Jeff McClendon

Dave, you have an uncanny ability to post something that is often accurate but at the same time controversial while being just what the previous post was trying to suggest not to do. That's just fine since what you wrote needs to be said. For me, it's all about knowing one's detector in the long run. A person that used to be on here a lot recently posted a short video directly aimed at me which was about the level of sensitivity to really small targets of the Manticore and Deus 2. He said very accurately that if a person is after really small targets, the Manticore was a much better choice for that. Then he said in reference to Deus 2 "some people just don't want to dig small targets". So, in some ways I can see his point. Both detectors have simultaneous multi frequency gold nugget prospecting modes and other SMF sensitive modes which top out at around 40 kHz. Deus 2 however, seems to have a limit on how small a target it will detect easily using those SMF sensitive modes that is not the same or even close to the same as other current SMF detectors. There are advantages and disadvantages to that. Knowing a detector is not going to readily sound off on roughly 0.1 gram and smaller bits of magnetite, hot rock, manmade iron, foil, can slaw shards, lead shards, brass shards like some other SMF detectors do, takes a whole bunch of targets out of the equation. And yes Dave, that general insensitivity to those sized targets seems to be system wide when using the sensitive 40 kHz weighted FMF Deus 2 modes. I know this is the Deus 2 forum. It is one of my favorite detectors. However, it's not perfect and there is no shame in that. Some have very shrewdly said that the FMF gold prospecting mode on Deus 2 was not as sensitive to small gold nuggets as the ORX in order to not damage ORX/HF coil sales. That could be true. So, I used to believe and say on this forum that Deus 1 or the ORX in their VCO gold prospecting modes would out perform Deus 2 in its Mono mode for small gold prospecting. I just assumed that Mono mode on Deus 2 was the same as Deus 1 Fast like it was a direct transfer from Deus 1. I was testing the ORX with the 9" HF coil in Gold 2 at 58.8 kHz versus Deus 2 with the 9" FMF coil in wide open Mono at 45 kHz. The winner should have been obvious. WRONG. Now, after revisiting at least the ORX, I don't believe that anymore. I was wrong......Deus 2's Mono mode has more potential for sensitivity to really small targets than I thought. For me, that is good news and could be good news for other Deus 2 users that are land/freshwater based that want to dig really small shallower targets, whatever they are. For you saltwater hunters....??? Anyone with a Deus 1 or ORX with the HF elliptical coil that also has a Deus 2 with 9" coil, I would really like to hear what you find out when you compare Deus 2 Mono 45 kHz with disc on -6.4, Pitch tones, versus Deus 1 or ORX HF elliptical in their Gold prospecting modes with the frequency set as high as it can go on .25 gram and smaller targets like #8 and #9 lead or steel bird shot.

This topic is definitely about small to really small gold nugget prospecting using Deus, Deus 2 and the ORX with the Nox 800 and Legend used as a yardstick. Not trying to get anyone riled up at me or Minelab or Nokta. If people that have detected in other situations on other types of targets extensively, head to head with the detectors mentioned here want to go at it about which detector is the GOAT, go for it but start your own topic please. My reason for starting this topic was mostly to talk about Deus 2 Mono for gold prospecting and how good it actually is.

I will definitely use it at high altitude sometimes when I want a detector that weighs next to nothing since I don't use the full remote and just hunt by tones for most of my XP gold prospecting. The likelihood of Deus 2 beating out the Equinox 800 or Legend is less than 0% at this point however as far as overall performance.

Sounds like a good comparison to make even though the coil size and operating frequency differences are pretty substantial.

