mh9162013

I considered buying a Safari. I heard it was a great detector. However, for the price, I wasn't willing to accept its limitations.

Thanks Monte! I think right now, I'll focus on getting the 5x8 coil (unless I find some fantastic deal on the 4.5 hockey puck).

Thanks for your insight, Jeff. Question: Would you recommend the smaller concentric coil (6.5x9) over the 4.5 hockey puck for hunting really trashy sites assuming the primary goal is finding coins? I think no matter what "specialty" coil(s) I get, I'm going to get the 5x8.

So if I went back to the construction site, which coil would you recommend I use? The 6x9 concentric or something else?

I think I see what you're getting at. Let me use some examples to see if I'm understanding you correctly. Scenario 1: an iron target next to a silver coin and you're using a DD coil - if the coil and metal detector don't have the ability to separate the coin from the iron, the iron will mask the coin. If in zero discrimination mode, you'll hear iron. If in discrimination mode to only hear/see silver coins, you'll hear/see nothing at all. Scenario 2: an iron target next to a silver coin and you're using a concentric coil - if the coil and metal detector don't have the ability to separate the coin from the iron, the iron and coin targets will "average out." So If in zero discrimination mode, you'll hear a tone or see a VDI that indicates a mid-conductor (give or take).

Are you saying that a concentric coil can handle trashier sites better than a DD coil? Or are you saying that a concentric coil can handle good targets mixed in with iron targets better, even when the iron trash is located close to the good targets that might otherwise get masked out?

Sounds like that coil might be great for me. I like to hunt tot lots and areas with lots of trash and potentially shallow targets. When I get a permission, I usually avoid digging deep. Even when there's no risk of damage to lawns or yards, I have limited time to hunt and it's usually not worth the added effort and time to dig for a deep target...at least that's my thought process and hunting strategy.

If you had the 5x8 on your AT Max and you could choose from b/w the stock 8.5x11 or a third party large coil, like the NEL Storm, which would you choose and why? And if the 4.5 inch hockey puck isn't designed for trashy ground, what's it good for?

You can also contact Garrett and after giving them your serial number, ask them if it's a legit unit or not.

I got in a few hours of hunting at an interesting permission this weekend. It's the construction site for an expansion to my local library. They already cleared out much of the top 6" of dirt, trees and shrubs. So all that's left are a few inches or rocks/rubble and sand, then highly mineralized clay underneath. Oh, and trash. Lots of trash. There's so much trash, it's impossible to ground balance in that area. So the approach I took was going into custom mode and notching out anything that was 68 (or so) and below. Basically, I was looking for coins (except nickels). I noticed that I'd often get a lot of short high tone "chirps" that I could not get to repeat, or could only repeat once or twice. I guessed that my detector was getting a "high VDI" target, but due to the trash and the size of my coil (stock 8.5x11), it was struggling to separate the "target" from the trash I had notched out. I also had sensitivity around 3 or 4, although boosted it to 6 or 8 to get a better read on a potential target if I thought I might have something. I did this because at least 6 inches of the top ground material had been moved into large piles or taken away by dump trucks. So I figured if there's anything good in the ground, it wouldn't be deeper than 6 inches or so. And if there's anything good that's deeper than that, I didn't want to spend the effort to dig it. I was digging in ground that was so soft and muddy due to heavy rains, I was sinking into the ground worse than wet sand. All that being said, here's the reason for this post: It's my understanding that I would have had a much easier time sifting through this construction site for coins if I had a smaller coil. The top 2 contenders for me right now are the 5x8 Garrett and the 4 inch Garrett hockey puck. Is my understanding correct? And if so, what would you all recommend if I could only pick just one of those coils? Or would you recommend both...or a different one? Also, another reason I'm thinking about a smaller coil is to reduce the weight of my machine. My current thinking is to get the 5x8 and use that full time, with the hockey puck on occasion. Then I sell the 8.5x11. And in the rare cases I need full depth AND there's little trash, I buy a NEL Storm or something along those lines. I'm considering the smaller coil b/c this isn't the first time I've received a permission to hunt a promising location that's filled with a lot of trash. Thanks ahead!

Welcome!

"Malicious compliance" Love it!

I hear ya. Whenever I hunt a private permission, I always try to go out of my way to pick up any loose trash that might be in or on their yard. When I show them my finds, I also make sure they can see the trash I picked up. Not to get brownie points, but to leave a good impression and "pay it back" so to speak. I also always offer to show them my finds. I don't offer to give it back to them, but if they ask to keep it, I let them (of course). (Un)fortunately, of the permissions I've gotten so far, the best/most I've found are a few clad coins. So there's never been a potential issue of any disagreement over who keeps what. But you can sometimes get a "feel" for what a property owner will expect or demand when you find something. I have one neighbor that I may get a permission from very soon since I got him interested in the hobby and he's asked me to come over and help him with his new machine. But I've talked to him before and I get the strong feeling that if I found anything in his yard, he would expect to keep it.

Whatever happens, good luck!

The legal hassle isn't even the worst part. The worst part is the uncertainty. No matter how ironclad a contract is, there's always a chance it doesn't stand up in court. Maybe it's because you get a rogue judge. Perhaps there's some technicality that not even a $1,500-an-hour attorney from Cravath would have been able to catch. Either way, there's still a tremendous amount of uncertainty. The whole point of a contract is to reduce uncertainty. But in the context of metal detecting, they often don't provide the reassurance that most people think they will provide.

I think that's what I'm going to have to do with my brother-in-law (and other people I get permission from, too). The brother-in-law situation is different b/c of the distinct possibility of a significant find(s).

