Shelton Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 13 hours ago, steveg said: JCR -- it kind of SEEMS that way...but not sure...and I doubt we'll ever know. Shelton -- to clarify, you started out in HC, and then switched to LC and changed a few other settings, and as a result, you were able to have better success? Steve I was start from Fast and Depth audio profile and after that I was switch to LC. I should to use Fast in iron busy place but LC is better for me. It was amazing feeling to start pull masked coins again… one big copper was from corner of site. Believe me I was scan that place about two years with all other brands with different settings and patterns - direction vs target. After that click and I was start to find coins again. Not one but 8 more in 30 minutes. But I need more time with Manticore. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB_Amateur Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 Someone ( @EL NINO77 ) needs to do these tests with a spectrum analyzer so we can get an idea of the frequencies being used for each mode. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveg Posted February 25, 2023 Author Share Posted February 25, 2023 PUHH -- Very interesting. I wish I knew more of what I was looking at, with those graphs/that equipment, and I wish someone could translate the Russian to English! BUT -- it was clear that "amplitude" (power?) of the MC signal trace is DEFINITELY greater than EQX. It was also obvious that the amplitude of the MC signal trace, while running in both ATHC and ATLC, was the same. ONLY when switching to beach mode, was the amplitude reduced. So, can it safely be concluded that there is NOT more xmit power in ATHC, vs. ATLC? If so, this would suggest perhaps it's the lower frequency weighting that makes the machine more "unstable" in iron? Another interesting note...the signal trace in beach mode on the MC (like in the EQX) shows reduced "amplitude" (power?) of the signal by some percentage...which we already knew. BUT -- if you note the amplitude on the graph for MC beach mode...it's interesting that while it's definitely reduced compared to the other MC modes, its reduction moved it ONLY down to the same as the amplitude of the REGULAR hunt modes in EQX (with EQX beach mode being lower still). So, said another way, I tentatively conclude: 1. MC "xmit power" greater than EQX... 2. MC "xmit power" the same, in ATHC and ATLC (ONLY lower in beach mode) 3. MC beach mode "xmit power" is reduced from other MC modes, BUT -- reduced to the level of EQX STANDARD modes... 4. EQX beach mode "xmit power" was the lowest of all, lower than EQX standard modes, and MUCH lower than MC standard modes AND beach modes... Interesting. And please, if anyone more knowledgeable about electricity/electronics than I can point out flaws in my understanding, please do! I would like to understand this properly... Steve 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveg Posted February 25, 2023 Author Share Posted February 25, 2023 7 hours ago, Shelton said: I was start from Fast and Depth audio profile and after that I was switch to LC. I should to use Fast in iron busy place but LC is better for me. It was amazing feeling to start pull masked coins again… one big copper was from corner of site. Believe me I was scan that place about two years with all other brands with different settings and patterns - direction vs target. After that click and I was start to find coins again. Not one but 8 more in 30 minutes. But I need more time with Manticore. OK, so you started in All-Terrain Fast (thinking it would be best in iron), but you were not doing well with that mode; so, THEN you switched to All-Terrain Low Conductors, and got drastically different results. That is very interesting... Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EL NINO77 Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 On 2/25/2023 at 4:59 AM, JCR said: Higher TX output could cause the falsing & instability some are reporting. A lower weighted frequency mix should not. And yes, we may never know per Minelab. Higher TX performance is not new for detectors,, from my detectors I have TX Bost Whites Spectra V3 detectors, then the Vista Gold Gain 30 khz detector in bost mode,, and the AKA Signum MFD detector...in Turbo Mode... All these 3 detectors, in addition to the possibility of turning on the TX boost, also have a manually adjustable RX Gain, so you can really adapt these detectors to field conditions... There are terrains where turning on the increased TX boost will work much better than normal TX... mostly in mild and moderately difficult terrain conditions... where it will work really excellently and will actually increase the range by 10-15..% more.. ..These are also certainly terrains that absorb the power of the detector... and work with a TX boost will really be more effective in depth... a depth that you cannot reach without a TX boost... In highly mineralized terrains, increased TX may no longer be the best option, but it can still work quite well... provided that we set the RX gain on the detector to a sufficiently low level.. In practice, the increased TX bost is really quite usable... with the exception of terrains with very high mineralization... and moderate and moderately demanding terrains will bring a real depth bonus.. ...If the weather is good... at the end of the week... then I will have the opportunity to test the Manticore,, as well as my Equinox 800 and possibly the CTX,,, on moderate but also on heavily mineralized terrain... so I will be able to write something about Manticore... 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phrunt Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 I was thinking about the videos above, and beach mode runs the same level of coil power as the original Equinox runs in it's normal modes. All other modes have higher power. Beach mode is the mode I was reporting as having the most stable target ID's in higher gains, I had to lower sensitivity levels in all other mode to get my ID's as stable as Beach mode in higher gains and to get it similar to the Equinox ID stability required rather low sensitivity of about 16. I wonder if the stability with ID's is related to this new 50% more power to the coil stuff. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunterjunk Posted March 1, 2023 Share Posted March 1, 2023 The old saying " horses for courses " comes to mind . For the last couple of weeks I have been hunting a paddock that is a combination of basalt soil and ironstone . Touching the ground with the magnet on my pick results in a ball of ironstone pebbles sticking to it . Add copious amounts of iron from about 15 hut sites and the detector is going nuts . Last week I used ATHC and fought the detector the whole time . Last Monday I used ATLC as suggested by the OP . Vastly quieter and more pleasant to use ! Could use much higher sensitivity but by the end of the day I felt the mode lacked depth . Tuesday I ran ATG which also tamed the ground allowing sens as high as 26 and found 4 coins in a small area that I had run over the day before . This sort of ground is never going to give great depth for a vlf but ATG works on this spot . The bonus was that after an 8 hour hunt I still had one third battery capacity left which is more in line with the beach modes . 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveg Posted March 4, 2023 Author Share Posted March 4, 2023 Hunterjunk -- Thanks for the feedback. I'm glad you had a similar experience, when switching to ATLC. On my last hunt (just a couple of hours hunting), I also tried ATG, and found it a bit noisier than ATLC, but not TOO bad, and certainly NOT as falsy as ATHC. So, it was manageable, and I did find one fairly deep silver coin, so I consider that a positive. That said, I got a silver the prior hunt in ATLC also, and while it wasn't quite as deep, I did dig a pretty deep wheat cent, so I don't think ATLC is a COMPLETE slouch on depth, in my dirt. Your site sounds MUCH more challenging, though... I need to make some time to do some thorough testing in my test garden... With that said, I'm just hoping that Minelab tweaks things a bit, in an "update," that tames the falsing somewhat in ATHC, because that's the mode I'd prefer to be using, as a deep coin hunter, if at all possible... Steve 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattlehead Posted March 5, 2023 Share Posted March 5, 2023 A few days ago I ran ATLC at one of my sites that has a lot of iron. I set the upper limit at 10, recovery speed at 3, and had the disc set up as a US coin pattern. It ran very quiet, stable and allowed more sensitivity than ATHC. No issues with falsing whatsoever. I agree, it does seem a little quieter than ATG as well. I didn’t dig any super deep targets but at this particular site they tend to only run in the 5-6” range. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveg Posted March 5, 2023 Author Share Posted March 5, 2023 Rattlehead, Thanks for tossing in your experience. This is really good to hear, and it suggests that what I'm experiencing here is also repeatable in some other places/dirt types. Hopefully, this information is making its way to Minelab, in the event that there is something they may be able to "tweak" to allow a quieter experience when running ATHC... Steve 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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