Jonathan Porter

Recommend not to use Quick Start, just turn on machine check for EMI with coil held flat and away from ground, change the Freq manually or do aN auto tune if required till threshold is smooth as possible then perform the Ferrite balance. The Guides in Quick Start are not actually linked to the Ferrite balance good or bad and are just there to provide a Guide and remind users to perform the process. Quick Start resets the ferrite balance and the G balance back to factory as well as the auto tune, there is no advantage in doing this other than the auto tune which can easily be done from the menu below. As I have said before the GPZ only makes a noise on the Ferrite if the electronics X calibration is OUT, if the calibration is good then no or minimal noise, however with a faulty coil the GPZ will not calibrate to the Ferrite no matter how many times you try, this is for varying reasons as has been discussed MANY times on this forum. In cold weather, especially where ambient temperatures vary greatly from first switch on to later in the day, there will always be some variation in the Ferrite calibration, to say it never varies is highly circumspect, the ground, mild or otherwise, only comes into the equation if X is present. If the unit gets into a fuddle you can try a number of things Turn OFF then ON again. Perform a reset via last menu option. Hold ON button in on start up till reset options come up, this will then trigger a HARD reset.

There is no tick or any other sort of indication associated with X balance, the onscreen video when Quick-Trak is triggered is a GUIDE only. When we trigger Quick-Trak the Guide comes up while the QT button is pressed, release the button the Guide goes away, there is no time frame on this and there is no tick when X balance is completed. You can turn Guides off in the Menu. If you go into the Ground Balance menu and go from Auto to Semi-Auto a GUIDE will come up recommending a Ferrite Balance be performed, this is logical because the detector requires you to perform a Ferrite balance manually now via Quick-Trak because it is in semi-auto mode, the same goes when you go from Manual to Semi-auto, to avoid the hassle of having to back arrow out of the Guide screen or triggering the Quick-Trak button (undesirable if your X balance is already good) configure the User button to the GB menu to be able to quickly change the GB modes, no Guide is triggered when go into the Menu this way. If the Ferrite was not actually needed why then would there be so much emphasis on its use within the Menu systems of the GPZ? Not using the Ferrite is akin to digging a deep target one day and finding out it was trash so a week later in a totally different location you decide to not dig a deep target based on the previous experience. I cannot really tell if X is present other than vague impressions based on detector behaviour, however if X is present then it WILL affect performance IF the Ferrite balance isn’t correct. Lastly as I have said many times before a changing/shifting Ferrite balance has nothing to do with the ground changing except you’ll hear X if the Ferrite balance is out, then spurious depth reducing noises will intrude into the target signal of the detector. X signal only affects the audio if the balance is incorrect, X balance via the Ferrite is directly associated with the temperature of the electronics, so if you perform a Ferrite balance early on a cold morning and then the detector electronics and day warm up the Ferrite balance will then be incorrect (especially in winter) for the given temperature, as such noise will be introduced into the audio which will then compete with target signals. IMHO being blasé about X balance is not an option especially when you consider it is so easy to do. JP

It’s all pure speculation on my part but seeing how this is a thread about a non-existent GPZ8000, I have a hunch discrimination isn’t even possible on ZVT. But is discrimination depth at its pinnacle? No way, there is always room for improvement. I’m all for a hunch type discrimination allowing the user to have some input, it doesn’t have to be 100% accurate, I already have a well trained ear, just need a supplement or a probability meter to use as a tool when making decisions, something that would help with making an informed decision, call it the “Informed Hunch-Ferrometer”.🤣

The trade offs would be huge in noisy ground, plus nuggets are all over the place time constant wise so even more pain. What’s left is probably the CTX 3030 with a large coil. 😞

I sell a lot of detectors to people with hearing loss and in most cases have found hearing aids to be ineffective for detector use unless the person is extremely deaf, they tend to lift everything especially wind noise, birds calls human voices that type of thing which tends to drown out the Threshold. The key to detecting with hearing loss is to be able to ‘hear’ the threshold pitch, if you can hear that in all conditions your fine. Most men have hearing loss in the higher frequency range so I usually suggest they use a lower threshold pitch. In my case in my younger days I used a threshold pitch of 60 but since my late 40’s have found a lower threshold pitch of 40 is better (I actually go as low as 20 in the right conditions especially when I’m chasing low/high deep nuggets at depth). Too low a threshold pitch (below 40) and I usually recommend headphones over speakers as the low frequency sounds tend to have a lot of competition in the natural environment. Just my 2cents JP

I’d say the phones will be running hot today...... looks like someone poked the Tiger, wonder what Coiltek are doing? With the demise of the GPX 4500 there is now only one official Minelab MPS machine that all those after market coils can go onto if you want to buy new. Just for clarification, I am just as much in the dark as anyone on what is actually happening in this sphere but am not surprised, its a highly competitive market that is shrinking rapidly.

