NM made a big mistake offering the Simplex with all its features at such a low price. I've seen it cannibalize its upper end models since it's release.

I never thought of N/M as being a victim of the Simplex's success, but I suppose that's possible. Or, maybe it was a calculated move, with the Simplex serving as a "loss leader." While I may not be as "hardcore" as some metal detectorists, I think I'm more into the hobby than a casual user. And the Simplex definitely increased the brand awareness of N/M for me.

[phrunt]

Yes it did, but also people were offloading detectors like Racer 2's and so on and just buying a Simplex.  When I was buying my Simplex a guy was selling his Racer 2 with 2 coils for $100 less than a Simplex as he wanted to "upgrade" to a Simplex, I was tempted to buy it instead as it supports Nel coils ?

Although I think they priced the Simplex in the right price range where it needed to be to compete with the new offerings like the Vanquish and now Apex and even First Texas come to the party with their F19 derived paint job the Bounty Hunter Time Ranger Pro, other detectors on the market that have similar features and performance to these new entry level type detectors especially from FT are just priced too high.  We've largely got the company you'd least expect for this change in market direction to thank for it, so thanks Minelab for lowing the price of performance ?

In the next year or two most single frequency machines should end up in the entry level category, or discontinued as we start to see the new breed of detectors as who's going to be in the market for one other than the odd Gold prospecting VLF where single frequency is still viable.  XP may even keep the original Deus and use it as a cheaper model to compete in a different market to the Deus 2.

There will be those that like to hold on and justify how good their single frequency detector is and how they love the brand it came from and so on.... admirable of course but times and changing, and they're also not putting money into the bank of the manufacturers as they've settled on their machine.... for the past 15 years.

Having 20 or so models from a brand now is getting to be ridiculous when there are detectors on the market like the Equinox that can virtually do it all, it just highlights how bad the brands that have a model for every day of a the month really are behind.

The Simplex was something Nokta needed to do, it reached many users hands and took some of the entry level market they'd otherwise not have and it's surprising how many users that would in the past just buy higher end are now also owning a Vanquish, Apex or Simplex... the same people didn't blink at buying a Go-Find or early Ace series detector.  It would have also been their best selling detector ever, I'm very sure of that and they're in the market to sell detectors.

The brands of old are fading away and now the focus will be on these multi frequency detectors, although I wasn't seeing much action in the forum on the single frequency detectors historical areas prior to all these new ones.

[☠ Cipher]

1 hour ago, phrunt said:

The brands of old are fading away and now the focus will be on these multi frequency detectors, although I wasn't seeing much action in the forum on the single frequency detectors historical areas prior to all these new ones.

This was supposed to happen in the 90s, but it’s finally happening now. Those who don’t make a competitive SMF with selectable options will find themselves irrelevant really quick. I’ve been of this mindset for years. Right now, all my metal detectors aside from Simplex are SMF. The only reason I have a Simplex is that to me it’s too good a bargain not to have around. 
 

The question now is what comes next. I think the answer is Truncated Half-Sine, something Tarsacci appears to have under the hood (and continues to work on a better all arounder), Minelab has been working on for years (according to their patents), and which Garrett now owns a patent on. A couple years from now we may find ourselves excited all over again as the industry transitions to Half Sine, even simultaneous or sequential multi half sine if there is such a thing. Half Sine seems to be the bridge or connecting tissue we need between VLF discrimination, and Pulse induction depth/ground handling until someone develops sufficient PI disc algorithms and circuits. Basically a hybrid of VLF and Pulse. I just wonder who will be the first to break through on a true all arounder to start this game all over again. 

[mh9162013]

8 hours ago, phrunt said:

other detectors on the market that have similar features and performance to these new entry level type detectors especially from FT are just priced too high.

Absolutely, especially the Garrett AT Pro and AT Max! It's not that either are bad machines, but for what Garrett wants to sell them for...they turn into bad machines.

I spent $290 for my AT Max and I like it. We'll see how it stands up to an Equinox 600, but for $290, it's a great machine! But if I had to pay $590 or $690 for it, I'd be bashing the AT Max like it's nobody'a business.

So I think Garrett made a mistake keeping their pricing scheme such that the AT Max was a "flagship" detector. I don't think it would have been that bad for Garrett to have their Ace 400 or 300 as their new "entry level" model and significantly lower the price of the AT Max.

I understand premium pricing is a thing, but there's only so far that can go, in my opinion, especially when it relies in maintaining marketing efforts that, from what I've heard and seen on Youtube, might not be holding up as well anymore.

[abenson]

Ya know that more of think about these new SMF metal detectors coming out the more I think what's the point of getting yet another metal detector. How much better can they really be than what's already on the market? Especially the Equinox. Don't get me wrong I'm excited to see what each will do and I've already pretty much committed to getting the Deus 2 unless the price is too high.

Ok so we already know that there's no perfect detector. Some have features that others don't and vica verse. But as far as performance goes, just how much better can we expect over the Equinox? Short of a PI the Equinox is by far the deepest in my mineralized soil. In mild soil the depth for most detectors is pretty close. How much better can the target ID get than say the Equinox, etrac/CTX or a V3i? Now granted the Deus is a very fast machine but so are the Nokta Makro machines. More so than the Equinox. But set up correctly the Equinox is no slouch. So how much faster at target separation can we expect without sacrificing depth.

I've done countless comparisons between practically every detector available in real life situations. Truth be known 90% of all the targets we seek can be found with most modern detectors in normal non specialized sites. By specialized I mean saltwater beaches, prospecting or very high mineralization.

So I ask again what's the point of getting yet another metal detector that might be say 1% better than what's already available?

I guess it's like a new car. The 10 year old one will get you from point A to point B just as good as a new one. But it sure is nice driving a new car with all the modern bells, whistles and a new warranty.

[Guest Tnsharpshooter]

All 3 detectors sound like they will be serious detectors.

[NCtoad]

6 hours ago, abenson said:

Ya know that more of think about these new SMF metal detectors coming out the more I think what's the point of getting yet another metal detector. How much better can they really be than what's already on the market? Especially the Equinox. Don't get me wrong I'm excited to see what each will do and I've already pretty much committed to getting the Deus 2 unless the price is too high.

Ok so we already know that there's no perfect detector. Some have features that others don't and vica verse. But as far as performance goes, just how much better can we expect over the Equinox? Short of a PI the Equinox is by far the deepest in my mineralized soil. In mild soil the depth for most detectors is pretty close. How much better can the target ID get than say the Equinox, etrac/CTX or a V3i? Now granted the Deus is a very fast machine but so are the Nokta Makro machines. More so than the Equinox. But set up correctly the Equinox is no slouch. So how much faster at target separation can we expect without sacrificing depth.

I've done countless comparisons between practically every detector available in real life situations. Truth be known 90% of all the targets we seek can be found with most modern detectors in normal non specialized sites. By specialized I mean saltwater beaches, prospecting or very high mineralization.

So I ask again what's the point of getting yet another metal detector that might be say 1% better than what's already available?

I guess it's like a new car. The 10 year old one will get you from point A to point B just as good as a new one. But it sure is nice driving a new car with all the modern bells, whistles and a new warranty.

I guess it’s the hope that for those of us who are really passionate about metal detecting a new detector will give us a few more finds from our already pounded sites.  And let’s face it:  it’s not the detectors holding us back, it’s access to new sites that have had very little to zero activity being detected.  Like you mentioned above, I could take my nox to a virgin site and be pretty confident that after hitting it a few times that I have gotten 99% of any good finds out of it.