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Jonathan Porter

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Everything posted by Jonathan Porter

  1. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viscous_remanent_magnetization Bit of light reading for you Jen. In the case of the 7000 as described in my post above X can become an issue due to slight variations in ZVT, with slight differences in temperature, electronic differences or coil differences making it hard to calibrate at factory. PIs are not overly affected due to pulse not a constant Tx like ZVT but can still have issues in saturable places. Where VRM is extreme the G balance can compensate for some of it but not all. I’m no expert BTW and only have a basic understanding. https://www.minelab.com/__files/f/254716/KBA 24-1 Basics of the GPZ 7000 Technology Zero Voltage Transmission (ZVT).pdf This article is more focussed and relevant to ML detectors especially the comments about ground balancing and reactive soil component.
  2. There is a lot going on here, some of it I am sensitive to but am clueless to the cause and other parts I am just totally blind. I have gone back and added emoticons to my original tongue in cheek comments in the hopes this lightens the mood somewhat whilst still retaining the message and bring it more inline with how I originally intended it. I would like to acknowledge how appreciative I am of the words of support shown here by some of the very people I might have offended in my attempts at passing on knowledge through the filter of passion. I know I get it wrong a lot, I have a gift for words but sometimes the passion of my emotions creeps into those words and I blast right over the people I want to share that passion with. In this case I too strongly worded my thoughts because I was impassioned by what I felt was public ridicule over a VERY important (to me) process so I took the gloves off and gave back in the style the ridicule was delivered, I tried to be funny but I went too far. Way to far! I see that now. Once the passion had passed and I saw the reaction from people who I admire having to come to the defence of those who don’t have the gift of words I felt chagrined. 😔 Those people are highly experienced individuals who deserve my respect and at the very least, at the very least, deserve my making an attempt to word things in a way that is not all high and lofty. I would like to acknowledge the often silent readers of this forum who have a wealth of experience and success who do not post very often but to whom I often offend, to them I unreservedly apologise for not being more considerate. Lastly I have pondered the X balance/calibration subject more in the hopes of simplifying the message I want to deliver on its importance. The following is what I have come up with in the hopes we can move away from the subject being a location based thing and more a GPZ7000 ZVT thing. Stop thinking about X calibration in relation to what ground you are working or where in the world that is. Think of the Ferrite as a calibration tool that shows the GPZ7000 a reliable X signal no matter where in the world you are. Think of the control box temperature at the time of detecting as being the determinant for the X calibration. If the control box X calibration is inaccurate then the detector will make a signal on the Ferrite and any X signal in the ground, if present. If there is no signal or minimal signal on the Ferrite then the calibration is correct. If Semi-Auto or Manual mode is used the Calibration is locked good or bad. If Quick-Trak is triggered then the calibration is actively tracking X and G, a Ferrite should be present for best results. If using Auto mode the algorithm is actively trying to Track G and X from whatever signal is being presented to the coil, if salt/conductive signals or saturation signals are present they can confuse the algorithm. Lastly ZVT means Zero Voltage Transmission, this means the design requires Zero variation in the transmit voltage for the whole thing to work, however no electronics are perfect and no two coils are exactly the same hence the need for the user to calibrate. Each coil is slightly different so will require a slightly different Ferrite calibration, no two electronics are exactly the same also so the temperature of the electronics will ever so slightly change the calibration position from cold start to warm, as such ML cannot set a perfect calibration from the factory so the end user is required to perform that task for maximum performance, either through the use of Quick-Trak and Auto mode and the octopus wiggle recommended method or the same method in combination with the Ferrite, or Semi-Auto and the use of the Ferrite (my personal recommendation). Hope this goes some way to explaining my position and also make amends for some of the misunderstandings. JP
  3. I’m sorry if I came across all worked up, that was not my intention. I was however trying to get across the importance of using the Ferrite especially for GPZ users who want to get the absolute best out of their investment. Words are hard things to put together especially when talking about technical things and more especially when one word can be used to describe a multitude of subjects. This becomes even more complex when there is a cultural divide where phrases can have different meanings. My attempt at mirroring the tongue in cheek approach of the OP whilst attempting to impart information has clearly fallen flat.