If "all" I found was a large mass a silver, that would still be quite the find! I mean, how many people can say they found a silver nugget the size of a football made out of coins? 😛 Your relative's property sounds very promising, too. Do you think you will ever hunt it? At least you've laid the ground work of mentioning hunting it and your relative hasn't rejected the idea.

The problem is that this person is family. So even if whatever I propose is reasonable or strongly in their favor, if they get even an inkling that I'm taking advantage of them (even if they're 100% wrong), it could create eggshell-walking scenarios for a very long time. Then, there's chance that we have these discussions, and all I find is a few bucks in clad including a few wheat pennies. Then I walked on those toes for nothing. Am I over thinking this? Probably. But it's hard to get motivated to hunt any property knowing there's a distinct possibility that I may get to keep only a small percentage of what I find. Right now, the plan is to get more familiar with my AT Max and set up a camera system with it to document hunts. Then, I ask for permission with the expectation that I keep nothing except a token find (maybe a coin or two) and the pictures/video I take of the process. And if he ends up letting me keep more of what I find (50%, 100%, etc.) that's just gravy.

I live in a town where there are numerous private homes that are I know are littered with old coins. In my front yard alone, I found 2 silver dimes (a Merc from 1916, a Rosie from 1950s) and an IHC/IHP from 1889, if I recall correctly. These 3 finds were in a front yard with a sidewalk and road frontage that's not more than 80 feet long. There is grid after grid after grid of these type of houses with front yards and sidewalks or walkways that have been traversed for 70+ years. If I could hunt any piece of grass covered property within a 1/2 mile radius of my house, and you gave me 48 hours (excluding travel time) to hunt the properties (I'd be using a Vanquish 340 and AT Max), I am confident I could find about 40 silver coins. I think there'd be maybe a half-a-dozen or so barbers and/or walkers, too. Is it b/c I'm good? No, it's just that there are so many homes that are 80+ years old with sidewalks that were laid down many decades ago There are 3 properties in particular where I can almost see the silver in the ground. So why haven't I hunted them yet? One, I haven't had the time since COVID hit. Two, I already asked one for permission, but it's a rental and they said to ask the realtor. I'm debating on what approach to take next with that property. Three, another property is being renovated and has passed through multiple owners the past few years. There's rarely anyone on the property and if there is, I'm not sure if they own it or are a tenant...or are a contractor hired to fix up the house. If COVID doesn't get so bad and school remains in session, I should have time, maybe next week, to pack up my metal detector gear and just walk up and down my neighborhood going door to door, asking for permission to hunt. Oh, and I forgot. There's an old family property about 20 minutes away that my wife's grandfather used to own. He had a workshop there where he kept one or more glass jugs (of loose change that my wife said he collected since probably the 1920s or 30s). The workshop apparently burned down or blew up a few decades ago and the coins from those jugs were never recovered. Why haven't I hunted that property yet? B/c if I do and get skunked, I'll be disappointed. And if it holds all the valuable coins I think it does, it might create some family turmoil since the property is currently owned by my brother-in-law. I honestly don't know how to approach a family permission where there's a reasonable chance (albeit small), that I could find coins worth hundreds if not thousands of dollars.

If I think it's a coin, I dig it, even if I have a feeling it's a crusty and deteriorated Zincoln. I keep my Zincolns...have about 40 or so that are in too rough shape to cash in. I still can't bring myself to throw them out, though. Zincolns need luvin' too...

This might be the listing he's referring to: https://www.ebay.com/itm/384324313192?hash=item597b83a068%3Ag%3AptEAAOSwhj1hFAnV&LH_ItemCondition=4 And yes, even with 2 coils. It's so hard to sell used metal detectors, unless it's a Deus or Equinox, basically. If time is of the essence, that's one thing. But if you can wait a few months to buy your machine, I don't think you should buy that detector I linked to unless you could get everything for $250 or less. Keep in mind what a used F75 will go for, too. Of course, and F75 isn't an F70, but performance-wise, they are comparable.

Based on what used F70s and F75s can go for on eBay, I wouldn't touch a used F70 for more than $250. That's assuming the warranty is not transferrable.

I've heard that Tesoro's discrimination is very underrated. Maybe one day I'll be able to see it for myself.

When searching for my next detector, I was seriously considering a Tesoro. I figured using the "Tesoro roll" method of determining what's under my coil would be a lot of fun. And plus, I have learned to love the look of Tesoros with their knobs. Initially, I hated the look, but now I think they have a nostalgic feel almost like a post-modern form of steam punk. I still want a Tesoro and will keep my eyes open for one at a great price. So congrats on the find, dogodog! When I can't detect, I've made it a "side hobby" to look for detectors at low prices (whether to flip for a profit and/or play with, but have little guilt doing so). I've realized that finding a great deal on a machine is as fun as finding silver. Ha! No, not really, but when you can't hunt, it's a nice substitute.

I have two theories in response to this rhetorical question. One, their accountants crunched the numbers and concluded it wouldn't produce the necessary return on investment. For example, waterproofing is tough to do add to something after it's already been designed. Then add the increased warranty repair costs that's likely to follow and I can see why this hasn't been done. Two, is it possible FTP doesn't care about long-term profits and is only in the metal detecting industry to make a quick buck, then leave? In other words, they acquire one or more businesses with substantial customer goodwill. They cut production costs (ie quality) adjust their marketing schemes to make the quick sale and wait for short term profits. Then once the target consumers have already been sold to or lost due lower quality products, FTP just sells off the divisions that are no longer profitable in a fire sale. But they don't care, b/c they already made back their investment and then some.