Is It Just My Impression? Coil Impact

[Jeff McClendon]

1 hour ago, kac said:

Got into the D2 clan late in the game only used the version before briefly then updated to 2.0. Had hell of a time trying to update the headphones because i was using a charging cable and not a data cable... who woulda thunk they would dumb down one of the wires in the spaghetti charging cluster.

Anyways no knock issues at all here and I run in a good range of soils and beaches. Seems to handle EMI well and can run it between 90-97 sensitivity in almost all the places I hunt. Have to say once set up it's one of the easiest machines I have used

Little off topic on this but one thing I am not fond of is the gold field mode. Seems the threshold is just a random background hum with no reaction to the ground and the vco is too quick and sparky so it is difficult to judge size and depth. Having tested it against my Gold Racer with stock coil the GR is better on tiny stuff and much more proportional to size and sound. I know the D2 doesn't have a true all metal mode but what they have I feel is unusable. Will have to fiddle around with Gold Field and maybe try it in 2 tone instead and fiddle around with the tone break.

Using the 9", typically don't run any discrimination here.

Goldfield can only be 2 tone with Disc IAR and Iron Volume turned on. It’s still VCO. The Audio Gain setting might help with proportional sizing. Using the High Square Audio version of VCO and adjusting the Equalizer and Reactivity might help too.

You also have the option of running the Mono mode at 40 kHz. Unlike the ORX in its coin modes, Deus 2 has the total iron discrimination range down to -6.4 so it will respond to rusted tin, etc. There are many more audio options using Mono.

The threshold on Deus 2 is just kind of there as a reference threshold. In Goldfield turn on Disc IAR, turn Iron Volume off, and turn up the threshold and it will null on most iron. I use the other “threshold” which is the sensitivity level based lively noise floor if I am running Deus 2 at the edge of instability. It is more dependable for me anyway especially using Goldfield.

Good Luck.

[kac]

Thanks.

But the threshold doesn't seem to fluctuate with the ground like all metal. Seems more like a self induced tinnitus with no relevance to hearing targets.

[raziel900]

20 minutes ago, kac said:

Thanks.

But the threshold doesn't seem to fluctuate with the ground like all metal. Seems more like a self induced tinnitus with no relevance to hearing targets.

I don't understand, with the 2.0 update they ruined the threshold again like at the beginning when it was just a sound without mutations?

[Jeff McClendon]

1 hour ago, raziel900 said:

I don't understand, with the 2.0 update they ruined the threshold again like at the beginning when it was just a sound without mutations?

The threshold tone only audibly changes using Pitch tones when there are non-ferrous notches set or iron discrimination is used with iron volume level set very low or off in all of the modes except Goldfield and Relic. In Goldfield and Relic, the threshold tone audibly changes when Disc IAR is set to 1 or above and iron volume level is set very low or off. 

So it's a reference threshold that changes on any target IDs that are rejected in the discrimination pattern. If the ground itself is generating target IDs and those target IDs are rejected, the threshold tone will audibly change.

I don't think Deus 2 threshold helps to amplify very small target audio responses. At least there is nothing about it being a "live" threshold in the manual. There is really very little information about the Threshold tone itself in the manual. There is a section about Tones and Threshold but XP is using Threshold as another word for Tone Breaks in that section of the manual.

I personally don't like to use it unless I have iron volume turned very low or off for some reason when using Relic or Goldfield. The faint background chatter is a better form of "live" threshold when I can hear it.

As far as I can remember, the threshold has been this way since the beginning and has not been "ruined" in V2.0.

[ColonelDan]

53 minutes ago, Jeff McClendon said:

I personally don't like to use it

Jeff,  I'm with you.  Never did like that constant humming in my ear but that's just a personal preference on my part.

[Jeff McClendon]

On 12/28/2023 at 4:43 PM, raziel900 said:

I also have the deus 2 since it came out and I hunt exclusively in dense vegetation the coil hits every branch, shrub or stone in very narrow spaces, for my hunt having a metal "chatter" is of no advantage because that chatter distracts me from possible deep small ancient European targets...Having said that, I was stopped for a few months due to the summer heat, I updated and noticed this chatter... harmful for my type of hunting

I asked you about your settings and you provided them.

