M8 & M15 Coils Price And Availability?

[phrunt]

24 minutes ago, Elijah said:

tell me colleagues, in which store is there a 15" coil for Manticore on sale?

It's not been made yet unfortunately, who knows when they will release it.

[UT Dave]

I'm not holding my breath for the coils to become available.  And I'm pessimistic about the cost when they do finally show up.

But I'm only a couple weeks out from starting to choose between my 800 with the 6" coil and the Manticore with the 11" coil on some types of sites and as of now, I think the Nox is not getting retired yet.

- Dave

[canslawhero]

it boggles the mind how Minelab releases the Mcore, then 900/700 and even Xterra Pro and yet 2 relatively simple tech coils are yet to be released....    These would be very popular, increasing Mcore usage and I would imagine them to be high profit margin items. I just don't get it Minelab. Myself, I want the small coil for jewellery hunting/light weight and will buy one as soon as it becomes available. Come on Minelab get off your proverbial asses...and make this happen.

[phrunt]

Minelab don't see the importance of coils.   To them they're nothing but problems, ears snapping off etc... they are just an annoyance, they make detectors!   The high profit margin on coils diminishes when you're replacing them regularly under warranty.  The Nox 900 already had its coils in existence so it was no effort for them, all they did is thicken up the ears a bit on the 11" stock coil as its the coil everyone has and most people use the most so it's the coil that potentially has the most failures, they've taken a gamble leaving the 15x12" coil the same design, it has the most potential for failure but perhaps it is also the least sold coil so less failures over all, I'm sure it's a numbers game to them.  The 6" would rarely break being such a small light coil.

The X-terra had all new coils made for it, but we don't know if they're going to be available at release yet, even still with the Manticore coils likely to cost not far off the price of the X-terra then surely the profit margin on the Manticore coils is going to be a lot higher than the profit margin on the X-terra, they just see releasing another detector as more important than some coils because they're obviously needing more sales in the lower end detectors with their bean counters seeing the competition have control of that area of the market.

I hope they've let Coiltek start whenever they want to on the aftermarket coils, not delayed them so they can't start for a year or two, if they were to bring their coils to the market first they can benefit from a bulk of the sales, although I'm sure Minelab would never allow that.

[Luis]

we are seeing a big price reduction in Minelab than we are not used to, we are seeing it in beginner detectors to compete with nokta as well as in the high end with the introduction of the axiom.  I don't know what will happen when Nokta presents its pulse detector.  Welcome be the competition

 

[GB_Amateur]

12 minutes ago, phrunt said:

...I'm sure it's a numbers game to (Codan/Minelab).

Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding!!!!  We can sit here in the cheap seats (with our prejudices, e.g. "I want coil ABC so it ought to be a no brainer that they make it yesterday") but I'm pretty sure they have people on the payroll whose sole job is to figure out pricing, distribution, etc. that will maximize their profits.  We may be right (i.e. the smart ones) and they may be wrong (i.e. the stupid ones) but I highly doubt that.

[Chase Goldman]

13 minutes ago, Luis said:

we are seeing a big price reduction in Minelab than we are not used to, we are seeing it in beginner detectors to compete with nokta as well as in the high end with the introduction of the axiom.  I don't know what will happen when Nokta presents its pulse detector.  Welcome be the competition

 

I have not seen this big ML price reduction of which you speak.  Maybe I am misinterpreting your post?

Yes, Nox 600/800 was a paradigm shift for ML as it brought relatively affordable, premium Simultaneous MF to the masses back in 2018. It was a game changer in terms of value (superior performance at reasonable cost).

However that really didn't set ML on a path to be a leader in affordable, capable detectors going forward despite increased pressure from competitors of late (Garrett, Nokta, XP, and now Quest).

The revamped Nox 700/900 (arguably what Nox should have been when released 5 years ago) was priced higher than the legacy Nox 600/800 and that was AFTER ML RAISED the price on the Nox 800 by $100US 4 years after release.   

The Manticore improves on some of Nox's features and adds a 2 D display but is the debateable incremental improvement in performance with a physical/ergonomic design equivalent to the Nox 900 worth the $600 premium over the Nox 900?

Now they are getting ready to release a multiple selectable frequency machine (Xterra Pro) that doesn't appear to be poised to come in under the SMF Nokta Legend price point.

I have not seen ANY ML answer to the Garrett Axiom and don't expect to any time soon since it's only been about a year plus since the GPX 6000 PI was released in the US at a price about $2K US more than the Axiom.

So really, I am not understanding your point.

[phrunt]

The heavy discounting thus far has been with the Gold Machines, even throwing in a free Nox or GM1000 or whatever it was with the sale, now the pricing feels falling off a cliff for the GPX 6000 since the Axioms release. 

The X-Terra Pro looks to be $269 USD, so I assume that's lower than the Legend, and more Simplex pricing, and if so it kills the Simplex in one hit, and then Nokta are releasing new Simplex models but nothing special there, bluetooth and 15kHz instead of 12kHz, so they'd have to lower the price even further to battle it out with the switching frequency X-Terra.  They have a model Simplex with no bluetooth at all which they'll end up doing significantly cheaper just to have the cheapest available.

https://bigboyshobbies.net/minelab-x-terra-pro

If you have a large customer base that are all annoyed by similar things about your products, there is something wrong.  They should do a survey of their customers, it might be an eye opener.   The problem is when in a situation like this brand loyalty diminishes, and if another option comes to market it becomes a pleasure to jump ship.  Competition is getting hot, had they have treated their customers better in the past few years they may have held onto far more customers as more options become available.  It's not just about taking money once for a sale, you want to keep them as customers in the future too.  When you had the best products available that was easy, if you're just part of a group with similar products not so much.

People now are already using the reasoning that the Nox 900 already has its coils available and we know their price so I'm more comfortable just buying a Nox 900 rather than a Manticore because of this, they're hindering sales by not having the coils available at release with no known date of release.  They can make all these new detectors and get them to market but they can't get a couple of coils to market?  They're just not a priority.

I love Minelab detectors, they're certainly the ones I use 80% of the time, I don't like how they run some areas of their business though and their flaws are made far more evident by another detector manufacturer that tries their hardest to engage and keep customers happy.

For now I'm waiting for my Manticore coils to be released, I will be buying them all, including any smaller aftermarket coil that Coiltek hopefully makes, and if Coiltek make a big coil like the 17x13" CTX coil and don't make it weigh the same as a concrete block I'd buy one of them too.

[Chase Goldman]

18 minutes ago, GB_Amateur said:

Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding!!!!  We can sit here in the cheap seats (with our prejudices, e.g. "I want coil ABC so it ought to be a no brainer that they make it yesterday") but I'm pretty sure they have people on the payroll whose sole job is to figure out pricing, distribution, etc. that will maximize their profits.  We may be right (i.e. the smart ones) and they may be wrong (i.e. the stupid ones) but I highly doubt that.

My idea was they (the bean counters) could have their cake and eat it too.  Have Coiltek take the investment burden of coil manufacture and aftermarket support off ML's hands and then ride the wave of increased Manticore sales resulting from people who are swayed by the aftermarket coil choices.  Also, the Coiltek 10x5 coil has been a smashing success from both a performance and sales perspective.  Coiltek had a lot of trouble keeping up with demand.  Don't understand why ML wouldn't want to aggressively get in a position to grab a piece of that action while the Manticore post-release hype and enthusiasm bubble is at its peak.