I have been very critical of the XP Deus 2's FMF Gold Field mode and its level of sensitivity on gold nuggets starting at roughly 0.5 grams and especially in the 0.25 to .01 gram range. Nothing has changed in that regard. However after using an ORX for a few days that I came by while trying to help out a friend of mine who decided to move on from the ORX, I am definitely changing my opinion about Deus 2's Mono mode for small gold nugget prospecting with the FMF 9" coil. In the past, I have found plenty of sub gram gold with the ORX. I trusted it very much. I did not have much faith in Deus 2 setup similar to the ORX. I was able to do some test garden and actual field comparisons in some really bad dirt. I used a 0.15 gram flat nugget and a chunkier 0.25 gram nugget along with doing some wild target hunting on non-ferrous targets that turned out to be roughly #6 bird shot pellets that also weighed in at a little over 0.1 grams. Deus 2 Mono using Pitch tones with discrimination on -6.4, frequency 45 kHz, sensitivity 95, reactivity 2 or 2.5, audio response 3 or 4, threshold 8 to 10 simply out performed the ORX with 9" HF coil in Gold 1 or Gold 2 using 50 to 58.8 kHz with otherwise similar settings. I had to the lower the ORX reactivity setting to 1 in order to come close to the sensitivity of Deus 2 Mono with reactivity on 2. Using reactivity 1 on the ORX made it very unstable however in high iron mineralization. Only having reactivity settings of 1, 2, 2.5 and 3 on the ORX and no adjustable audio response settings really handcuffed it compared to all of the reactivity settings that Deus 2 Mono has=0, 0.5, 1, 1.5, 2, 2.5, 3, 4, its 8 adjustable audio response settings and its very incremental negative number discrimination settings. So, I am going to be using Deus 2 Mono a lot more for gold prospecting head to head with the Equinox 800 and Legend using their SMF Gold modes in Multi and set on 40 kHz. I don't expect it to compete with those two, but maybe it will do better than I have thought previously.

Thanks for posting Steve and for all you do to help all of us have a fantastic forum. I still have Equinox 800 with upgraded collapsible shaft and 3 different coils, 6", 10X5" and stock 11" along with several different Bluetooth APTX LL wireless headphones and earbuds. Love the 800 for just about anything except submerging it (out of warranty) Huge fan of the WM08 WiStream module too!!!! Nokta Legend....what the 800 lacked feature wise and in build quality the Legend provides very well and it has faster recovery speed, better target separation, better target ID system and it doesn't leak. Uses the same third party BT APTX LL wireless headphones and earbuds as the Equinox 800. Love the Legend for just about anything. XP Deus 2 is great for everything except gold prospecting. However, after testing it head to head for a few days against an ORX with 9" HF coil using Gold 1 or Gold 2 at 50 to 58 kHz, it looks like the Deus 2 in Mono with the 9" coil running at 45 kHz, -6.4 disc in Pitch tones with all other settings pretty close out performs the ORX mostly because there are more reactivity settings on Deus 2 and there are also audio response settings on Deus 2. However, running Deus 2 in its FMF Gold Field mode...........no way. GPX 6000......I splurged on it and often regret it BUT it is a fantastic PI gold prospecting detector due to its extreme sensitivity and lightweight. Whites TDI Pulse Scan (big box) with Reg Sniff mods. Great for relic hunting, deep coin/jewelry hunting and even for a gold prospecting backup when the 6000 goes nuts in EMI. Really smooth operation with a lot more sensitivity to small targets than I was expecting. Nice to have all of Steve's and other's hints on how to use it for coin, jewelry and relic hunting on this forum too. Scratches my "love Whites forever" itch.

This is a depth/sensitivity comparison video between the Profind 40 and the Garrett Pro Pointer AT (aka Carrot). It's done by Tony (5280 Adventures and Relics Radio Podcast) who is a personal friend of mine (not online friend, I mean in person, hunting buddy friend). I think you can accept whatever he says and shows in this video as pretty accurate. He does not have any affiliation with these companies anymore and is very independent and truthful. Anyone can make mistakes but I would trust this video.

I have relatives in Edmonton I visit yearly. I would be happy to have them sent to their address so I can bring them back across the border.

Where are the lawsuits against Garrett and XP for infringement of the '839 patent owned by Minelab? Both of those companies have SMF detectors that are sold in the USA and American Detector distributes those detectors and their parts. Minelab/Codan has made millions of dollars on the sale of their Equinox 600/800 detectors and rightfully so since they are outstanding metal detectors. However, the Legend with version 1.09 or 1.11 software is simply better than the Equinox 600/800 from my experience with all three at least where I hunt and how I use them and for the simple reason that the Legend has proven to actually be waterproof down to 16 feet. Reading that lawsuit makes me want to sell all of my Minelab gear. I go to Canada a lot. I will get a Quest V80 eventually just to symbolically raise a middle finger at Minelab.