I asked you to simply tap or hit your coil with your hand to see if maybe there was a problem with the coil itself. Since you are using the Sensitive program (me too) I thought that would be a simple way to diagnose a coil problem. At least for me, tapping the edge of the coil with my hand using the Sensitive program does not create coil knock audio responses.

You stated that you always ground balance and that your soil has very low mineralization. I have never experienced coil knock audio responses when using Deus 2 and the Sensitive program even with Ground Stabilization on 1, sensitivity on 95 and the mineralization meter on my Deus 2 is usually halfway to completely full=moderate to high mineralization. The soil around here ground balances between 84 and 89.

I definitely hear coil knock audio responses using the Goldfield program if I have not done several ground grab ground balances even with sensitivity on 90 unless I am using good coil control and there aren't lots of rocks and vegetation.

Do you have another coil to compare with your 9" coil?

If I was having the issues you are describing, I would get that coil checked by XP or at least communicate with them via their customer support Contact email service.

 

[raziel900]

It's not the live threshold of the old analogs, it's useless, changing the subject can someone tell me what you lose in terms of performance if you set the ground stabilizer to 3?

[Chase Goldman]

7 hours ago, raziel900 said:

It's not the live threshold of the old analogs, it's useless, changing the subject can someone tell me what you lose in terms of performance if you set the ground stabilizer to 3?

Well you’ve asked that question 3 times now in the thread, so apparently no one precisely knows the answer because it’s one of those “it depends” situations due to the number of variables involved.  I don’t know the EXACT performance decrement in 3 either, I just know there would be some decrement as it is just another ground filter.  Always keep mine at 2 if I’m using a mode that supports it at all - note that I mainly hunt in relic mode which does not have that setting in the GB menu.  If I am in mild ground, I usually don’t even bother ground balancing/ground grabbing in relic mode.  I notice that when I do a ground grab and the ground phase setting adjusts down from the default to match measured ground phase there is a slight increase in coil bump sensitivity and I have not really noticed a performance decrement in practice (note this is the opposite of what @Jeff McClendonobserved but he is adjusting GB from the default to actual in mineralized ground in his case vs. mild ground in my case, so I believe that is the reason for the different coil bump sensitivity with GB adjustment observations - but TBH I really don’t sweat it even when dealing with crop stubble because I can hear actual targets plainly by doing a re-swing, so I haven’t done any deep dive testing to fully characterize it).  For that reason, unless I am getting A LOT of ground feedback, I just leave GB at the default setting…in relic mode.  
 

Why don’t you just run a simple a/b test:  Place a test target in the ground near the typical or desired limit of detection depth in your soil with the detector Ground Balanced at stabilizer 2 and simply switch it to 3 to see how much the signal degrades, if at all.

[UKD2User]

While on the subject of Ground Stabilizer, and returning to the topic of 'ground shocks', as the D2 manual describes them, I wonder if people have been hearing physical impacts on the coil by, for example, stubble, because they have Ground Stab set at a value of 1, instead of the more usual 2.  Reading the manual, it becomes very clear that when the machine is sailing close to the wind (ground), with GS = 1,  the possiblity of noise from coil shocks/impacts is increased.

[Chase Goldman]

5 hours ago, UKD2User said:

While on the subject of Ground Stabilizer, and returning to the topic of 'ground shocks', as the D2 manual describes them, I wonder if people have been hearing physical impacts on the coil by, for example, stubble, because they have Ground Stab set at a value of 1, instead of the more usual 2.  Reading the manual, it becomes very clear that when the machine is sailing close to the wind (ground), with GS = 1,  the possiblity of noise from coil shocks/impacts is increased.

Good question but for me it happens to me in Relic mode which does not have the ground stabilizer setting and in other modes with stabilizer set at 2.  My hunting partner @F350Platinum has experienced increased coil bump sensitivity as well with V2.0 and he never runs Ground Stabilizer 1 because of the additional noise it introduces independent of coil bump sensitivity.  Bottom line, most of the people I personally know who are experiencing coil bump sensitivity in V2.0 with the GS set at 2, not because they have it set at 1.  But if I was having coil bump sensitivity issues, I agree that running GS at 1 is probably not a good idea.