It’s good to hear things have finally come good for you after your trip to OZ. I too have one of those new coils waiting to be tried out on some of our variable ground in Clermont. Good to hear the Ferrite balance is happening properly and that touch sensitivity has reduced (most touch sensitivity on a GPZ on any coil happens in General Difficult BTW not so much in High Yield). Cudo’s to the X coil people for being so generous. JP

Not in the habit of having to explain myself Dave, but to clarify as stated I have not used the latest X coils so this would then logically imply that I have not had a chance to use the evaluation coil since returning from WA. A simple PM would have cleared this up. JP

Dave in spite of past differences I am still pushing hard for this type of outcome or at very least users being given more coil choices. The key issues that I could see from a corporate perspective supplying dongles is quality control on a hand-built product, I have not used the latest coils so am unsure if variations still occur, but reading between the lines here on the forum it seems the 10" ones are still quite variable.

Facts, not an argument or trying to be derisive. Minelab were approached and were initially open to the idea. Minelab should have provided more coil options for the GPZ. X coil distributor was afforded the opportunity to negotiate access to the dongle. X coils are now freely available. Minelab haven't prevented sales. Right now you can buy yourself an aftermarket coil for the GPZ as has been freely discussed in this forum, the coils also work as has also been discussed by a lot of people including myself, all you have to do is find a good electronics guy who can reliably modify your existing coil, as has also been done by a lot of people (some of them not so well), and go enjoy the benefits of the lighter weight and greater variety of sizes. JP

The coil would have to be seeing that connector that close to the coil, so it has to be impacting on the GB and X balance even if it is held completely motionless.

I would not recommend using this method, that is an awful lot of metal and potential stray RF to have so near to the coil. Even the slightest movement could make its way to the RX. Just my 2C and not wanting any future X coil discussions to become heated, have moved on from all the emotive debates there's more than enough information out there for people to make informed decisions now. A more mellow these days😇 JP

I'm more interested in the receive area of the coil, obviously with the larger coils less winds to the get inductance right equals quieter operation over high mineral ground, so a bigger coil will be less sensitive to near to coil variations (which is also an advantage) but in essence the size of the receive area, especially if that receive area is round in the case of Mono coils, provides a better outcome compared to odd shaped windings. The key is to get the very center of the receive winding over the target plume (that's the field created by the target that radiates out evenly all around and away gradually becoming equally weaker and weaker over distance). With the GPZ because of its dual receive its VERY important to keep those two receive windings in unison with each other, that means not tilting one receive winding into towards the ground (this will mean the other receive will be being pulled away from the ground at the same time) which can create varying degrees of saturation signal with the other side also potentially generating some degree of salt signal. JP

Hi Steve, I've been away bush prospecting so have been out of the rat race for a while which was great, no hole is too deep when you have honesty, integrity and the truth on your side.😇 With the NOX you and I must have been mirroring each other across the divide, I was fortunate though because I only had to fucus on gold nuggets and not any of the coin and relic stuff which was extremely time consuming for you I'm sure. The NOX is a brilliant little detector thanks to your extensive input. Assuming I'm still welcome I'm back now and keen to start talking gold again.🤔 JP

Yes sorry to have stolen your thunder Steve old chap! (not 😀 😜 😝 ) I too am a NOX fan for gold hunting but like Steve hate the open webbed coils for prospecting. I suppose some resitance might be had because Minelab already have the Gold Monster fitting that category or it could be someone evil at Minelab HQ is determined to drive Steve mad!!🤣 I would love to see a Monster mode included in a future update for the NOX, the silent throshold makes the Monster great to use in ground a High Freq VLF has no business operating in. JP BTW Steve the weather was pushing Mid 40s Deg C when I was helping develop the Prospect mode, weather is no excuse!! LOL The mercury in the gold pan was nice and runny when I was testing, how bout you? 😎 😋😂

I want two things, a super light weight PI not much heavier than an Equinox with a 10” elliptical coil, it has to have as good or better sensitivity as a SDC 2300. Then I want an as good or better than GPX 5000 PI in a CTX housing with a range of coils sizes from 10” elliptical right up to 18” round it also has to have a noise and salt cancelling coil that also performs reasonably well!! Lastly I want a GPZ in a CTX weight class with a range of coils from say 12” through to 20”, with the larger coil not exceeding the current weight of the GPZ 14” coil. 6 hours of battery life is plenty I can always carry a spare battery if this will help with weight. I will also need coil options that remove salt, saturation and EMI signals. I am willing to pay for said detectors because I am fortunate enough to live somewhere where I can find enough gold to do so, but for others I will also say they need to make budget versions of the above!! Especially the light weight small coil PI option. Minelab are you listening? JP PS this is liberating??

Minelab are you listening!!!

Actually what I would really like is two GPZ’s, one on par weight wise as the CTX for larger coil use and another one that is super light for small coil use and yes with a 10 x 6” elliptical for Steve.??