That’s why I wrote “Claims”. Glad you checked it out to make certain.

Here are a couple of posts from the topic TDI with Noise Reduction Mod by Rick Kempf. Rick is referring to the TDI Pulse Scan. He wrote: "A couple of recent posts referred to the whites TDI – so I thought I'd pass along the following. Last week I purchased a secondhand TDI from a guy who had sent it in to have Reg Sniff's noise reduction mod done - along with replacement of the op-amp. I had a TDI previously and the difference between that one and this one is like night and day. My old one had a warbly threshold that drove me nuts and made it very difficult to use the sensitivity higher than about 2/3 of full. My house is EMI hell, the neighborhood has underground utility service and the transformers sit on the ground. Even mildmannered VLF's like Whites Classics go nuts here at full sensitivity. This TDI has a silky smooth threshold with just an occasional blip at full sensitivity (12). It also air tests 17" on a nickle with the standard 12" DP coil! That's 4" more than I ever got with my old TDI here at the house with the same coil." And Reg responded with: "I don't do the mods myself. My hands don't work that well any more so I have a friend do them. He does the work and keeps all the money since the mod is somewhat labor intensive and does require a pcb trace mod. A full TDI mod costs about $125 (return shipping included with $500 insurance) and that includes replacing the preamp with a much better IC, the addition of a small pc board to reduce the noise, a filter change so the regular TDI is upgraded to the filtering of the Pro for a faster response. The mod also includes calibration of certain stages to 1 millivolt to assure the mod works as designed. This TDI pro filter mod makes the regular TDI like the Pro but without the extra GB pot and volume control. The volume control was added to help reduce the noise problem, but with the noise reduction mod, is not needed for that purpose any more. One additional mod is to short out a capacitor which eliminates a third filter that is not needed and can cause weak signal problems. This mod does increase the gain which in turn increases the noise level. Fortunately, reducing the gain using the gain control about 20% or so makes it back to normal. You do gain a little depth but more noise with this mod. One advantage of this mod is weak signals become more reliable. " Reg I don't have the same coils as Rick had in his post. However, the stock 12" Dual Field is hitting US quarters in air tests out to 15" and easily hits a freshly buried 12" quarter in mineralized dirt with 6 of 12 sensitivity. The Sadie is hitting a quarter at 12" in air tests and that is in my EMI filled house with sensitivity on 4 of 12. It is not having any problem hitting .08 to .06 gram gold bits and lead bird shot either with the coil 1 to 2 inches above them on hot ground with sensitivity on 6 of 12.

The TDI Pulse Scan I got from Snakejim is the big box 14.4V TDI not a smaller box TDI SL.

After reading CaliGold’s posts about his bad luck doing a battery mod on his TDI SL, I am so thankful that I put a TDI Pulse Scan/TDI Pro at the top of my list of wants if one happened to become available. I have only owned TDI SLs and the SPP both of which I battery modded to get more voltage and sensitivity/depth. Those TDI’’s even with the battery voltage increase always left me wanting for more. So, when snakejim’s TDI Pulse Scan modded by Reg Sniff went up for sale on this site I decided that I would try it and see if it was an improvement. All I can say is……Wow. The TDI Pulse Scan that snakejim sold me is amazing. I got a NF Sadie for it as soon as I realized its potential and sold the two Jimmy Sierra/Miner John coils that came with it since I have also always felt that those coils just didn’t measure up. It looked like this TDI with a Sadie might actually make a decent small sub gram gold nugget detector which is something I would have never tried with my previous TDI SL variants. The Sadie and Reg’s modifications did the trick and this TDI can easily equal and out perform my Deus 2 using its FMF Goldfield mode on .25 down to .05 gram nuggets. Very impressive. It’s not a GPX 6000 by any means but this Reg modded TDI Pulse Scan is no slouch with a Sadie. Also, I am so glad I don’t need to worry about doing battery mods and worry about my TDI being underpowered. I always assumed that the difference between a battery modded TDI SL and a normal TDI PulseScan/Pro was minimal. That is simply not the case with this Reg modded TDI Pulse Scan. Thanks Snakejim. I am going to hold onto this TDI and when it’s time to let it go due to my age, I will make sure it goes to a good home.

