Running The Equinox 800 In All Metal Single Tone At The Beach?

[midalake]

6 minutes ago, Chase Goldman said:

It’s surprising that such an incremental increase in sensitivity could overcome the inherent raw depth loss in Beach 2 due to the lower transmit power (to increase black sand stability) associated with that mode.

Maybe it is my pod and coil combo?  I am not the only one though that has not noticed an advantage running Beach 1. It has been mentioned by others, on several forums.
There is hunting sensitivity, then enhancement sensitivity. If I am hunting in Beach 2 at 22 and find a difficult target, I do not have an issue going to 24 just to get a better look at that one target. I can usually move two points of sensitivity regardless of the conditions. Now take a combo of Beach 1 at 20 with the ability to 22. YES, there is a difference.

12 minutes ago, Chase Goldman said:

Dave, I’ve never known you to be someone who knowingly puts themselves at a settings “disadvantage” under real world conditions

correct. 

13 minutes ago, Chase Goldman said:

One thing I have never really understood is what you describe as a “double hit” as a telltale for 100% ferrous targets.  Does that happen with shallow/big ferrous due to coil edge sensitivity or what?

*I have no idea if this works in another mode than Beach 2.

Most of the ferrous at the beach is .50 cent size and less, also nails of all types and sizes.  

The double ring on ferrous happens at ALL depths, and for the deepest targets you get the one-sided signal breakdown more often.  High nonferrous targets can also double ring however these WILL lock out on the positive TID side making for easy diggers. ALL Nonferrous targets at depth will ONLY single ring. [you cannot even make them double ring by mistake] 

It is as simple as ding/pause/ding.  Coil control is critical, and one will pick up on the cadence needed soon enough, 

Reason:?  I am thinking without question the edges of the coil read each side of the ferrous targets. I am also guessing it has something to do with frequency weighting in Beach 2. 

Everyone needs to know [again] I have no idea if this works in any different mode than Beach2. 

[schoolofhardNox]

It seems that the two beach modes may differ in sensitivity increments. As an example, It may take beach 2,  4 number increases (say 20 - 24) to equal 2 increments in Beach 1 (say 20-22). That may be the reason you can bring beach 2 up two notches and not get any falsing or emi but if you try it on beach 1, it may get a bit unstable. Since we never really know what goes on and what parameters are set for each program, that is my guess on it. Kind of like a coarse vs fine tuning

[Chase Goldman]

2 hours ago, schoolofhardNox said:

It seems that the two beach modes may differ in sensitivity increments. As an example, It may take beach 2,  4 number increases (say 20 - 24) to equal 2 increments in Beach 1 (say 20-22). That may be the reason you can bring beach 2 up two notches and not get any falsing or emi but if you try it on beach 1, it may get a bit unstable. Since we never really know what goes on and what parameters are set for each program, that is my guess on it. Kind of like a coarse vs fine tuning

Possibly, except sensitivity is one of the "universal" settings and not tied to a particular mode.  Set sensitivity to a particular number in one mode and switch modes and the sensitivity setting does not change.  So I don't think the setting increments change at all based on mode, it's simply a matter of how stable the mode is for the given environmental conditions that affects the sensitivity setting "breakpoint" where the mode becomes less stable.

[midalake]

7 hours ago, Chase Goldman said:

it's simply a matter of how stable the mode is for the given environmental conditions that affects the sensitivity setting "breakpoint" where the mode becomes less stable.

Yes of course, and to add to schoolofhardnox thougths. My example was one of my own real-world experiences where I cannot hunt Beach 1 at the same sensitivity as Beach2. 
I fought this for a while in my own head, and conferred with a few experts even getting an opinion from Dankowski. 
Then after some time on my primary beach, it was clear to me that if I could run Beach2 two sensitivity points higher than Beach1 I was better off. At least where I was standing. 

[Bill (S. CA)]

14 hours ago, midalake said:

Maybe it is my pod and coil combo?  I am not the only one though that has not noticed an advantage running Beach 1. It has been mentioned by others, on several forums.
There is hunting sensitivity, then enhancement sensitivity. If I am hunting in Beach 2 at 22 and find a difficult target, I do not have an issue going to 24 just to get a better look at that one target. I can usually move two points of sensitivity regardless of the conditions. Now take a combo of Beach 1 at 20 with the ability to 22. YES, there is a difference.

correct. 

*I have no idea if this works in another mode than Beach 2.

Most of the ferrous at the beach is .50 cent size and less, also nails of all types and sizes.  

The double ring on ferrous happens at ALL depths, and for the deepest targets you get the one-sided signal breakdown more often.  High nonferrous targets can also double ring however these WILL lock out on the positive TID side making for easy diggers. ALL Nonferrous targets at depth will ONLY single ring. [you cannot even make them double ring by mistake] 

It is as simple as ding/pause/ding.  Coil control is critical, and one will pick up on the cadence needed soon enough, 

Reason:?  I am thinking without question the edges of the coil read each side of the ferrous targets. I am also guessing it has something to do with frequency weighting in Beach 2. 

Everyone needs to know [again] I have no idea if this works in any different mode than Beach2. 