OK so what I would like is a GPZ at around the same weight as the CTX 3030. Believe it or not but a too light machine hunting for deep gold is actually a negative because coil control is so important, patch hunting or chasing small shallow gold no problem, but for deeper edge of detection responses it’s the other way around. So my bucket list would be (Bar if you like), A light weight simple to use Steve ‘BAR’ PI with depth performance on par with GPX and sensitivity of the SDC with a variety of coil choices. A light as CTX 3030 GPZ 7000 with a variety of coil options, 12” small gold finder, 17” x 12” Patch hunter, 15’ round general purpose and say 18” to 19 “ same weight as the GPZ14” coil for outright depth. All units should have an option or ability to cut out EMI and Salt signals whilst maintaining reasonable depth and sensitivity. JP

One question Steve and I hope I don’t come across contentious or conceited, what if ‘your’ bucket list metal detector is a problem in the ground I operate in? You see I’ve used the Garrett ATX the Whites TDI and an early version QED in the areas I go detecting and test metal detectors in and found everything else seriously lacking. So is the bar performance based, price based or weight based? Minelab loses in weight and price but in my case wins hands down on being able to work in my ground and at the same time have performance. And sorry to be seeming like I’m dragging the discussion into contention but this also goes for the X coils where I work and test detectors. If I go over said ground with all of the above and find nothing with them but find heaps with the heaviest priciest detector in the list, which detector do I choose? Please I’m not trying to be walled eyed here, I’m not trying to be contenious or arrogant, this is not a Dodge versus Ford man beat your chest rant. There is no way I could bring myself to sell my Dodge ....... err GPZ. ? JP

The GPZ remembers the Ferrite balance, so assuming the balance is correct relative to current temperature you can go too and fro between one Gold Mode or Ground Type Mode very easily. JP

That looks to have be cut from the top of a GPZ14 coil and painted black.

Look outside the box for a minute before casting judgment! I’m not trying to defend Minelab’s stance if it was just corporate greed we were talking about here, instead think about things logically for a bit before going down the ASS U & ME path! Firstly why did it take so long for the GPZ19 coil to come to market? I can tell you why because I was there and I know first hand how much effort went into getting it electronically right and also how many Engineers were involved. Minelab cannot just pop off and throw a few coils together like has been done with the X coils. As I have said in other posts the X coils are nowhere near consistent enough for Minelab to even consider them saleable from their standards point of view. It took MANY MANY hours of R&D to get the GPZ 19 coil up and running properly (weight issues aside), this meant people were taken away from other major projects to do this, because of electronic constraints/requirements the coil ended up being heavy. The GPZ has always been about depth on large gold that was what it was designed for right from the start, but it just so happens ZVT is also very good on the smaller gold which is more plentiful thanks to the inclusion of High Yield, which BTW was created much later in the development path due to the big gold not regularly coming to light during testing. Believe it or not Minelab are just as much in the dark about how much actual gold is out there in the ground as we are, so it was a wait and see approach on how well the GPZ actually did around the world. To develop a coil for the GPZ takes time and a lot of R&D dollars, but worse it requires man power which is the big bottle neck at Minelab due to so many different projects going on at once. Minelab are innovators, they spend the big bucks on R&D not rebadging and marketing the same old same old year after year! I feel people should be a little less critical of the way Minelab do things especially when you look at other metal detector manufacturers around the globe! As it stands even if Minelab were open to allowing acces to their dongles they would not currently allow the X coils to have them due to electronic inconsistencies. IMHO anyone making an aftermarket coil for the GPZ would have to lift their game considerably before gaining access to the dongle was ever an option. JP

When using Quick Start the GPZ will reset to a fixed point set by software but every detector and coil combination is slightly different and also the temperature where you are operating will be different to were others are working. To reset the ferrite balance and Ground balance you need to select RESET ALL out of the two options, if you use Audio smoothing OFF you will need to go back into that menu option and reset as the default is Low, same goes for Threshold Pitch which is default 53. Finally if EMI is bad you will not be able to tell if the Ferrite balance is out unless it is WAY out as described above. Hope this helps JP

To be fair to Minelab the techniques I use have been developed by me during many long hours of GPZ use in many different areas around Australia in some extremely high X and variable X and G ground. The issue I have with the Super D coils, if you can call it an issue, is the way the GB will sound balanced when the coil is swung across the ground but the GB can be completely out as can sometimes be evidenced when the coil is pumped. So my techniques have been refined from day to day over the past four years, I inform forum readers of this not to create confusion but to hopefully improve people’s experiences with GPZ, probably kind off stupid giving away advantages but thats the way I roll. I also like to split/lift the coil up away from the ground when Ferrite balancing to clear ground effect in problematic areas such as Saturable ground and Salty ground (these two ground types generally go hand in hand in my areas), you can easily do this by placing the ferrite on a rock further away from ground effect or even perform the ferrite balance in the air with the coil flat using Quick-Trak. Once Quick-Trak is completed then just bring the coil to the ground (obviously I prefer to have the detector in Semi-Auto Ground Balance Mode), carefully pump the coil till the GB is correct then go detecting. When the threshold seems to get busy again just pump the coil occasionally to bring the GB back to accuracy (DO NOT USE QUICK-TRAK button when pumping the coil only ever use QT when you are performing or checking the Ferrite). Hope this helps JP