  4. Steve did I quote you at any stage? I’m not telling you to do anything, mandatory or otherwise. I am also not telling you about your personal experiences only my own, which in the case of the US was extremely limited.
  5. A lot of the X coils will not Ferrite balance properly especially in Normal timings, the best ones I used were the 15” Concentric’s they weren’t too bad, although a friend of mine has told me his recent 17”CC coil is very good too. The reefy country will most likely be saturation signal being magnified up the centre of the Ferrite, use the in-air approach assuming the coil and timings you select will allow it. The GPZ14 coil should be able to ferrite balance in all timings (it is OK to have some small amount of signal but a loud target-like one is not good). If you can achieve a reasonable X balance then I highly recommend you use the Semi-Auto GB mode, once locked the X calibration cannot shift unless the temperature of the electronics shift a lot (can only shift a few % points from dead cold), however if using Auto in some ground types you will only need to walk 20 meters in Auto and the conductive and saturation signals can throw the Calibration right out, this then has a flow on effect with the G balance which then tries its hardest to compensate but WILL fail. In the conductive areas in the US (Nevada etc) the X signal is probably minimal and the Alkali the worst so the Auto mode should not be too badly affected by a bad X balance, best way to check is to pass the coil over a ferrite occasionally and see how loud the signal is, personally even though there is not much X present I would still be using Semi-Auto if for no other reason than it might give me a slight advantage over other operators. My experiences in Arizona showed me there was plenty of X signal to be had in and around the Bradshaw mountains, even up at Rich hill there was plenty of ground that was variable (this was in the days before Smooth, GP3000 from memory) and I’m sure there would be plenty of X signal around. Mineralisation that forms gold that is then weathered has all the elements that can affect a metal detector no matter where in the world we work, if it didn’t then Americans would still be using VLF machines there would be no point to a PI. Case in point the new Garrett Axiom, obviously there is still a need for a PI in the US. JP
  6. PI isn’t affected the same but a lot of saturation signal comes from high X ground, this is especially noticeable with the Flat wound coils, they see a LOT of X. Hence why I tell people to not scrub the coil in highly mineralised soils/gravels etc. X signal is no joke on the 7000 so I’m surprised by all the head in the sand humour surrounding it’s use on here 😁. Yeah I get the humour, Octopus dance, Ferrit, ritualised activities around the fragile yellow round thing etc,🤣 but in reality it is an important aspect to ZVT and should be taken very seriously.🤗 Just because you don’t understand its use or can’t see the benefits doesn’t mean you should not use it and instead become part of the Anti-Ferriters,🙃 there is another very hot topic raging around the world as we speak that follows a similar vein. Just because a LOT of people agree with you does not make it correct. 🤭 Use it, don’t use, get Ferrited or be a vocal Anti-Ferriter that’s your choice,😁 hey better yet buy a 6000 or an Axiom then you don’t have to do the Octopus dance of zero comprehension!!😁 I’m amazed after all this time that there are still people out there who refuse to inoculate with the Ferrite,😄 I honestly thought that discussion had been put to bed. Just like that hot world topic there are plenty of people who aren’t Ferrited who do perfectly fine without all the hoopla of the ritual of the “Yellow Lord of the Rings” 🤣 so at the end of the day its your choice, just please don’t deride what you don’t understand.😋 JP
  7. What coil do you have on your machine? In some ground where there is a bit of saturation signal the round ferrite will channel that signal up itself magnifying it, this can sound like the Ferrite isn’t being balanced out but in fact it’s saturation signal, you cannot ground balance out saturation. Best bet is to place the ferrite on top of a big rock (4 inches or so high) or put your ferrite on a stick and hold the coil away from the ground waving the ferrite under the coil over the windings till the noise goes (with QT depressed of course), then bring the coil to the ground and slowly pump the coil till the Semi-Auto GB balances out the ground signal. (The GB for the ground will be out because when the coil is held in air you are balancing to nothing as you calibrate to the ferrite). If there is only a small signal off the ferrite don’t worry about it, the key is to not have a LOUD target like signal on the Ferrite. General ground noise will cover any mild signals especially when using Normal. The Most sensitive mode on the 7000 to the ferrite is High Yield Normal.