This has really become a fascinating discussion.  For midalake, is the "double ring" you speak of the "ding/pause/ding" that you mention?  In other words, you get a "ding" then a brief pause followed by another "ding?"  I'm having a bit of a hard time visualizing this.  I know it's asking a lot, but if you have a short video of this phenomenon you could post it would be very helpful.

As to Beach 2, I like others, have avoided using it due to the diminished transmit power.  But your results certainly indicate that this is flawed thinking.  I am genuinely excited to try this but of course am stuck at work and have to wait...darn it...

[F350Platinum]

I've been intrigued with this discussion, and took my 600 with Coiltek 10x5 to my small local beach yesterday, I visit this beach every week and have cleared it of most junk and good targets, any I find will be fresh. 

It's only about the length of a football field and a third as wide so it's a great place to fully cover. I used Beach 1 as Park 1 is somewhat squirrelly , I don't feel Beach 2 is necessary until I get near or in the water which is brackish. Beach 1 gets unstable the second the water is in proximity.

I ground balanced (0 here), set sensitivity to 23, and F2 to 0, although I much prefer 3 because it helps reject bottle caps, and appears to "straighten" out other iron. Recovery speed 2. There is a little bit of black sand here but it doesn't interfere much and I don't mind hearing some noise, this place is quiet but for the small waves. The machine was very quiet and stable, there is no EMI here. Now and again I will hear a blip from my cell phone, as signal here is only 1 bar.

An aside thought: I did a chart a long time ago (it's probably gone) using FE and F2 on a bracelet with a steel chain and brass plate. F2=3 (max) has proven time and again to be the most reliable setting for enhancing iron tones but not blowing out non-ferrous when iron is present. It's killer on bottle caps.

However, I used F2=0. I set number of tones to 1. Personal preference is 5 but that's because I like to push coin signals higher. Even 2 tones (ferrous and non-ferrous) isn't comfortable, I'd rather have a mid tone for other crap like aluminum. On the 600 I get 1,2,5, and I think 50 ? I'd go insane at 50.

I always run the 600 in all metal (horseshoe mode), so I wouldn't know if I'm losing depth not using it, I've long suspected that any added discrimination may affect swing and ID accuracy.

I wanted to see if depth was improved, and to try out the concepts mentioned for Beach 2, but in Beach 1. Still too many jellyfish in the water. ?

Depth sure wasn't a problem, I was hitting targets 10" + down, including an elusive "32" in one spot that I can dig a 2' crater and still not find. The water under the sand makes it difficult to get to. Here is an example of depth higher on the beach:

Iron blob at the bottom of the photo. There's at least 2" more sand above the Pinpointer.

What I found in Beach 1 was that 100% of the targets that gave any iron indication were iron, from fishhooks to nails and screws to unrecognizable large blobs of iron. A 360 inspection was valuable, as there might be an angle that only produced a positive number ID and tone, but the end result was always the same, if I heard iron it was iron. There is nothing but iron left here.

This one was over a foot deep, should have photographed the hole. It's about the size of a small toy cap gun butt. Photo would have been crap anyway, the water kept filling in.

Got a lot more iron objects out of this place, I dug anything that even produced a tone but no ID.

Next time I'll try using Beach 2 to see if there is any depth improvement over Beach 1. I really like doing tests in the wild, and this place is pretty much a terrific test area, but it's east coast brackish, not salt. If I find anything deeper I'd be surprised, and hope to be. ? Any questions, comments and abuse are welcome ? Should I bury some gold here? ? There are no rings, no deep coins, nothing now just iron.

I did get a fresh penny drop and a couple of bottle caps and small pull tab bits. Next to nothing.

[Badger-NH]

The only way to confirm an increase in depth is by burying some targets at precise depths and checking them using single tone and 5 tone. 

 

[GB_Amateur]

50 minutes ago, F350Platinum said:

What I found in Beach 1 was that 100% of the targets that gave any iron indication were iron, from fishhooks to nails and screws to unrecognizable large blobs of iron.

I wonder if this is due to the fact that the soil (err, sand) is extremely low to even void of iron minerals.  You did mention there is a bit of black sand.  Is that only in certain spots or homogenous (equal concentrations everywhere)?

(As a side note, I constantly get confused with the different scale used in Iron Bias and Recovery Speed between the 600 and 800.  Well, I'm getting better at it because when I see "Recovery Speed of 2" it shocks me into realization.  ?)

[midalake]

1 hour ago, Bill (S. CA) said:

This has really become a fascinating discussion.  For midalake, is the "double ring" you speak of the "ding/pause/ding" that you mention?  In other words, you get a "ding" then a brief pause followed by another "ding?"  I'm having a bit of a hard time visualizing this.

Well my Equinox is 2500 miles away in Mexico.
You do not have to be on a beach to duplicate this!  You get home from work, grab any nail/screw put it on the ground and take a slow swing at it, coil raised about 5".  At some point going around it you will hear a double ring. Many people might mistake this for two targets [but it is not] Also try like a 1/2" steel washer [not stainless]  

Beach2, IB[origional f-6 and recovery 6, Tracking GB, 1 tone, Horseshoe mode on. 

PM me too if your having any other issues.