Tom_in_CA

Luv Mexican reales ! Nice job.

Wow, 10 IH's in a pocket-spill . That's something that very few can ever claim !

Love those on-site live digs, and the on-site field evaluations. Thanx for bringing us along !! The age indicators just drip with cool-ness and history. Oh, and we have to divide Nevada in half *just to be fair*. 🙄 So from now on, you must stay east of the Battle mountain line. Ok ? And I promise to stay west of the Battle mountain line, eh ? 😘

thanx for sharing !

I'm not excluded from ANY area I choose. And no, I don't wear high heels 🤣

I like the in-situ fresh reveal pix. Those are the "come to papa" moments 🙂

Yeah yeah, yada yada. But you know I could have found it with my Explorer. Right ?? 🤪

good job.

This is sick. Just plain sick. I went on a 2-day trek, only to come back with a sickly V nickel. And you go and find a bust dime ! That's it, I'm planting a GPS device on your vehicle for sure now ! 😜

I love all the "amens" and "atteboys". But what strikes me as odd, is that some md'rs (not on this forum per se) will KNOCK THEMSELVES SILLY fretting over the nuances of whether a shovel is "metal or plastic". Or whether their digging is construed as "probing" vs "digging" (since, gasp, they found some prohibition about "dig"). And all such worrying about whether or not they're technically obeying all laws. Yet when you show them that they're disobeying their state's L&F laws, they READILY chuckle and say "too bad" or "who really cares" or "so what" . Why aren't they equally as worried and fretting about these laws, versus some silly ancillary language that *could* apply to hunting their local sandbox ? Strange.

Well at the current price of silver, let's hope you make it !

Good show ! Good pix. Love that beach-kissed charcoal grey silver 🙂

Glenn: Nice report !

Yeah, I've seen that , where someone who's lost a ring, wises up to the fact that there's geographic specific FB md'ing pages. And posting their plea for help. And most of us md'rs like to put our hobby to use, and don't mind helping. Posse hunting is fun, so ... no harm there. But I've never heard of the reverse scenario, where they lurk to see if someone posts show & tell, and them swoop in and say "that's mine". It's theoretically possible. But I just have never seen it happen. If anyone knows of a case of this "that's mine" scenario, let us know.

This has been mused many many times on many threads on md'ing forums. The supposed fear that if you post a pix of your bragging rights ring, then: What's to stop someone from saying "That's mine" ? After all, they now have a picture to describe, and a general location, and so forth. Your question is only a slight twist on that, in that you're asking about LEGITIMATE true L&F (where it truly IS the persons who is ID'ing it). Either way, the answer is : No. This has not been an issue. I have never heard of anyone lurking on forums (whether nefariously, or truly looking for their legit. lost ring), and then making a claim. Because if this were a threat, then it's certainly not stacking up to reality. Because a quick look down any md'ing forum's show & tell sections , and you see NO SHORTAGE of us md'rs posting our show & tell rings. Right ? And .... seriously now .... can anyone ever recall any of them that resulted in someone hopping on the forum and saying "That's mine" ? I can't recall any incidents of this. If someone can, please let us know. But in the absence of any cases, I'd say this is an un-founded fear. So go ahead and post away ! 😅

I have heard the claim that ARPA exempts coins. But not on the basis that you cite here. Ie.: that "because it's still legal tender...". That's a new one that I hadn't heard before. Very interesting. The typical notion that "coins and bullets are exempted", is there's verbiage that alludes to something like that. HOWEVER, I do not think that it follows through (if some archie wanted to make a stink). Because, in context of where they're pulling that from, the "exempted" coins and bullets are : Those that are not artifacts . Or something like that. In other words, the "coins and bullets that are exempted" are going to be : Those that are less than 50 yrs. old. Doh ! Here's the bottom line in all of this : NONE OF US wants to get into the debate of semantics, in the first place. Thus I will simply make sure I'm detecting when there's no prying eyes or busy bodies in the first place. And ... yes ... I never find old coins. Do you ? 🤔