  8. If you have no Ferrite then do the octopus dance in Auto with the QT button held in then go to Semi-Auto to lock the calibration on whatever the detector has come up with. In low X ground it’s obviously not a big deal but sometimes that is a hard thing to do. In some cases a very poor X calibration can sound like rapid fire EMI as the coil is moved, it introduces noise to the audio that does not need to be there, I personally prefer no noise of any kind from any source that can be removed through a simple action.
  9. It is highly recommend you use the ferrite ring to calibrate your GPZ7000 for X signals. X is seen by the detector if the calibration is incorrect. X calibration is determined by the temperature of the electronics, so as an example if you perform an X balance at the start of your session at a winter morning ambient temperature the control box will slowly warm up until the electronics reach operating temperature, as such the calibration once warm will be different to that attained at the start of the session. X calibration can also be affected by the use of Auto whereas Semi-Auto is a FIXED state for the Ferrite balance, Quick-Trak affects the ferrite calibration no matter which Ground Balance mode you are in, Auto, Semi-Auto or Manual. It is not recommend you used Quick-Trak without the Ferrite present. In low X areas (even quiet soils can have high X) the Auto mode will generally do a good job of keeping the X calibration accurate but this can change if there is a LOT of conductive signal as the algorithm CAN’T always tell the difference between Salt/conductive signals and Saturation signals (Saturation is not such a problem in the US). I recommend you use Semi-Auto mode and perform/check the X calibration for the given temperature at the start of a detecting session and again about an hour later once it’s warmed up. If there is a signal on the ferrite then your machine will make noise on any X the coil gets exposed to, the signal from X gets mixed in with general ground noise but will elevate overall detector ground signal behaviour potentially masking deep gold. Not all Ferrites are created equal so I’ve attached the recommendation section off the ML website on what specification off ferrite should be used. An incorrect ferrite with the wrong values can cause havoc. If you don’t feel the need for a Ferrite then I highly recommend you use Auto mode. It only takes seconds to wave over a ferrite at the start of a session in Semi-Auto mode, if there is a bit of signal off the ferrite then hold QT in till the signal goes away and your good to go. If your machine is making a signal on the Ferrite then it will make signals on any X in the ground which then blends in with ground noise, even VERY experienced GPZ users struggle to determine X signals from ground signals. https://www.minelab.com/__files/f/254884/KBA_26-1 GPZ 7000 Tips for Better Ground Balance.pdf
  10. No I didn't Simon, you are cross pollinating two different subjects. I was referring to the proto 17x13 Zsearch and have made no mention or comment so far on EMI stability RE Xceed and the GPX 6000. There's a huge amount of speculation going on in this thread, for starters none of the coil sizes are the same so unless you test like for like you are going to get things wrong.
  11. I’ve been asked to elaborate on my comments about listening through bird shot, and considering this relates to all detectors not just what I use, I’ll reply here and Steve can move it if it doesn’t fit in with the content of this thread. A highly sensitive early sampling PI like the Axiom and the GPX6000 will hit HARD on tiny birdshot near the surface, as such they can become extremely pesky for these PI’s as most areas will have a plethora of these pesky little non-ferrous targets scattered about over the gold areas, especially in and around diggings and workings etc. If I know there is an elluvial/alluvial/collivial gravel layer sitting under the surface gravels or soils generally, nuggets will be sitting on bottom in those soils/gravels mixed clays ect due the way gold bearing rocks weather and the age of those gravels. As such if the surface gravels have a peppering of shot gun pellets I just force myself to ignore the loud signals even though they sound sweet (non-ferrous) and instead focus on the broader quieter repeatable signals that can more often than not ONLY be gold as the shot can’t work its way in that deep. When I’m detecting in known areas I often just ignore loud surface targets even the non-ferrous single signal ones and focus on the broader range of motion signals, this immediately improves my success rate and time spent chasing nonsense signals. My maxim in old workings is theres a 90% chance a surface target is rubbish and a 80% chance a deep target in unturned over ground is gold, so I focus on those types of signals instead. Hope this helps JP