If the Excal ll actually had a display and target ID numbers, they probably wouldn't be the same as the Equinox 900. If you are in the USA, get a US Jefferson nickel, a modern zinc penny (post 1982) a modern copper Memorial penny (pre 1982 and some 1982s), a modern clad dime, a modern clad quarter, a Sacajawea or presidential dollar coin and any other older USA coins and do lots of static testing on them to learn their audio and target ID numbers. Do the same with 22 lr or larger caliber shell casings, bullets, lead fishing weights, all varieties of aluminum pull tabs, some steel crown bottle caps especially Corona and Modelo (with the foil coverings) aluminum screw caps from liter sized and shot sized bottles and any other non-ferrous items you can find. Do the same with nails, nuts, bolts, etc and learn how they sound too. Making your own list is a lot better idea than using someone else's. If you have any gold or silver jewelry, test that too. If you are saltwater beach hunting, dig it all at least starting out.

This is the simulated design. From the photo Digalicious posted which has now disappeared, this simulation is very close.

Thank you for writing up your report and for your excellent testing!!! Your Manticore 16 sensitivity, 6 recovery speed is very similar to what I use on the Equinox 800, 900 and Nokta Legend even with their smaller coils at most of the gold prospecting sites I hunt that have lots of manmade iron trash and magnetite pebbles. I can usually go no higher than 18 on the 800 and Legend and maybe 19 or 20 on the 900 with recovery speed at 5. Any higher sensitivity and the background noise gets unbearable. Same with recovery speed below 5. Iron bias on 0 for sure too with all targets accepted using their Gold modes.

This is just a comparison of selectable single frequencies and simultaneous multi frequency choices available between the X-Terra Pro and the Legend. Minelab X-Terra Pro selectable single frequencies are 5 kHz, 8 kHz, 10 kHz, 15 kHz using 3 different search modes-Park, Field and Beach. No simultaneous multi frequency. Nokta Legend has selectable single frequencies of 4 kHz, 10 kHz, 15 kHz, 20 kHz and 40 kHz. Those frequencies are available in Park and Field search modes. 20 kHz and 40 kHz are available in Gold Field prospecting search mode. Nokta Legend has three different simultaneous multi frequency modes in Park and Field. It has two different simultaneous multi frequency modes for dry and wet saltwater beaches. It has one simultaneous multi frequency mode for Gold Field prospecting. There are some similar audio features on both detectors. However, the Legend has many settings adjustments and some features that the X-Terra Pro does not have. Base model X Terra Pro is available from many retailers for $270 which does not include proprietary wireless headphones which have to be purchased separately (at least $100 when available from Minelab), or third party water proof wired headphones which need to have the proprietary waterproof screw on connector (at least $100). There are many aftermarket 2.4 gHz wireless headphones with 1/8" plug wired transmitter that will work with the X-Terra Pro and should be $100 or less. Right now, NW Detectors claims to be selling the newest version of the Legend with wireless headphones, upgraded shaft system and lighter LG30 search coil for $499.

I have always contended that the QED was better than a US model TDI SL or SPP with or without the beefed up battery voltage mod. Now after owning a Reg modded TDI Pro with a normal TDI Pro 14.4V battery, I will take the TDI Pro with threshold warble mod all day over the QED. It is way easier to setup and use than the QED and it's built like a tank but not that heavy. If Nokta can make a slightly better/more sensitive detector than the TDI Pro with more than one ground balance point, lighter weight battery, wireless audio and good coils, great.