Good post. "Cultural heritage" issues are always a part of any fed. or state land. So that, even if some form of federal or state land has no laws that forbid md'ing, yet you're right: It's going to be with the caveat that: As long as the items you're finding don't bump into cultural heritage issues. For example: One time I was detecting a NFS campground in the Sierra Nevadas, that dated back to the CCC days (1930s). A ranger truck *just happened* to drive past me. He stopped, rolled down his window, and began to tell me : "You can't metal detect". But after some casual conversation, he changed his tune and said : "You can detect, but if you find any coins 50 yrs. old or older, you need to turn them in to the ranger station" (that was 25+ miles away, blah blah). I replied "Ok". He left, and I continued detecting. And ... of course.... I did not find that 1920s walking half that day, nor the wheaties 🙄 State parks also invariably have some type of wording for cultural heritage, even when not *specifically* forbidding md'ing. And not sure about other counties, by my county (Monterey County) does have some boiler plate verbiage for our county parks. Not sure about city parks in CA. I highly doubt they go to the trouble. But if they do, it's simply "cut & paste" from other entities, and I highly doubt they *really* care if someone finds a 51 yr. old coin. In this hobby, it's no longer a matter of "Know and obey all laws". It's actually a matter of applying the "Does anyone really care ?" test of things. And "don't swat hornet's nests by asking silly questions" test of things. Yet, for some reason, some skittish md'rs will "fret themselves silly" as to whether or not a screwdriver constitutes "deface" or "dig", blah blah. If those persons were alerted to the myriad of things that *could* be construed to apply to their actions (L&F, disturbing earthworms, cultural heritage, alter deface, harvest/remove, etc...) they would immediately drop this hobby, and take up needlepoint.

What if the value of the 1800s coin exceeds the value cutoff mark for your state's L&F laws ? I know that some people will say that if the dime says "10c" on there, that the value is therefore 10c, right ? But consider this true story : There was a true story, from my area, where a nerdy loaner 4th grader kid took his dad's coin collection to school, for show & tell day (without his dad's knowledge or permission). And during recess, the loaner kid began to pass out the coins to the school kids, to "make friends". And those kids (who probably thought they were just play money), promptly went out into the school yard and lost most of them. A few months later, imagine the surprise of a local md'r, who was only plying the sandbox, at this modern school, for loose change, began to find coins from the 1800s ! After finding 4 or 5 such bust halves, trade dollars, etc...., He rationalized "perhaps they came in with the sand, since, no doubt, the sand comes from the beach" (this school was only a few miles from the beach). One day, after he and his buddy had gotten up to 8 or 10 such coins, an after school janitor spotted one of them out there. The janitor came out to tell them "Keep your eyes open for any super old coins, and let me know if you find any". When the md'r went to ask him : "Why ? What's up ?", the janitor told the md'r the story of the nerdy 4th grader. Ok, so you tell me : In-lieu of the CA L&F laws, do those coins belong to the lucky md'r ? Or to the dad whose coin collection they came out of ? If you were the dad, which side of this would you come down on ? And while you may think "well .... that's an exception, since the entire story had been made known to the md'r", then : What if the md'r had never met the janitor ? And the dad spotted his coins being sold on ebay. Who owns them know ? Was the md'r in violation of L&F laws, if he hadn't met the janitor ? Obviously the bust half is worth over $100, not .50c Interesting legal issues ! Not that any of us are going to change our behaviors, but .... interesting ramifications.

Technically, if the ring or piece of jewelry meets the cutoff valuation criteria for your state of Illinois L&F laws , then your friend is in violation. The law makes no provision for you to do your own repatriation attempt. It will merely say to turn it in to the police.

That's an interesting question. I suppose the test would have to done with a ring that has unique markings. And .... I wonder what would happen if they said "someone claimed it", and then I "sprung the trap" and told them it was just a made up story to test their honesty. Very interesting question.