  12. I’m still waiting to see someone detecting with these things where I can actually hear what’s going on with the audio/threshold over any type of ground, its driving me nuts.🥴 Can anyone point to a video where you can actually hear in real time the actual threshold as someone walks around swinging an Axiom over the ground? Sitting there listening to his commentary while his wife was having all the fun listening for targets was maddening, I wanted to tell him to be quiet too. 😂
  13. Nice to read some positivity, Gold detecting is about dreaming it, planning it and then doing it, the perfect combination of healthy life experiences that gives us a reason to get out of bed in the morning and give it another shot. When it all comes together and I’m rewarded with a nugget no matter how small or what detector I used to find it, I experience pure bliss and I’m immediately planning on doing it all over again. 😊 🤗 The challenge is what it’s all about for me, it always was and always will be. JP
  14. Well spotted, the sticker manufacturer made a boo boo. 😆
  15. There’s a very good reason for the colour Jen, Black is a LOT more UV resistant and tests have shown they are also quite a lot more EMI resistant and stable. A lot of people in OZ are now putting wrap on their coils similar to the material they are putting on 4x4 body panels to protect the coil surface from scratches etc, that might be an option if the overall colour is not to your liking, you can easily bling it up a bit. 😊 JP Few pics of my experiences and a specimen found by a tester that weighs 100 grams (easy 2 ounces of metal inside) dug at 2 feet. Also note the high voltage power lines in the 3rd pic. Friends face redacted out of respect to his privacy.
  16. So you won’t return it to a service centre because they’re a camera shop and therefore don’t know as much as you? A service centre set up by Minelab? Instead you would rather perpetually mention your perceived detector problems in every post you write on this forum and somehow that is going to get your undiagnosed detector fixed. There are a few things you can do to self diagnose, one is to swap coils with a mate (you’re lucky you have a mate who has a 6000), second try the other supplied coil, both these things help pinpoint where the issue lies (either coil or control box or even both). Try to find an area with minimal EMI, that sounds like a very hard thing to do in your country but that also points to the 6000 not being a good choice of machine for your chosen areas as it is well documented it does not like EMI and also explains the DD coil. All that delicious sensitivity and depth comes at a price unfortunately, but hey I have high Voltage power lines running through my areas here in Clermont and I have no issues with bad EMI unless I stray too close. As has been mentioned many times on this forum it is best to NOT use the inbuilt speaker (for a variety of reasons), if the inbuilt speaker is warbling away yet not a real problem with headphones then send the control box back for service/warranty. The original issue sounded like a battery seating problem so looking back through the benefit of hind site you should have returned your whole detector and let the supplier and Minelab deal with it. I think you mentioned you’d loaned your mates coil or him yours, but can’t recall which orientation so there is some potential information from that quarter (his coil on your machine). Lastly you have a toothache mate, go to a dentist its the only way to ACTUALLY deal with the ache/problem, if you have a good dealer he/she will go into bat for you and help you get the issues resolved which is then going to help you no end with your confidence. If after all that you’re still not happy as Steve has said here somewhere, “maybe the 6000 is just not for you”, thats OK too. JP
  17. Bigger coil equals more EMI not less. Bigger coil equals less Sensitivity not more. Bigger coil equals more Salt signal not less. Bigger coil equals more Weight not less. No doubt if you're unhappy with any of the above it'll be the 6000's fault. 🤷‍♂️
  18. Seriously Simon you’re comparing something you actually have with something you don’t (and YES we all get that you’re not happy with your 6000 because every time you post you’re constantly reminding us of how displeased you are 🥱 ). I for one am really looking forward to having a play with the Axiom when they become available, most likely I will actually buy one this time round whereas the ATX I didn’t due to the excess weight etc. Am I expecting the Axiom to attain the be-all & end-all of metal detectors? Get real!! It’s a metal detector!! 😂 Every detector I’ve ever owned has had a compromise in one way or another, I’m more interested in what it CAN do than what it CAN’T!! I already know what my Minelab machines can do because I’ve been doing it, I’ve learned how to get the best out of them through hundreds and hundreds of hours using them and very successfully I might add. I’m sure I can pretty damn quickly start getting the best out of an Axiom too, Steve and Gerry seemed to have managed it easily enough. 😉 Some of the gold I got in a few hours with my GPX6000 last session, I had to listen through all the shot gun pellets near the surface and focus on the edge of detection signals at depth, it paid off.