As long as you get the newer, lighter version of the Legend with version 1.11 software already installed, the lighter shaft system and the elliptical LG30 coil, you should be all set. The X-Terra Pro may work better for some people on some saltwater beaches and for diving. Fine. The Legend is about as versatile as you can get as far as a do it all really well, fully waterproof, wireless audio, internal battery, extremely fully featured, selectable single frequency 4 to 40 kHz or excellent simultaneous multi frequency VLF. The original Legend with the 11” round LG28 coil and aluminum upper shaft is on the heavy side of lightweight. I have not had a chance to run my Legends in all of the possible iterations of their settings. I set mine up for my type of coin and jewelry hunting, my type or relic and older coin hunting at iron trashed sites and for gold prospecting in high iron mineralization. Sure, it took a bit of time to learn the interface but for the money, there is just nothing comparable for what you get. You can make the Legend as simple or complicated as you want and you can hunt with it just about anywhere. At least you have those choices. Same with Deus 2, Manticore and all of the Equinox models but at a higher to much higher price.

A standard and modded GPX 5000 versus a GPZ 7000 and GPX 6000 on the same undug target which turned out to be a 1 to 2 gram nugget. I am not posting this video to advertise the GPX 5000 modification demonstrated in this video. The video just shows these detectors operated proficiently on the same wild target and how they do on that one target.

And me.....

Those are sounds that I often hear 60 miles north of you if I am running sensitivity and audio response too high. Back when I was doing a couple of nugget testing videos, I had several good intentioned people tell me the reason that my Deus 2 was not hitting small nuggets was because I had my audio response too low. This video by Paystreak is a good example of possibly what to do and what not to do in high iron mineralization. Keeping sensitivity under control, possibly slightly raising reactivity above 1 or 1.5, and slightly lowering audio response to 3 or 2 at least and maybe doing multiple ground balances are the best ways for me to not go crazy from hundreds to thousands of audio responses during a hunt on supposedly "clean" ground that is actually full of natural iron particle concentrations that are big enough to fool many high gain VLFs.

I had 2 hours yesterday to do a little target comparison on wild targets with the Equinox 800 6" coil in Gold 1 multi and the Legend with 6" coil in Goldfield multi. Both detectors were accepting all targets, recovery speed was on 5, iron bias on 0 and both ground balanced at 1 and I had to reground balance often. Sensitivity on the Equinox was on 20 and sensitivity on the Legend was 22. I was mostly concentrating on really small targets if at all possible. I did end up hitting enough small targets to give me a good idea of how they compared. I flagged potential small targets and checked them with both detectors before recovery. I was lucky enough to get the Legend over a 0.17 gram nugget/flake. The smallest target in the photo is a lead fragment that weighs in at 0.02 grams. Both detectors hit these targets easily. No target was deeper than 3". ALL target IDs were in the iron range due to the extreme mineralization at this site. There is tons of magnetite black sand along with big chunks of magnetite like the ones I brought home with me that are pictured in the photo. They are everywhere. Virtually all of the metamorphic rocks at this site are hot enough to signal as a hot rock. So the abundant magnetite and hot rocks from pea size to the size of small cars make detecting with just about any VLF or PI detector lots of noisy fun at this site. The only differences that I noticed between the Equinox 800 and the Legend was the Equinox was a lot noisier as far as iron falsing and it was hard for me to get the Legend's threshold just right for my ears. It was a bit thready. There was a high tension multi strand power line 50 yards away. The US copper penny is for size reference.

Minelab, I know from personal experience that some of your employees are reading this forum. The video posted in this topic and the many reports on this forum of settings being used on the Manticore and Equinox 700/900 show how these detectors are performing in moderate to high iron mineralization, in thick iron trash and for some of us in both conditions at the same time. I would really welcome any public posts, private messages or emails that could include settings suggestions and solutions if any are available.

longbow62, I am glad that you decided to post a really good report on the Manticore. Obviously, it is working very well for you and your ground conditions as it is for many people that are saltwater beach hunters and who hunt in less iron mineralization. So, it seems like whatever Minelab changed about Multi IQ and Multi IQ+ in the Equinox 700/900 and the Manticore has not adversely messed with its performance in some ground and beach conditions and Minelab's claims for those detectors that they have performance improvements over the Equinox 600/800 are perfectly true. However, in other types of soil conditions, those claims are simply not true from the reports that are being given by very experienced people on this forum that willingly payed a lot of money for these next generation Equinox 600/800s, used them thoughtfully and correctly and decided to move on.