Kac : I speculated that notion on a thread, for-this-topic before. And someone challenged that, saying : That I was presuming that the police are corrupt. They took offense to the notion, that a desk clerk at a police station could stoop so low. Ie.: that I was taking a very negative view of my fellow man. I assured him that I have a VERY HIGH view of LEO's. And that, yes, they're just normal dudes like us, and aren't necessarily corrupt. But that this scenario is a little bit different : Because .... think of it : That ring was NEVER YOURS IN THE FIRST PLACE ! You only "found" it. It's not yours. So how have you been harmed ?? You turned it in to the police knowing FULL WELL it might be claimed. And the police are under no obligation to tell you who claimed the ring. D/t privacy law issues. And odds are, that the vast majority of things being turned over to the police L&F , have no one coming back in 30 days to claim them. The evidence for this is that there are periodic police auctions, where this type stuff just gets auctioned off. So I'll bet that the cops are probably just assuming that you or I are probably not coming back in, in 30 days, to get it. So if the desk clerk calls his cousin Joey at the 29th day, and says : "Hey Joey, do you want a nice gold Rolex ? Just come down to the station and describe a Rolex with these features..." then, to a twisted way of thinking: In their minds, no one's been harmed. YES IT'S STILL WRONG, but ... not in the same fashion as taking your Rolex off of your nightstand, for example. Someone can rationalize that ... no one (certainly not you, since it was never yours in the first place), has been harmed. I've often thought about testing the theory, by taking my own wedding ring down to the police, and then coming back 30 days later to see if they still have it.

Haha, well .... sure .... your conscience might be smoothed knowing that the person hasn't suffered a loss (if indeed it was insured). HOWEVER : When an insurance Co. pays out to a policy holder, then , if the ring surfaces somewhere, then *technically* the ring now belongs to the insurance Co. Thus .... can you *really* sleep better at night ? 😘

Erik, I have studied this topic in-depth. It's an intriguing dilemma for an md'r who wants to "obey all laws". Basically it boils down to this : All 50 states have lost & found laws. They were born out of wandering cattle laws of the 1800s. The wording varies from state to state, but there is always a dollar valuation cutoff . So in CA, for instance, if you find something worth $100 or more, you are required to turn it into the police station. If no one claims it within 30 days, then you can come claim it. And if the police will run a "found" ad in a local newspaper. If you intend to claim the item, then you must pay the cost of publication for that classified ad. Other states might charge you a 'storage & handling' fee if you intend to come back for it in 30 days. The law makes no provision for how long YOU think an object was lost for. Ie.: even if you strongly suspect the ring has been lost for 100 yrs, makes no difference to the law. Because, otherwise .... gee .... everyone would twist it and say "Shucks, looks like this has been here a long time". And would simply flaunt the law. Also the law makes no provision for YOU to try your own repatriation attempt @ looking for the owner. Eg.: Pinning a note to a telephone poll, or using the CL lost & found section. It simply says to turn it in to the police. The law also doesn't say how the $100 valuation is arrived at. Ie.: Is this the intrinsic melt value ? If so, do you go by pawn shop offers ? Or a refiner who's paying 95% of spot ? Or do you go by the value when new in the jewelry store case ? For example: Is an I-phone worth $500, since that's what someone pays to get one ? Or is only worth .30c of intrinsic melt value (a bit of silicone, copper, plastic, etc...) ? So I asked a lawyer this question, of how to value an item, to see if it triggers the state's L&F laws. He thought for a moment and said: "Turn it in to the police, and let THEM decide how they want to value it". Doh ! Needless to say, no md'rs are keeping this law. A quick look at any md'ing forum's show & tell section, shows no shortage of md'rs posting their bragging rights beach rings, eh ? Ok, how many of them do you think "ran to the police station to turn them in " ? And it must not be a big deal to law enforcement either. Because otherwise they could simply monitor our forums, and go around busting people, eh ? But obviously, they're not. Thus basically : Do you want the technical legal answer ? Or do you want the realistic answer ? Do you want to be fully law-abiding ? Or are you going to "wink wink no-one-cares" on this particular one ? 🤪

What do you think is the advantage over the Deus ? Ie.: Goes deeper ? Un-masks around/through iron better ? Or ... ?

Chris, you are just knocking them out of the ball-park lately. And those buckles have become the "cat's meow" of desired/collectible finds , in collector circles lately. They, & the gun, are just dripping with history and are so cool to find. Congratz !