  19. I’ve kept out of discussions on this one till now, way too much click bait being thrown into the water over and over again so I’m just not going to bite especially on a device I know nothing about. My runs are on the board and so are the runs of the equipment I use so there is nothing to defend there AFAIC. And in spite of what gets said I am more than willing to try any detector if it raises my interest enough, I’ve done this so many times over the years. Axiom is no different, if its good then I’ll say its good theres no gag over my mouth regardless of my affiliations and I’m no social media wannabe who has to draw a crowd and lots of views to be considered an Xspurt!! Two things from my perspective on what I’ve seen on the Axiom so far; one is the form factor, now there are two very sensitive PI machines that are super light weight and ergonomically delightful (Axiom opinion is based on what I’m reading and seeing) The second is there is no mention of Difficult timings, I presume Normal timings only in 4 flavours. But I do see DD coils on the list so time will tell on how it goes up against the ML offerings using Difficult in our Australian variable soils. I know in the case of the ATX the DD coil was the best option in the ground I tested in and it worked pretty well. Now to expand on the Normal timings concerns, I found a couple thousand ounces or more with ML PIs using Normal timings all over Australia in the years before “Smooth”, I became adept at it and that skill set is still there, so Normal timings do not scare me away from the Axiom. Based on what I’m reading the Axiom is handling bad ground in a very nice way so till I actually use one or see one being used I’m happy to keep an open mind on that one. JP
  20. From my perspective the ATX showed potential if I maxed the Gain and swung carefully, the DD coil although touch sensitive at those Gain levels worked pretty well in our ground and did offer reasonably decent sensitivity to small gold, this aspect was the main driver behind the SDC2300 development. For mineralised Variable soils a DD coil is going to be needed unless Garrett have come up with some decent timings that can deal with variable mineralisation otherwise a DD coil is needed. If I had an ATX in a lightweight housing like the GPX6000 and the DD coil was not touch sensitive, was nice and light and around the 12” mark I’m sure there would be plenty of places where I could find gold and have fun. If they’ve improved the circuit even more with their new offering then even more fun for everyone looking for something different.
  21. I got the best performance with the ATX in my ground here in OZ with the standard DD. The ATX showed promise and could/did find gold even in hot ground, it took effort because of the weight and the need for max Gain but it could be done with care. It walked rings around the TDI. The point being Garrett are capable of making a pretty decent PI so this news is exciting.
  22. Africa is all about performance or using something cheap and simple like the GM1000 and everyone getting on a pick and shovel and hand digging everything. In other words these guys are not hobbiest they want as much gold as possible in a VERY competitive environment, to that end the GPZ7000 is selling like crazy over there. The detector is an actual investment that is expected to make them a return in as quick a time as possible as such the VERY best they can afford and depth on large gold is the order of the day. Garrett already do, its the ATX. I seriously doubt the klunky housing would effect them much if it actually performed as well as say a GPX5000. These are all grasping at straws comments that are not thought through. To break into the African market it needs to outperform whatever is performing right now which is the GPZ7000 or it needs to be very cheap and also have some performance, but needs to be more sensitive than the GM1000 VLF. However if they made an ergonomic and light weight reasonably priced PI for the hobbiest market then that would be something that could get some traction, but it has to be as light and nimble as the GPX6000 as that machine really has set the bar for what is achievable weight and ergonomics wise.
  23. Once again, YOUR thread is about a new Garrett prospecting detector. Anyone developing a PI has a LOT of catching up to do to increase their market share.
  24. You're kidding right 🤔 This is a thread about a new Garrett prospecting detector isn't it? Your cross pollinating two different markets/subjects to add weight to do what exactly? The gold detecting market would have to be over 90% Minelab right now. I think ML have every right to think "they're better" based on sales alone.
  25. I’ll bite, ML also shamelessly throw a lot of that gouge money into R&D, buckets and buckets of it.😲 (no offence meant to you jasong BTW). Competition is good though so lets see what Garret can do after all these years. JP
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